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Hornby A2/2 and A2/3 (2020 Range)


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Thanks all, I just wanted to pass on my experiences with my new 60512 Steady Aim. I`ve been following this tread and I expected to have a missing top lamp iron and the ash pan linkage floating around in the box. But what I was presented with was much worse - both smoke deflectors were detached - one was broke in two, the ejector pipe was not attached at the cab end, one of the steps from the front was detached but the worst damage was that the screw incert in the tender had been pulled out with screw still attached to the bar from the loco - but the 4 pin connection was still in place. So there was a far bit of damage but the box showed no signs of impact at all! Further to this I also received 35024 in the same packaging as part of the delivery from the same vendor with no damage what so ever! So I can only think that the damage 60512 was done when it was originally packaged up at the factory - as I said the box and all the internal packaging was in good condition with no sign of damage, and 35024 was in perfect condition.

Now I have repaired all of the damage and 60512 is run in and is looking good but I was not impressed with the amount of damage it had. 

I`ll go back and have a look at the box's again to see which factory it has come from.  

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I received my R3830 on 03FEB21.

It has always run very well - smooth, quiet and a good performer.

 

To be honest, despite the misgivings on colour and lining, it's consistently been a superb runner.

Mine has run several hours - perhaps 5 total.

 

Just a few words of caution to those not putting these on static display ...

A pin holding the linkage of the conjugated valve-gear to the piston slider has 'popped and dropped' ... absolutely no idea where.

I have contact the original suppliers - a certain shop formerly in Liverpool, still in the Merseyside area, quite well known ... and await their response.

 

Normal protocol would be to contact the seller, then perhaps Hornby - I await their response - initial email only just sent.

 

Al.

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On 10/04/2021 at 08:59, Rshakes3 said:

Thanks all, I just wanted to pass on my experiences with my new 60512 Steady Aim. I`ve been following this tread and I expected to have a missing top lamp iron and the ash pan linkage floating around in the box. But what I was presented with was much worse - both smoke deflectors were detached - one was broke in two, the ejector pipe was not attached at the cab end, one of the steps from the front was detached but the worst damage was that the screw incert in the tender had been pulled out with screw still attached to the bar from the loco - but the 4 pin connection was still in place. So there was a far bit of damage but the box showed no signs of impact at all! Further to this I also received 35024 in the same packaging as part of the delivery from the same vendor with no damage what so ever! So I can only think that the damage 60512 was done when it was originally packaged up at the factory - as I said the box and all the internal packaging was in good condition with no sign of damage, and 35024 was in perfect condition.

Now I have repaired all of the damage and 60512 is run in and is looking good but I was not impressed with the amount of damage it had. 

I`ll go back and have a look at the box's again to see which factory it has come from.  

 

I'm rather saddened by the number of instances of what looks like very poor handling and packing by ham-fisted people in the case of this and other examples of this model.

 

It clearly needs to go back, and I have had to return a few Hornby engines myself, various models, and once the initial disappointment has passed I have tended to think of it as an intrinsic part of buying models which are built to a lowish price, after all, one receives a good one eventually, or a refund.

 

There are a few posts of retailer opening quite large numbers of models before sale and having to reject many, even most of them, which suggests to me that many damaged models are fixed by buyers, or never really checked by buyers. Hornby certainly aren't saying how many returns they receive. We will never know the nature of the contractors in China, either.  

 

Good luck with your replacement (or refund if that's your preference) , it is certainly not a good buying experience.

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On 24/02/2021 at 23:52, Les1952 said:

 

 

Just to expand on this, the A4 was Walter K Wigham, and the driver Fred Dines- its regular driver.  The situation came about when a few too many Pacifics needed routine maintenance at the same time - piston and valve exams were mileage based and needed a couple of days away at Doncaster.  The version in the Peter Coster book (relater to PC by Peter Townend) said that he agreed to take the loco on strict condition he would have an A4 the next day, and asked on return to keep the A2 until his own A4 came back.  Close enough correlation.

 

There is another tale of an A2, which I can't find, relating a substitute from New England again where the driver had said "It's a fine engine but how do you keep it from trying to go over the fields" or similar.  I wish I could find the story - it will turn up at some stage- too many books and not enough hours in the day.....

 

Les

 

 

I think this was actually an A1 - Alcazar springs to mind. It was one that several experiments were done on to prevent the bogie 'hunting'.

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I recently returned my A2/3 back to Hornby. Bought it directly from them and was alarmed at the packaging.

 

The model was in a tight fitting box which was placed inside a much larger box, there was nothing in that larger box to prevent movement or absorb the shocks that would be encountered.

 

There was no fragile notices anywhere on the box. When Hornby contacted me they asked for delivery details etc which they haven't done in the past. I sent the model back in all the original packaging with delivery labels still on it. I however wrapped the model in bubble wrap to prevent any more transit damage.

