Jump to content
47137

Useful Chassis for British H0 Loco and Railcar Projects

Recommended Posts

This post is simply a collation of chassis details, intended to help people making their models in 3.5 mm scale.

 

I have included 00 and H0 scale donors which I have used in my own models, other models I have to hand which look like they might be useful one day, and contributions from other members of the RMweb. I have omitted models which looked to me as though they ought to work with British outline H0 (like the Model Rail Sentinel) but which turned out to be too wide or tall, and too difficult to alter.

 

I expect there are other candidates, perhaps the Hornby Peckett or the Hornby L&Y pug, and I'm happy to revise the table to add other models or put right the almost inevitable mistakes.

 

- Richard.

 

1304955709_Screenshot2020-05-2510_14_18.png.ec6d794a9cb433f794488a5daac23367.png

 

Edited by 47137
Suggestions in subsequent posts to 25 May 2020
  • Informative/Useful 6

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

a good start.

 

Quite a few others.

Bachmann GE70 chassis , fits my Ford. The GE44 is probably also useful, and the GE45 (if you can find one) is one loco that ran in Britain. Then there is the Liliput fireless locos, in particular the 0-4-0, which does not look out of place on British layouts, and the motor/chassis is slim enough to fit in British HO bodies(I haveone in my GWR steam railmotor). Unfortunately the 0-6-0 version has a bulky motor fitted, making it difficult for smaller British locos. The Model Rail tram loco could probably be useful, but like the new Bachmann  J72 is a bit pricey if all you want is the chassis.

The main difficulty is not wheelbase etc but motor size. Even the L&Y 0-4-0 tank loco has this problem for some small locos. It only just fitted my L&y steam railmotor.

Tender locos present less of a problem as tender drive is an option . If a r2r bogie is not suitabe I am sure Mark at Locos n Stuff can supply a bespoke 3D printed one.

  • Like 1
  • Informative/Useful 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Pssssssst ............. if anyone is interested, over on Catawiki, there's what looks like an H0 Class 08 diesel shunter in NS colours made by Roco under bid at 45€ at the moment. To save you trawling all the pages, here's a link: https://www.catawiki.eu/l/33524149-roco-h0-43471-locomotive-diesel-serie-5-600-bakkie-hippel-en-couleurs-vertes-ns

 

Cheers,

 

Philip

  • Like 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
9 hours ago, rue_d_etropal said:

a good start.

 

Quite a few others.

Bachmann GE70 chassis , fits my Ford. The GE44 is probably also useful, and the GE45 (if you can find one) is one loco that ran in Britain. Then there is the Liliput fireless locos, in particular the 0-4-0, which does not look out of place on British layouts, and the motor/chassis is slim enough to fit in British HO bodies(I haveone in my GWR steam railmotor). Unfortunately the 0-6-0 version has a bulky motor fitted, making it difficult for smaller British locos. The Model Rail tram loco could probably be useful, but like the new Bachmann  J72 is a bit pricey if all you want is the chassis.

The main difficulty is not wheelbase etc but motor size. Even the L&Y 0-4-0 tank loco has this problem for some small locos. It only just fitted my L&y steam railmotor.

Tender locos present less of a problem as tender drive is an option . If a r2r bogie is not suitabe I am sure Mark at Locos n Stuff can supply a bespoke 3D printed one.

 

It is sensible to include wheelbase information so people can judge the suitability of a chassis before buying a model.

 

I've omitted the Model Rail tram because the wheels are 8-spoke and a bit too distinctive for general use. However the outside cylinders are commendably slim so I'll see if I can measure a friend's model. It is important with these to get a version without side skirts. The versions with skirts omit some of the valve gear, not enough room to fit everything in even in 00.

 

The GE70 chassis should go into the table - have anyone got the dimensions to hand? The Lima 00 Deltic ought to go in too because the bogies are H0 for the class 37 or 50. If anyone can think of other candidates do post them here or send me a PM. I will update the table next weekend.

