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Hornby Announce a Re-tooled Class 91 for 2020

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Hornby have announced that they'll be re-tooling the Class 91 for their 2020 range. To begin with there's 4 on offer:-

 

R3890 Class 91 002 "Durham Cathedral" in Intercity Swallow livery

https://www.Hornby.com/uk-en/shop/new-for-2020/br-class-91-bo-bo-91002-durham-cathedral-era-8.html

 

R3891 Class 91 118 "The Fusiliers" in LNER livery

https://www.Hornby.com/uk-en/shop/new-for-2020/lner-class-91-bo-bo-91118-the-fusiliers-era-11.html

 

R3892 Class 91 111 "For The Fallen" in VTEC livery

https://www.Hornby.com/uk-en/shop/new-for-2020/vtec-class-91-bo-bo-91111-for-the-fallen-era-10.html

 

R3893 Class 91 117 "Cancer Research UK" in GNER livery

https://www.Hornby.com/uk-en/shop/new-for-2020/gner-class-91-bo-bo-91117-cancer-research-uk-era-10.html

 

No re-tooled Mk.4 coaches and a Mk.4 DVT have been announced, but seeing as the Class 91s are due in December 2020 (and possibly a little later if delayed), there might just be a possibility that we'll see re-tooled Mk.4 coaches and a Mk.4 DVT in the 2021 range.

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I think I'll be keeping my order with Cavalex, though might just buy one of these just to compare, exciting year ahead.

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91002 for me. After the cracking job they made on the 87 (bar the pantograph), I am really looking forwards to this.

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Maybe it’s just me being cynical but to do just the Class 91 without the Mk IV stock to go with it makes me think this is a half hearted attempt to steal Cavalex’s thunder.  I also feel that Hornby’s version will be close but not be up to the same standard as Cavalex.  Just my opinion!

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3 hours ago, jools1959 said:

Maybe it’s just me being cynical but to do just the Class 91 without the Mk IV stock to go with it makes me think this is a half hearted attempt to steal Cavalex’s thunder.  I also feel that Hornby’s version will be close but not be up to the same standard as Cavalex.  Just my opinion!

How can they be stealing thunder when Hornby said in 2016 that they would do the class 91 after the class 87.

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Perhaps Hornby are trying to assess the situation regarding the Class 91.  Maybe announce the coaches in the mid-year range, as maybe they are still working on close couplings etc., like the Cavalex model is to offer.  Who knows.  Certainly, I think telling people about there plans for matching coaches and DVT would help promote sales.

 

I think the next big question is what Hornby propose to do with the Pantograph.  Scaled working as per the Bachmann Class 90, or Class 87 style offering.  If its the latter, then the Cavalex offering will have a distinct advantage.

 

I were thinking about it earlier.  A new Class 91 and Mk4's actually fits in to there product range quite well.  Apart from the Blue Pullman, all other expresses  - HST, Pendolino, IEP, 225's and even Eurostar and Brighton Belle are all in the Hornby portfolio.  I'm actually surprised that they have not bit the bullet and done a New Class 66 too.  I've always said that after doing the Class 60, not doing a Class 66 to the same standard has been their biggest mistake. 

 

Best Regards,

 

C.

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I have no doubt that if Hornby were not going to provide new mark fours and DVT in the future the old models will be in the range today with appropriate liveries

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5 hours ago, dogbox321 said:

I'm actually surprised that they have not bit the bullet and done a New Class 66 too.  I've always said that after doing the Class 60, not doing a Class 66 to the same standard has been their biggest mistake. 

 

This would be in direct competition with Hattons. By being in the Railroad range, the Hornby 66 fills a market for those wanting a cheaper alternative to Hattons' one.

 

As for stock to run with the 91; for those modelling swallow livery era, it initially ran with an HST set & HST DVT, all of which are in the 2020 announcements.

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9 hours ago, dogbox321 said:

Perhaps Hornby are trying to assess the situation regarding the Class 91.  Maybe announce the coaches in the mid-year range, as maybe they are still working on close couplings etc., like the Cavalex model is to offer.  Who knows.  Certainly, I think telling people about there plans for matching coaches and DVT would help promote sales.

 

I think the next big question is what Hornby propose to do with the Pantograph.  Scaled working as per the Bachmann Class 90, or Class 87 style offering.  If its the latter, then the Cavalex offering will have a distinct advantage.