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Thanks Rob, as you know it is a long way back to the UK from Oz and I`m very  happy with the repairs so I won`t be sending it back. But I have contacted the retailer just to give them a heads up - no issues with them at all.

But I am very happy with the loco  - it runs perfectly - and while I'm not a real Thompson fan I am 'beginning' to like the look of the 2/3. Mind you I do think the 1st 2 P2's really do look great!  

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Does anyone reckon that person(s) from Hornby read these posts. It does give a reasonably balanced opinion and useful feedback on their models.

If so, then surely a response from them about their forward plans to rectify issues re quality control and plans to make future models even better, such as a better colour, ease of maintenance and optional customer upgrade capability (further detailing, dcc, sound, lighting). There is a great deal that is excellent about these models (good runners for example), and I realise that as they become more detailed it is more difficult to get the right balance between ease of assembly and fragility.

I worked for many years on projects from the design phase to the installation and commissioning. The greatest improvements to next generations of designs was to get out there and encourage direct feedback from the customers (even if it was sometimes hard to bear). But this did lead to continuous improvement, improved satisfaction and confidence. I see so much experiecne and expertise on these RMWeb threads. Come on Hornby (and others) open up the listening doors.

David

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12 minutes ago, cbrooks122000 said:

I would imagine one of the big issues with Hornby and quality at the moment is the disjoint between design and production. I don't  know how Hornby handle this but when I worked in Design we had people flying all over the world to production plants to sort out issues. People will go on about video conferencing until the "cows come home", but generally there is no better way than actual face to face discussions and "on site" visits. For a start it is much easier to see body language and sadly tell if people are lying. Currently flights into China have probably been limited, so this didn't go on plus this appears to be a much more difficult model to make and Hornby have never made one before. There seems to be few issues with the new Merchant Navy, but basically this is just a retool of an existing design. Sadly as in my Company, Managers very rarely factor in costs involved in remote working (production and design in different locations) when making decisions to switch production to a remote country. Even the odd flight and accommodation can work out very expensive, which again very few managers budget for. 

Oh I forgot, then there is the "half day" working, China is on a different time zone to the UK so you lose about half a day. We used encounter this in our company dealing with the US design facility. 

 

There seems to be a few issues with the Merchant Navy really ?

The only issue I can readily identify are the front lamp angles, these are however easily rectified.

 

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51 minutes ago, cbrooks122000 said:

I actually said "There seems to be few issues with the new Merchant Navy" which in my speak means virtually none. I think Sam of Sam's Trains found a few minor ones but compared to the A2 ones, were insignificant. On my A2 the front smoke deflector was wonky and the seam at the top of the boiler was terrible and a couple of things fell off. Looking at all these posts it looks like I got let off lightly.  There again the Merchant Navy is a really easy model to built, simple valve gear, nice square shape body, easy to mould. So if they had messed that up there definitely would be no hope.

FYI, it is not a retool as you suggest.

The AS M/N was a newly tooled release back in 2017 and this version (R3632) is nothing more than another livery variation.

Hornby are due to release other variants with retooled short tenders as in the case of Belgian Marine and Ellerman Lines.

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Back to my popped rivet valve-gear issue, my supplier has said it should be no problem being a Warranty issue, as it's a mechanical thing, nothing to do with my 'weathering', which I mentioned clearly.

 

I have now approached Hornby, and await their response.

 

Al.

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1 hour ago, cbrooks122000 said:

My apologies, I just got the opinion that this was new as Hornby only seemed to have unrebuilt West Countries and Battle of Britains in their latest catalogues, Sam of Sam's Trains implied it was. I get the opinion that they retooled the motor as it now has a flywheel, which most of the 2017 locos didn't seem to have, but I don't own a 2017 one so I don't know.

No apologies necessary.

TBH, MNs are a minefield.

As for flywheels, all AS versions have a flywheel and have done so since they were announced in 2016.

I think you maybe confusing the M/N class with the AS West Country/BOB class, the tooling of which dates from 2001.

I wouldn't put too much credence on Sam Trains video presentations to be fair.

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4 hours ago, zr2498 said:

Does anyone reckon that person(s) from Hornby read these posts. ..

 

 Well if they do read this thread they could perhaps answer my question as to whether there should be a third set of sand pipes on the A2/3s.

 

I wrote to Hornby Customer Srvice 18 March and was then asked to direct my enquiry to Hornby Technical Department which I did on 24 March.

 

I have just reminded them today that I have not had a response - no acknolwedgement - no reply.  But then I am still waiting for replies from Scottish Power and HMRC.

 

Cheers Ray

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23 hours ago, Silver Sidelines said:

Well if they do read this thread they could perhaps answer my question as to whether there should be a third set of sand pipes on the A2/3s.

 

Hi Ray,

 

When I built my DJH A2/3 I also bought the appropriate Isinglass Drawing (4/389) which shows a sandpipe to the leading wheells and then one on each side of the centre wheels so yes three. You probably knew this anyway (plenty of photo's out their) but I thought I would confirm.

