jcredfer Posted March 7, 2020 Share Posted March 7, 2020 40 minutes ago, Edwardian said: Second time lucky .... Thanks to Rails of Sheffield, my replacement Rocket set arrived this morning. Most carefully, not to say gingerly, I pushed from behind until the loco was in the position shown below, then I pulled it free using the clear film, held at each end. All wires present and correct this time. And she ran, smoothly and well, first time on the test track (albeit with coughing and noises off provided by my daughter who has been off school with sore throat etc). I am now a Much Happier Bunny. Nice video and a great result. good for Rails, too. I assume you have checked the temperature of the coughing lady. It would be sad for the Rocket to get infected and be sidelined, suffering from co- runner virus. Julian 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hroth Posted March 7, 2020 Share Posted March 7, 2020 2 minutes ago, jcredfer said: I assume you have checked the temperature of the coughing lady. My thought too... So long as it's a wet, "productive" cough she should be ok. Its dry coughs with headaches, sore throats and pains in the side you evidently have to be concerned about. 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stevelewis Posted March 7, 2020 Share Posted March 7, 2020 Totally off topic in our area there have been many instances of Children suffering from productivel Coughing episodes slightly raised temperature lack of appetite etc but recovery in around 7 days, It is a typical Childhood infection passed on at school and in the case of our youngest Grandchild at the local Playgroup.. 2 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Premium Compound2632 Posted March 7, 2020 RMweb Premium Share Posted March 7, 2020 2 hours ago, Stevelewis said: Totally off topic in our area there have been many instances of Children suffering from productivel Coughing episodes slightly raised temperature lack of appetite etc Send them back for a replacement or refund - or settle for the non-limited-edition version. 6 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Edwardian Posted March 8, 2020 Share Posted March 8, 2020 Glad to report that any apparent wheel sticking is an effect in the video and does not occur in reality. I feel I have learnt something from this. Having been fortunate to avoid faulty products in the past, while others have not, I now understand quite how disappointing it is. People likewise affected in the future will have my full sympathy and understanding. Given that my experience with this product was evidently not an isolated incident, the episode has also underscored my perception of Hornby's output; some really fine stuff, but the QC is sh.... Realistically, some less than perfect product will always slip through, but the reality these days is that even our "manufacturers" are mere commissioners, with less than full control over what is done in factories far, far away. It seems to be a function of this arrangement that, all too often, there is a gap between the aspirations a product has (and its commensurate price point) and the reality of what sometimes emerges. And, while this has the ability to frustrate and disappoint at times, we must accept that many fine models that could not otherwise be made, do manage to reach us! This is one such, and Hornby is to be highly commended. The hero of the story for me, however, is the retailer, who prudently kept a spare or two, so they could replace, in this instance, what Hornby might have been unable to. Alls well that ends well. 6 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
No Decorum Posted March 8, 2020 Share Posted March 8, 2020 3 hours ago, Edwardian said: Glad to report that any apparent wheel sticking is an effect in the video and does not occur in reality. I feel I have learnt something from this. Having been fortunate to avoid faulty products in the past, while others have not, I now understand quite how disappointing it is. People likewise affected in the future will have my full sympathy and understanding. Given that my experience with this product was evidently not an isolated incident, the episode has also underscored my perception of Hornby's output; some really fine stuff, but the QC is sh.... Realistically, some less than perfect product will always slip through, but the reality these days is that even our "manufacturers" are mere commissioners, with less than full control over what is done in factories far, far away. It seems to be a function of this arrangement that, all too often, there is a gap between the aspirations a product has (and its commensurate price point) and the reality of what sometimes emerges. And, while this has the ability to frustrate and disappoint at times, we must accept that many fine models that could not otherwise be made, do manage to reach us! This is one such, and Hornby is to be highly commended. The hero of the story for me, however, is the retailer, who prudently kept a spare or two, so they could replace, in this instance, what Hornby might have been unable to. Alls well that ends well. Glad it turned out well. After the collapse of Hornby’s sole supplier, Hornby took the wise step of using half a dozen or so different factories. However, it seems that it is difficult to keep an eye on them all. In particular (sorry to bang on about it) some factories seem to be able to produce decent Great Western and BR greens and other factories not. 