 

I were thinking about it earlier.  A new Class 91 and Mk4's actually fits in to there product range quite well.  Apart from the Blue Pullman, all other expresses  - HST, Pendolino, IEP, 225's and even Eurostar and Brighton Belle are all in the Hornby portfolio.  I'm actually surprised that they have not bit the bullet and done a New Class 66 too.  I've always said that after doing the Class 60, not doing a Class 66 to the same standard has been their biggest mistake. 

 

Best Regards,

 

C.

 

I said similar on the Mk4's in another thread, not at least giving an intent on new Mk4's is a bit worrying and will not help promote sales. It makes me think that Hornby will just test the water on the loco first given the direct competition with Cavalex. However by not announcing the MK4 it will only put some off their product line and stay with Cavalex who have the full product line already announced (assuming there is no change there).

 

Apparently Hornby were pushed yesterday and would make no further statement. Hornby after all do have form for producing part formations in the past if they feel sales are low of the initial product - but this is a chicken and egg situation, only announcing part formations limits initial sales!

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Hatton's have posted a short video on the brand new Hornby Class 91 Electric Locomotive

 

 

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An 8-pin socket was mentioned. Unless this changes, it won't be able to provide switchable day/night lights or running with 1 end off, which are possible with the Bachmann 90.

I had hoped that the latter had introduced standards which will be adopted on all new models.

 

As for all the comments that the Cavalex 91 will be a great model: hopefully it will, but what have they done to earn this expectation?

We had high expectations for the Oxford Mk3A but when it arrived it had a few issues. I have even seen it described as 'not fit for purpose' which I felt was harsh.

I feel that stating expectations are fair, but comparing 1 against the other when neither are available is presumptuous.

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Sadly Hornby seems very stuck in the mud with using 8 pin sockets then just for comedy value fails to provide enough space for their own 8 pin decoder to actually fit.

 

Most likely the 91 will have switches on the bottom for day/night mode and turning off the tail lights, not much good when its pushing its train from the rear when you'd actually want the tail lights but not the headlights....

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5 hours ago, Pete the Elaner said:

An 8-pin socket was mentioned. Unless this changes, it won't be able to provide switchable day/night lights or running with 1 end off, which are possible with the Bachmann 90.

I had hoped that the latter had introduced standards which will be adopted on all new models.

 

As for all the comments that the Cavalex 91 will be a great model: hopefully it will, but what have they done to earn this expectation?

We had high expectations for the Oxford Mk3A but when it arrived it had a few issues. I have even seen it described as 'not fit for purpose' which I felt was harsh.

I feel that stating expectations are fair, but comparing 1 against the other when neither are available is presumptuous.

 

yeah, a bit of an odd one this, you have Bachmann, Accurascale and Cavalex all pushing the envelope with DCC functions and high detail electric locos and Hornby just seem to be content to produce mediocre models with only basic functionality in comparison.

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7 hours ago, Adamphillip said:

 

yeah, a bit of an odd one this, you have Bachmann, Accurascale and Cavalex all pushing the envelope with DCC functions and high detail electric locos and Hornby just seem to be content to produce mediocre models with only basic functionality in comparison.

I think Hornby are on the verge of binning off making chips or a complete redesign. No new tts this year only two models in the new 2020 range come dcc fitted, its leading up to something

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Here's a rendering of the Hornby InterCity Swallow Class 91

 

1013196829_HornbyInterCitySwallowClass91.jpg.78f0216e1ef9463dd2c251768f892380.jpg

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Let’s hope they don’t skimp on the pantograph this time around and re-use the terrible Class 87 pan!

 

It emphasises the ‘that’ll do’ attitude in an ever-more challenging marketplace where Bachmann and Accurascale are going the extra length to please customers, so fingers crossed! The rendering above looks superb so far, one would think they’d make a song and dance if they did have a genuinely good pantograph lined up, so it’s a little worrying at this stage!

 

Hopefully the Hornby staff that occasionally pop up in other threads will read this and take note please too..! 

To convey in a language they understand (steam locos!), developing  an AC electric without a decently-sprung pantograph in 2020 is like producing your new Hush Hush with poseable plastic non moving valve gear, i.e. kind of important to enthusiasts who like using the product for which it was intended! :lol:

 

Hornby managed decently-sprung metal pantographs in the 1980s, so given 30+ years have passed, be great if they can push their R&D team to truly impress us to show that Hornby are still a key player in D&E modelling before they gradually lose their crown to all the newcomers and innovators...setting the challenge guys, come and step up to the plate! :good_mini:

Edited by James Makin
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1 hour ago, James Makin said:

Let’s hope they don’t skimp on the pantograph this time around and re-use the terrible Class 87 pan!

