hornby 2020 Hornby A2/2 and A2/3 (2020 Range)

[Captain_Mumbles]

2 hours ago, davidw said:

No. The A2/2s never had big deflectors. Big deflectors were present on the A1/1, A2/1 and A2/3. 

If you're referring to the A2/1 then the Hornby  model is not the best starting point. The earlier A2/2 pre BR period had different running plate  smoke box lengths and other details differences. 

To examine this carefully isinglass produce 4mm drawings that detail the differences

What I meant was, if I want to make an A2/2 in apple green, LNER, would the Hornby A2/2 with an A4 cab be a close representation? Just from what was said about the Hornby model not being a version that could be back dated to that livery, because the cab is not the right type.

Whew, hopefully I am explaining that correctly.

Edited September 24, 2021 by Captain_Mumbles
grammar

[davidw]

No I don't think it would. Other than the cab area there's other significant differences

[landscapes]

1 hour ago, Captain_Mumbles said:

What I meant was, if I want to make an A2/2 in apple green, LNER, would the Hornby A2/2 with an A4 cab be a close representation? Just from what was said about the Hornby model not being a version that could be back dated to that livery, because the cab is not the right type.

Whew, hopefully I am explaining that correctly.

Hi

 

You could try redirecting your query to Tony Wright’s “Wright Writes blog.

 

There is not much that Tony does not know about the details of Thompson’s Pacific’s, he would probably be able to confirm what is required to achieve the model you want.

 

Regards

 

David 

[Captain_Mumbles]

OKay will try that. Cheers.

 

[gr.king]

On 24/09/2021 at 11:49, davidw said:

No I don't think it would. Other than the cab area there's other significant differences

 Such as the whole shape and surface details of the different boiler, along with the position of the S-curve in the running plate compared to the lower front of the firebox???

[davidw]

36 minutes ago, gr.king said:

 Such as the whole shape and surface details of the different boiler, along with the position of the S-curve in the running plate compared to the lower front of the firebox???

It's a long list.

[Captain_Mumbles]

On 26/09/2021 at 23:16, gr.king said:

 Such as the whole shape and surface details of the different boiler, along with the position of the S-curve in the running plate compared to the lower front of the firebox???

I guess this means no!

Sounds like a large job, I wonder which locomotive would even have a boiler close enough with which to base it on.

I am just going to resign to the fact I probably wont do it.

I still want the A2/3, though. These Hornby A2's a re beautiful models in my opinion.

Edited October 3, 2021 by Captain_Mumbles

[72A]

Hello, I wonder if anyone can help with something I've been drawing a blank on so far? None of Hornby's Thompson Pacifics have a NEM pocket in the front bogie - is it possible to swap the stock bogie out for one that does have a NEM pocket? (In real life, did the A2s 'share' bogies with any other classes?) Thanks in advance for any advice.

[Hilux5972]

19 hours ago, 72A said:

Hello, I wonder if anyone can help with something I've been drawing a blank on so far? None of Hornby's Thompson Pacifics have a NEM pocket in the front bogie - is it possible to swap the stock bogie out for one that does have a NEM pocket? (In real life, did the A2s 'share' bogies with any other classes?) Thanks in advance for any advice.

It’s the same with the A3 and A4. Mainline express engines didn’t often spend time going backwards. 

[No Decorum]

On 06/10/2021 at 21:36, 72A said:

Hello, I wonder if anyone can help with something I've been drawing a blank on so far? None of Hornby's Thompson Pacifics have a NEM pocket in the front bogie - is it possible to swap the stock bogie out for one that does have a NEM pocket? (In real life, did the A2s 'share' bogies with any other classes?) Thanks in advance for any advice.

If I recall correctly, the Thompson A2s was based on the bogie of the B17, a much smaller machine. As a result, the Thompsons were inclined to yaw. The Peppercorn A2s which followed were even worse, probably due to the shorter wheelbase. The side-control springing was strengthened, I think three times, before the problem was solved. The Peppercorn A1s were even worse because they travelled at higher speeds and the solution was the same.