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold The Stationmaster Posted March 8, 2020 RMweb Gold Share Posted March 8, 2020 4 hours ago, Edwardian said: Glad to report that any apparent wheel sticking is an effect in the video and does not occur in reality. I feel I have learnt something from this. Having been fortunate to avoid faulty products in the past, while others have not, I now understand quite how disappointing it is. People likewise affected in the future will have my full sympathy and understanding. Given that my experience with this product was evidently not an isolated incident, the episode has also underscored my perception of Hornby's output; some really fine stuff, but the QC is sh.... Realistically, some less than perfect product will always slip through, but the reality these days is that even our "manufacturers" are mere commissioners, with less than full control over what is done in factories far, far away. It seems to be a function of this arrangement that, all too often, there is a gap between the aspirations a product has (and its commensurate price point) and the reality of what sometimes emerges. And, while this has the ability to frustrate and disappoint at times, we must accept that many fine models that could not otherwise be made, do manage to reach us! This is one such, and Hornby is to be highly commended. The hero of the story for me, however, is the retailer, who prudently kept a spare or two, so they could replace, in this instance, what Hornby might have been unable to. Alls well that ends well. I think it begs the question of the extent to which - if at all - QC is applied by Hornby or its suppliers overseas to the products it sells. We know from the BRM video visit that Bachmann applies a QC process to each new delivery of models on a random sample basis. Random sampling is probably all we can expect, at the very most, at the UK end but it does seem to work although an individual bad 'un might still slip through. But do Hornby do that? After all the receipt and distribution of their products is handled by a third party warehousing. and logistics company who probably don't have the competency to check a model against spec in the way Bachmann does at Barwell or to test it. Maybe Hornby do take random sample from the warehouse from each batch of every model for testing similar to Bachmann's process and it would be interesting to learn if they do. We also know that with various commissioners they pay particular attention to making sure the model looks right and is correctly decorated and of course they test pre-production models (as do Hornby of course) but again I don't know if they do random sample QC on production models. 2 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Butler Henderson Posted March 8, 2020 Share Posted March 8, 2020 One thing that is puzzling me is how is anyone easily supposed to maintain the loco as its obviously not a shape readily placed upside down ; if it was supplied in "ice cube" packaging it would be quite simple to put in the packaging and then open the packaging upside down. Re the 2nd class coach decided on Tamiya Red Brown for the interior, depending on what photo is looked at it looks too dark or too light, or indeed what the actual light is at the time so probably is a pretty close match. 5 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold Ian Hargrave Posted March 8, 2020 RMweb Gold Share Posted March 8, 2020 1 hour ago, The Stationmaster said: I think it begs the question of the extent to which - if at all - QC is applied by Hornby or its suppliers overseas to the products it sells. We know from the BRM video visit that Bachmann applies a QC process to each new delivery of models on a random sample basis. Random sampling is probably all we can expect, at the very most, at the UK end but it does seem to work although an individual bad 'un might still slip through. But do Hornby do that? After all the receipt and distribution of their products is handled by a third party warehousing. and logistics company who probably don't have the competency to check a model against spec in the way Bachmann does at Barwell or to test it. Maybe Hornby do take random sample from the warehouse from each batch of every model for testing similar to Bachmann's process and it would be interesting to learn if they do. We also know that with various commissioners they pay particular attention to making sure the model looks right and is correctly decorated and of course they test pre-production models (as do Hornby of course) but again I don't know if they do random sample QC on production models. Here is the issue that never seems to go away. The difference between Bachmann and Hornby is that the former is tied to its own factory and the latter contracts out. This obviously has some bearing on the matter. Hornby have a systemic ( or so it might appear ) failure almost approaching a fatalistic acceptance of a culture that cannot or simply will not take constructive steps to remedy this.Their products are excellent in the main and we have a lot to be grateful for the radical and revolutionary progress they have bestowed upon the hobby in the last two decades,taking it from the mundane to the exquisite.That in itself has made them a victim of their own success. We now want more,we want it better and we want it now. In the midst of all this,the company has been forced to steer a course through traumatic fiscal and managerial difficulties to stay solvent. Cash flow is king.Factories need paying.Hornby need to sell to keep the flow on tap. Simply,we want it now ? OK ,we,Hornby need your cash but quick . QC,unfortunately gets in the way of the process and causes delay and expense which the company may decide isn’t economically viable in the current circumstances ( though it has to be said bluntly it was ever thus ). I am truly sorry for those who have suffered disappointment. But I also have sympathy for a company which had given us much and promises more and better.Matters like this damage Hornby’s reputation .This is not in any sense posted as an apologia .Sympathy is not an encouragement to continue with the status quo however.Is it not beyond the bounds of human ingenuity to devise a system which heads off at the pass the examples of shoddy work we have viewed here ? 