Dissapointing that Hornby is not more responsive but then some UK companies are very good at the talk but not the walk...

 

Kind regards,

 

Richard B

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It may have been mentioned already but A2/3 class R3832 LNER 500 'Edward Thompson' and R3833 LNER 514 'Chamossaire' are both listed as 'in stock' at Hornby.

 

Apologies if already known.

 

I look forward to seeing the LNER green. 

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7 hours ago, robmcg said:

It may have been mentioned already but A2/3 class R3832 LNER 500 'Edward Thompson' and R3833 LNER 514 'Chamossaire' are both listed as 'in stock' at Hornby.

 

Apologies if already known.

 

I look forward to seeing the LNER green. 

I am Interested to see the LNER green. Hornby doesn’t usually make a mess of it but these days, you never know.

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Received yesterday - no quality issues ( just noticed the raised middle section of the footplate , other side is perfect)  , ref the colour it’s a bit lighter than some of my other LNER loco’s but it is Ok as far as I’m concerned 

 

 

112E06E6-B8C9-434A-B994-0E45F06FBD41.jpeg

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Footplate bent
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Hi

 

This is an A2/3 but not one of Hornby's new additions, this was built as a conversion using a standard Bachmann A2 donor locomotive and fitted with special etched brass and resin parts provided by Graeme King.

 

At the time long before Hornby decided to mass produce Thompson's A2/2's and A2/3's as RTR models these were the only other option available apart from metal kits to obtain a Thompson Pacific and these conversions would set you back at least three times the cost of Hornby's latest creations.

 

Regards

 

David

60511_IMG_4247B.jpg

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DIY use of the Resin and etched conversion parts on a suitably sourced Bachmann A2 wouldn't cost nearly that much. Only if you price in professional construction time does the cost soar. The full metal kits plus wheels motor etc. to build the whole lot might well be as expensive as you suggest though.

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25 minutes ago, gr.king said:

DIY use of the Resin and etched conversion parts on a suitably sourced Bachmann A2 wouldn't cost nearly that much. Only if you price in professional construction time does the cost soar. The full metal kits plus wheels motor etc. to build the whole lot might well be as expensive as you suggest though.

Hi Graeme 

 

That's exactly what I was referring to if you had someone professionally build the locomotive for you, I didn’t make myself clear.

 

The cost of the the Bachmann Donor loco, your own parts plus all the other items such as transfers, nameplates, shed plates etc alone were over £200

without all the necessary Labour costs.

 

Regards

 

David 

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On 05/04/2021 at 18:20, richard.h said:

I have been following this topic with interest as I waited for my Locos to make their way through the tortuous Spanish Postal System (Post Brexit)

 The first arrived yesterday and what a difference in colour, the green is like no other loco on the layout.

 

IMG_3859.JPG.2e247e128643d7ca46d94ff92945b809.JPG

 

Here is Sun Castle next to my renamed and weathered Velocity, it is going to take quite a bit of work to get it to a similar condition.

 

The small piece on the card was loose in the bottom of the packaging can someone tell me where it fits on the Loco.

 

I recently posted this photo of my new loco  and remarked on the difference in colour compared to the normal BR Loco Green. I have now had a go at weathering it and started by giving the bodywork a light spray of weathered black with a touch of Brunswick Green added to tone down the colour, keeping fingers crossed that I didn't over-paint the lining.

 

195071888_IMG_3875(2).JPG.85817931a839ab01193920a0e891979a.JPG

 

I then continued with a general weathering, including Smoke Black along the boiler top, Frame Dirt to the loco and tender wheels.

 

1721154214_IMG_3887(2).JPG.3297017f6749bba6a25adb5caa114348.JPG

 

Rust paint and powders to the cylinders and coal bunker and tender chassis.

 

1869242276_IMG_3889(2).JPG.905ab88cdca3138ff104a5df205264ff.JPG

 

And, finally oil on the motion, coal in the tender and crew onboard.

 

Now she's ready for work

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35 minutes ago, richard.h said:

 

I recently posted this photo of my new loco  and remarked on the difference in colour compared to the normal BR Loco Green. I have now had a go at weathering it and started by giving the bodywork a light spray of weathered black with a touch of Brunswick Green added to tone down the colour, keeping fingers crossed that I didn't over-paint the lining.

 

195071888_IMG_3875(2).JPG.85817931a839ab01193920a0e891979a.JPG

 

I then continued with a general weathering, including Smoke Black along the boiler top, Frame Dirt to the loco and tender wheels.

 

1721154214_IMG_3887(2).JPG.3297017f6749bba6a25adb5caa114348.JPG

 

Rust paint and powders to the cylinders and coal bunker and tender chassis.

 

1869242276_IMG_3889(2).JPG.905ab88cdca3138ff104a5df205264ff.JPG

 

And, finally oil on the motion, coal in the tender and crew onboard.

 

Now she's ready for work

Looking like you've captured the look of a well used loco very well without  bein too heavy.

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