 

- Richard.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

1692332108_tycoHOchassis1.jpg.64bef4d841725c8793a73a9472508b0b.jpg

 

These or assembled TYCO locos turn up often on US Ebay. also come as 0-8-0 0-6-0 and 2-6-0.

 

Wheel dia 15 mm, axle spacing 16.5 mm

 

Andy

  • Thanks 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I think it would be worthwhile to add chassis kits where we know they give us the wheelbase for a specific prototype, and we can be reasonably confident (if not convinced) the motor and gearbox will fit inside a 1:87 model.

 

For example, I have a fold-up chassis for a 4mm scale Ruston and Hornsby 48DS. Wheelbase is 21 mm, exactly the 6 feet of a BR class 02. This chassis was designed to build up with one driven axle (making a 1A so to speak) but if you added side rods it would become an 0-4-0.

 

Maybe we know of some others?

 

- Richard.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

This is a good initiative. But some of them (recent 00 locos) seem like a rather expensive way to go about it.

 

If we know that there is a small market (as few as 20) for a particular chassis, it should be possible to do it more cheaply by etching the frames and sourcing suitable wheels.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
5 hours ago, Joseph_Pestell said:

This is a good initiative. But some of them (recent 00 locos) seem like a rather expensive way to go about it.

 

If we know that there is a small market (as few as 20) for a particular chassis, it should be possible to do it more cheaply by etching the frames and sourcing suitable wheels.

 

Well - if a particular route seems expensive, there is no need to follow it. This is for the modeller to decide. 

 

The topic heading I chose is "Useful Chassis for British H0 Loco Projects" and I think this defines the purpose of the topic nicely: what is possible using what is already out there.

 

Anyone is free to design and etch their own chassis, and if they make it available for sale to the general public it can go into the table as a kit. A loco chassis might not get enough customers - a coach bogie with internal bearings and able to accept dummy sideframes might be a better bet to attract enough customers.

 

- Richard.

  • Like 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
12 minutes ago, 47137 said:

 

Well - if a particular route seems expensive, there is no need to follow it. This is for the modeller to decide. 

 

The topic heading I chose is "Useful Chassis for British H0 Loco Projects" and I think this defines the purpose of the topic nicely: what is possible using what is already out there.

 

Anyone is free to design and etch their own chassis, and if they make it available for sale to the general public it can go into the table as a kit. A loco chassis might not get enough customers - a coach bogie with internal bearings and able to accept dummy sideframes might be a better bet to attract enough customers.

 

- Richard.

 

Coach bogies would certainly be useful. And as you say, numbers needed would be rather greater which helps amortise the development costs.

 

Allen Doherty at Worsley may even have artwork already which could be easily adapted (re-scaled) if necessary. I think he even has some already for HO.

 

As I thought, Worsley Works already has 8'6" bogie frames available, the most common dimension. Just need someone to make a master for the dummy sideframes and get them cast: white metal or resin. Or newer tech: CNC milled or 3D printed.

Edited by Joseph_Pestell
Add

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
16 hours ago, Joseph_Pestell said:

 

Coach bogies would certainly be useful. And as you say, numbers needed would be rather greater which helps amortise the development costs.

 

Allen Doherty at Worsley may even have artwork already which could be easily adapted (re-scaled) if necessary. I think he even has some already for HO.

 

As I thought, Worsley Works already has 8'6" bogie frames available, the most common dimension. Just need someone to make a master for the dummy sideframes and get them cast: white metal or resin. Or newer tech: CNC milled or 3D printed.

 

If anyone here has managed to obtain a firm delivery date from this outfit, let alone a product from their extensive but apparently fictional catalogue, I'll buy you a beer!*

 

- Richard.

 

*Edit: offer limited to attempts to buy 1:87 scale items. The 7mm people can use whole sheets of brass.