4 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Butler Henderson Posted March 8, 2020 Share Posted March 8, 2020 Surely locos are individually test run at the factory which would make some of the problems that people have had seem odd in the extreme, unless a number of faulty models were mistakenly boxed for shipment by someone not realising they were faulty. Alternatively could it the quality sampling that Hornby themselves have done that has damaged the models given packaging through the extraction and refit. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold Ian Hargrave Posted March 8, 2020 RMweb Gold Share Posted March 8, 2020 49 minutes ago, Butler Henderson said: Surely locos are individually test run at the factory which would make some of the problems that people have had seem odd in the extreme, unless a number of faulty models were mistakenly boxed for shipment by someone not realising they were faulty. Alternatively could it the quality sampling that Hornby themselves have done that has damaged the models given packaging through the extraction and refit. This is just one individual product from one of a number (unquantifiable) sources. My point is that the problem is historic. Getting a good ‘un should not be serendipity. Having said that,to put in place an improved qc would in all probability involve a cost factor .That might not go down too well with the punters and could make Hornby vulnerable to attacks of price gripe more usually associated with its major competitor.Could be an unwinnable scenario ? Well hopefully not. 2 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
JSpencer Posted March 8, 2020 Share Posted March 8, 2020 1 hour ago, Ian Hargrave said: This is just one individual product from one of a number (unquantifiable) sources. My point is that the problem is historic. Getting a good ‘un should not be serendipity. Having said that,to put in place an improved qc would in all probability involve a cost factor .That might not go down too well with the punters and could make Hornby vulnerable to attacks of price gripe more usually associated with its major competitor.Could be an unwinnable scenario ? Well hopefully not. If they have several suppliers, if should be easy enough to figure out which one has poor QC by comparing the numbers of returns. 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Robin Brasher Posted March 8, 2020 Share Posted March 8, 2020 I think that the solution is for Hornby to keep 1 in 50 'Rockets' in reserve so it can replace any faulty ones. If none are faulty Hornby can sell them later. On pages 76 - 79 of the Hornby Magazine is the first review of the centenary 'Rocket' set. The maximum load they could test was three coaches as they could not get any more without buying another set. I wonder how many other magazines have been able to obtain a 'Rocket' set and what the point is of reviewing a model that has been sold out. On pages 44 -49 is an interview with Simon Kohler. Hornby has bought back the Tri-ang name which appears on the centenary 'Rocket' set. I think Hornby could also use the Tri-ang Railways name to re-brand the Railroad range. Hornby has lost the tooling for the original Tri-ang 'Rocket' set. 1 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold PaulRhB Posted March 8, 2020 RMweb Gold Share Posted March 8, 2020 (edited) 10 minutes ago, Robin Brasher said: I think that the solution is for Hornby to keep 1 in 50 'Rockets' in reserve so it can replace any faulty ones. If none are faulty Hornby can sell them later. Well they probably bargained on the standard sets to do that as they aren’t sold out and were only a couple of weeks behind. Indeed now they are holding them they might well have used them for that too. Quote what the point is of reviewing a model that has been sold out. Because the review applies to the standard sets too, apart from the box, and the actual model which is what 99% of us are most interested in Edited March 8, 2020 by PaulRhB 1 4 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold PaulRhB Posted March 8, 2020 RMweb Gold Share Posted March 8, 2020 3 hours ago, Butler Henderson said: Surely locos are individually test run at the factory which would make some of the problems that people have had seem odd in the extreme, But as you say the failure could have actually have happened in packaging so after the QC process. Generally and not related to BH’s quote above. If the wires were still hanging on by one strand they would have run fine and it could even have failed as the buyer extracted it as people were struggling. The mis-located motor obviously didn’t get a QC check but that’s what guarantees are for. It’s much cheaper to test a sample and deal with the odd return than the whole batch being fully tested. As the name suggests it’s a control sample and that’s normal in many industries from food, where you destroy the control sample, to fuel and everything else. Cars get through with faults despite them being driven onto transporters to get to the garage! These companies have procedures that are common throughout industry and as usual it’s just the faulty ones people shout about totally skewing the perception of faults I’ve had a Bachmann std 4 tank burn out on the first lap of a layout, LGB diesel arrive missing several detail parts, another LGB loco arrive with the 500g weight loose inside that had destroyed the electronics, Heljan Manning Wardles with wheels that split points and valve gear that jammed, Dapol N 73 that just didn’t work and an MMI loco that the traders advice was junk the electronics and got your own as they’re rubbish! All those locos were sorted and gave much enjoyment. 