 

Curiously, the LNER designers thought that the yawing was due to the large gap between the bogie and the leading driving wheels, so they reduced it. It must have been a shock when they realised that they had made the problem worse.

[MikeParkin65]

17 hours ago, Hilux5972 said:

It’s the same with the A3 and A4. Mainline express engines didn’t often spend time going backwards. 

True but they were sometimes piloted and were often coupled up in 'convoys' for station to shed moves to save paths. So whilst I wouldnt use a front coupling on a Pacific myself I can imagine scenerios where a modeller might want one for operational purposes.

[Tony Wright]

18 minutes ago, No Decorum said:

If I recall correctly, the Thompson A2s was based on the bogie of the B17, a much smaller machine. As a result, the Thompsons were inclined to yaw. The Peppercorn A2s which followed were even worse, probably due to the shorter wheelbase. The side-control springing was strengthened, I think three times, before the problem was solved. The Peppercorn A1s were even worse because they travelled at higher speeds and the solution was the same.

 

Curiously, the LNER designers thought that the yawing was due to the large gap between the bogie and the leading driving wheels, so they reduced it. It must have been a shock when they realised that they had made the problem worse.

The Thompson Pacifics inherited the B1 bogie design; which was fine for a mixed traffic 4-6-0, but not for a much heavier engine. 

 

As you suggest, the yawing was put down to the bogie's further-forward position, and the Peppercorn Pacifics rode badly as well, because of the unsuitable bogie.

 

60136 was experimentally fitted with an A4 bogie arrangement (where the weight was carried differently), and (guess what?) it then rode like an A4. Steam's life was coming to an end, so  no other A1s were so treated.

 

It seems odd, knowing that Gresley's team had designed Pacifics which rode superbly, his successors should try to reinvent things which had been proven to work very well. 

 

Regards,

 

Tony. 

[72A]

Thanks for your input on my questions everyone. Based on that, I'll let another payday come around and take the plunge on A2/2 'Cock o' The North' after all (gently: a cabside door pinged off while we were inspecting one in Cheltenham Model Centre...)

[NDN]

Has anyone heard anything about the replacement bodies for the A2s Hornby are supposedly making? I've heard nothing for months and had no reply to my emails to Hornby Customer Care requesting an update.

[MikeParkin65]

Heads up  - most versions are currently available for £140 in the Kernow bargains section. I can live with the flat green at that price so despite what I've said previously about this model I've bought the late crest version of the A2/3. Arrived promptly, well packed and entirely intact apart from the reversing lever  - an easy fix. Never seen one in real life but its strange that what looks distinctly ugly in photo's actually makes a handsome model. None of the poor quality issues mentioned up thread, apart from the detached reversing lever the only other obvious tweak required is to secure the right hand cab side to the running plate, another easy fix. Etched plates on order from Silver Tay and then it will be good to go :)

[Legend]

45 minutes ago, MikeParkin65 said:

Heads up  - most versions are currently available for £140 in the Kernow bargains section. I can live with the flat green at that price so despite what I've said previously about this model I've bought the late crest version of the A2/3. Arrived promptly, well packed and entirely intact apart from the reversing lever  - an easy fix. Never seen one in real life but its strange that what looks distinctly ugly in photo's actually makes a handsome model. None of the poor quality issues mentioned up thread, apart from the detached reversing lever the only other obvious tweak required is to secure the right hand cab side to the running plate, another easy fix. Etched plates on order from Silver Tay and then it will be good to go :)

 

You know this was a model I never thought I'd buy. I always thought the locos looked ungainly, but last year I got one from Amazon, can't remember the price, but it was cheap, and it's one of my most run locos over the last 18 months. The model looks very handsome, is a very smooth runner with good haulage capacity. 