 

It emphasises the ‘that’ll do’ attitude in an ever-more challenging marketplace where Bachmann and Accurascale are going the extra length to please customers, so fingers crossed! The rendering above looks superb so far, one would think they’d make a song and dance if they did have a genuinely good pantograph lined up, so it’s a little worrying at this stage!

 

Hopefully the Hornby staff that occasionally pop up in other threads will read this and take note please too..! 

To convey in a language they understand (steam locos!), developing  an AC electric without a decently-sprung pantograph in 2020 is like producing your new Hush Hush with poseable plastic non moving valve gear, i.e. kind of important to enthusiasts who like using the product for which it was intended! :lol:

 

Hornby managed decently-sprung metal pantographs in the 1980s, so given 30+ years have passed, be great if they can push their R&D team to truly impress us to show that Hornby are still a key player in D&E modelling before they gradually lose their crown to all the newcomers and innovators...setting the challenge guys, come and step up to the plate! :good_mini:

I can’t press the “agree” button multiple times so: I agree, I agree, I agree, I agree, I agree!

To give the people at Hornby their due, the mechanisms are usually very good and their main range models accurate but these features need to be built upon.

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2 minutes ago, No Decorum said:

I can’t press the “agree” button multiple times so: I agree, I agree, I agree, I agree, I agree!

To give the people at Hornby their due, the mechanisms are usually very good and their main range models accurate but these features need to be built upon.

I agree, I agree ,I agree 

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Wow that looks really nice upto now. Can't wait to get that running on my layout.

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Ahhhh another duplicate.

 

I’ll wait and see before ordering it.

 

I wish someone would duplicate a class 124 Transpenine

Meanwhile I’ve bought some s/h Mk4’s for under £20, they will keep me going for a bit.

Edited by adb968008
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9 hours ago, James Makin said:

Let’s hope they don’t skimp on the pantograph this time around and re-use the terrible Class 87 pan!

 

It emphasises the ‘that’ll do’ attitude in an ever-more challenging marketplace where Bachmann and Accurascale are going the extra length to please customers, so fingers crossed! The rendering above looks superb so far, one would think they’d make a song and dance if they did have a genuinely good pantograph lined up, so it’s a little worrying at this stage!

 

Hopefully the Hornby staff that occasionally pop up in other threads will read this and take note please too..! 

To convey in a language they understand (steam locos!), developing  an AC electric without a decently-sprung pantograph in 2020 is like producing your new Hush Hush with poseable plastic non moving valve gear, i.e. kind of important to enthusiasts who like using the product for which it was intended! :lol:

 

Hornby managed decently-sprung metal pantographs in the 1980s, so given 30+ years have passed, be great if they can push their R&D team to truly impress us to show that Hornby are still a key player in D&E modelling before they gradually lose their crown to all the newcomers and innovators...setting the challenge guys, come and step up to the plate! :good_mini:

 

@James Makin why not tag the person you're referring to? So you'll know for sure that they read it.

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As a 12 year old in 1988 I wrote to Hornby asking if their forthcoming class 91 – shown in the catalogue with an all white front end - would include a front coupling to allow for blunt end running. The answer was of course a no. I wonder if there’s an opportunity for the new model to include the facility? I appreciate BR’s original plans for the 91s to haul overnight parcels or freight trains (I think) with the blunt end leading never actually materialised but the number two cab has been pressed into service on a number of occasions since.

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8 hours ago, Electrostar said:

As a 12 year old in 1988 I wrote to Hornby asking if their forthcoming class 91 – shown in the catalogue with an all white front end - would include a front coupling to allow for blunt end running. The answer was of course a no. I wonder if there’s an opportunity for the new model to include the facility? I appreciate BR’s original plans for the 91s to haul overnight parcels or freight trains (I think) with the blunt end leading never actually materialised but the number two cab has been pressed into service on a number of occasions since.


Have a look at the image I shared above, the big cut-out on the front valance is probably your biggest clue and answer. 

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On 06/01/2020 at 19:50, Markn said:

91002 for me. After the cracking job they made on the 87 (bar the pantograph), I am really looking forwards to this.

The 87 is a very mixed bag. Looks the part for sure but internally it is a dog's dinner, lighting is bonkers and the DCC provision and sound provision is lamentable. There isn't even enough room for Hornby's own decoder (non sound) to fit. I hope they have learned lessons and learned to listen to people who know this time around?

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I fitted a lenz standard into mine, but yes I can't imagine there's much room for sound looking in there so good points, especially if they ever bring a tts out for it. 

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