3 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold Ian Hargrave Posted March 8, 2020 RMweb Gold Share Posted March 8, 2020 2 hours ago, JSpencer said: If they have several suppliers, if should be easy enough to figure out which one has poor QC by comparing the numbers of returns. Depends upon the price quoted whether or not the risk is acceptable for future contracts ? We simply don’t know. 2 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Erixtar1992 Posted March 8, 2020 Share Posted March 8, 2020 On 06/03/2020 at 08:24, Pre Grouping fan said: There's someone on Facebook Alan Thompson/Valle View Model Railway has managed to do it. Think they managed to fit it all in the barrel which is quite impressive. Also think they added firebox flicker as well. They were going to fit a different speaker in the barrel with a 3d printed enclosure to make it sound better. Not sure if this link will work: Alans done a brilliant job of this, have seen it in person and it runs really nicely now that its all finished. the farmyard noises are funny when its going round. he also does sound/light fitted wickham trolleys which are hilarious, mental that he can make it all fit. 1 2 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
MGR Hooper! Posted March 9, 2020 Share Posted March 9, 2020 Postwoman dropped in today! "Rocket" is finally here. What a brilliant model. Top marks to Hornby for this amazing little masterpiece. So far the set is flawless. I have no issues with the contents inside. I have to say that my only complaint is that the packaging is a little too tight. Whilst I know this keeps the model well protected. Getting it out is an issue. The foam tray itself is tight inside the cardboard sleeve and so are the models inside. I'm scared of breaking them. But in saying that the model feels well built overall. Just posting a pic for now. If anyone wants additional pics, I'll be happy to post. 2 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Premium Legend Posted March 9, 2020 RMweb Premium Share Posted March 9, 2020 Regrettably mine on way back to Rails . It runs backwards , sort of , but all you can hear is motor humming with no movement when trying to go forward . Rails very good giving me post paid sticker to send back . I think they will send it to Hornby under manufacturers guarantee . Emailed tech services at Hornby a week ago . Nil response . Looks great . Just doesn’t work . Shame . Still in the scheme of current issues it’s no great problem 9 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold Worsdell forever Posted March 9, 2020 RMweb Gold Share Posted March 9, 2020 2 3 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Premium Compound2632 Posted March 9, 2020 RMweb Premium Share Posted March 9, 2020 I believe the first steam whistle was applied to a Leicester & Swannington locomotive but I hadn't previously known that prior to this the practice was to have a sheep on the footplate. 2 4 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hroth Posted March 9, 2020 Share Posted March 9, 2020 33 minutes ago, Compound2632 said: ...but I hadn't previously known that prior to this the practice was to have a sheep on the footplate. Perhaps the sheep was in the 4' and was run down due to the crew not keeping an adequate lookout? There should also have been an inhuman cry to depict the running down of poor Huskisson.... 2 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold adb968008 Posted March 10, 2020 RMweb Gold Share Posted March 10, 2020 (edited) 8 hours ago, Hroth said: Perhaps the sheep was in the 4' and was run down due to the crew not keeping an adequate lookout? There should also have been an inhuman cry to depict the running down of poor Huskisson.... I’m not sure I find this good taste.. sorry. Edited March 10, 2020 by adb968008 1 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
JaymzHatstand Posted March 10, 2020 Share Posted March 10, 2020 For a truly authentic sound, you need the 'sneezing' safety valve that sounds like an over excited cat chasing a bit of ribbon! It's one of those sounds that just resonates with early locos! Those on the Beamish waggonway have it, as does the NRM's replica Rocket. Cheers J 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Edwardian Posted March 10, 2020 Share Posted March 10, 2020 9 hours ago, Compound2632 said: I believe the first steam whistle was applied to a Leicester & Swannington locomotive but I hadn't previously known that prior to this the practice was to have a sheep on the footplate. Great to have sound, but the strangled animal cry before starting might begin to pale after a while. I would propose simply having Mr Stephenson shout "Mind yeut the wa!". 4 3 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
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