[Black 5 Bear]

3 hours ago, MikeParkin65 said:

Heads up  - most versions are currently available for £140 in the Kernow bargains section. I can live with the flat green at that price so despite what I've said previously about this model I've bought the late crest version of the A2/3. Arrived promptly, well packed and entirely intact apart from the reversing lever  - an easy fix. Never seen one in real life but its strange that what looks distinctly ugly in photo's actually makes a handsome model. None of the poor quality issues mentioned up thread, apart from the detached reversing lever the only other obvious tweak required is to secure the right hand cab side to the running plate, another easy fix. Etched plates on order from Silver Tay and then it will be good to go :)

Mike,

Must admit, I'm also tempted by an A2/3.

I did succumb to a rebuilt E/C W1, which was also in Kernows sale for £149.99.

Thoroughly recommend the W1 in BR green livery!

Edited November 8, 2022 by Black 5 Bear

[Farang]

I have just bought Sun Castle from Kernow for £139.99. A good price and it ran straight out of the box, and no loose parts that I could see.

I have just ordered W1 60700 from KJB Models for £199.99 post free as I thought this is probably the lowest price I'll see. But knowing my luck............

[Ollie K]

Seen a few of these lurking in the bargains section for a while below £150 or even £140 - now Hattons are shifting their stock for under £110 a pop! Interesting how the LNER liveried locos didn't sell. The next LNER release of 'Airborne' is still advertised for pre-order at over twice the price...

 

No affiliation, but under £115 including postage for a 4-6-2 these days...

[davidw]

1 hour ago, OliverBytham said:

Seen a few of these lurking in the bargains section for a while below £150 or even £140 - now Hattons are shifting their stock for under £110 a pop! Interesting how the LNER liveried locos didn't sell. The next LNER release of 'Airborne' is still advertised for pre-order at over twice the price...

 

No affiliation, but under £115 including postage for a 4-6-2 these days...

I had R3830 cock of the north for £115.00 at TMC. Can't help feeling that although liked by some( my self included) perhaps they weren't great sellers. Which is a shame as another run with a better shade of BR green for the A2/3s may be remote.

 

[Capel]

Although nicely designed, the fit and finish issues may not have helped. At £115, I was willing to take a punt and make repairs to my A2/3 which arrived with quite a few loose and missing parts. If it were at the original price, I would have been less inclined to do so...

 

5 hours ago, davidw said:

I had R3830 cock of the north for £115.00 at TMC. Can't help feeling that although liked by some( my self included) perhaps they weren't great sellers. Which is a shame as another run with a better shade of BR green for the A2/3s may be remote.

 

 

[gr.king]

The chassis unit for this range of models visibly includes a separate cast weight above the leading coupled wheels, also extending back over the part of the chassis structure which I presume houses the gear train. I haven't yet had the opportunity to handle one of these chassis, and I'm curious to know whether this separable weight also serves to locate / retain the gears and/or the front of the motor. Does anybody who has removed this weight for any reason know whether it is necessary to keep those other components in place please?

[Hilux5972]

On 14/03/2023 at 09:42, gr.king said:

The chassis unit for this range of models visibly includes a separate cast weight above the leading coupled wheels, also extending back over the part of the chassis structure which I presume houses the gear train. I haven't yet had the opportunity to handle one of these chassis, and I'm curious to know whether this separable weight also serves to locate / retain the gears and/or the front of the motor. Does anybody who has removed this weight for any reason know whether it is necessary to keep those other components in place please?

I’m pretty sure that’s the case on any of the Castle or King models I have owned so I would imagine it’s the same with this class too. 

[gr.king]

The ideal thing, if that cast weight is also a necessity for gear/motor retention, would be to see a good image or two of what is revealed when the weight is removed. Has anybody been so adventurous as to remove the weight for any reason and taken any pictures? For the purpose I have in mind, such an A2/2 or A2/3 chassis would only be viable if there's scope if necessary for a simple alternative means of keeping the motor and gears in the correct location. It would be handy to be able to form some sort of impression before buying. If nothing more appears here, maybe I'll try an e-mail to nice Mr Kohler, who is ever-obliging if his presentation on TV is correct.

[micklner]

One was briefly shown being repaired re Valve Gear failure, on last mondays Hornby programme.