Edited by 47137
Wallet damage limitation
  • Like 1
  • Agree 1
  • Informative/Useful 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
5 hours ago, 47137 said:

 

Edit: offer limited to attempts to buy 1:87 scale items. The 7mm people can use whole sheets of brass.

 

Perhaps we should send combined orders for 3.5 mm Worsley etches so they can use a full sheet?

 

(And that reminds me I want a couple of sets of the firm's Mk 1 suburban 57' coach sides to put on Playcraft coaches.)

Edited by Ian Simpson
Typo. Which is the posh name for poor typing.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
23 hours ago, 47137 said:

 

Well - if a particular route seems expensive, there is no need to follow it. This is for the modeller to decide. 

 

The topic heading I chose is "Useful Chassis for British H0 Loco Projects" and I think this defines the purpose of the topic nicely: what is possible using what is already out there.

 

Anyone is free to design and etch their own chassis, and if they make it available for sale to the general public it can go into the table as a kit. A loco chassis might not get enough customers - a coach bogie with internal bearings and able to accept dummy sideframes might be a better bet to attract enough customers.

 

- Richard.

I have done some bogies myself, namely Gresley ones, but have tended to find drawings for bogies are not so easy to find.

I have been thinking about loco chassis, as I have not been as impressed about the new J72 one as I hoped(that boiler base in particular),but it still might be best option for tank locos, when price comes down. For tender locos I would put motr in tender and use a dummy chassis inloco, and I don't think it would be that difficult to 3D print, but it would be basic. Just need to confirm size of holes fo axles/bearings. Bearings would be need as the nylon will wear down . It might be possible to design a basic version for tank locos but would need to adapt it to fit gears, It would be up to modeller to decide how and where to fit motor.

  • Informative/Useful 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
On 22/01/2020 at 07:24, Joseph_Pestell said:

 

Coach bogies would certainly be useful. And as you say, numbers needed would be rather greater which helps amortise the development costs.

 

Allen Doherty at Worsley may even have artwork already which could be easily adapted (re-scaled) if necessary. I think he even has some already for HO.

 

As I thought, Worsley Works already has 8'6" bogie frames available, the most common dimension. Just need someone to make a master for the dummy sideframes and get them cast: white metal or resin. Or newer tech: CNC milled or 3D printed.

 

890643323_superglidefamily-800.jpg.e7e660bbe0a8490c9c9a8af8cc99bfd8.jpg

 

I already make HO and 4mm inside frame coach bogies of various wheelbases. You can add 3D printed cosmetic frames to the outside.

 

Andy

  • Like 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
2 hours ago, Andy Reichert said:

 

890643323_superglidefamily-800.jpg.e7e660bbe0a8490c9c9a8af8cc99bfd8.jpg

 

I already make HO and 4mm inside frame coach bogies of various wheelbases. You can add 3D printed cosmetic frames to the outside.

 

Andy

 

Can these be had with more usual wheel profiles like RP-25?

 

Also, can you post a link to your web site? Maybe you should have a section on RMweb under "smaller suppliers".

 

- Richard.

  • Like 1
  • Agree 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Some years ago now but I had Bill Bedford produce a batch of his sprung bogie etches for me in 3.5mm scale.  I had one on the stand at Warley a few years back.

 

Tony

  • Like 1
  • Informative/Useful 2

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

It would be nice if the old Firedrake bogie castings could be re-run. I've just had a look at a pair of unmade Commonwealth bogies I have and they were quite nice castings.

  • Like 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
18 hours ago, HSB said:

It would be nice if the old Firedrake bogie castings could be re-run. I've just had a look at a pair of unmade Commonwealth bogies I have and they were quite nice castings.

 

The last time I found Firedrake online, their web site explained they had ceased trading so the proprietor could give full-time care to his wife. Looking today, they seem to have vanished altogether. If someone has a postal address, I would write to them and ask if I could buy the moulds / masters. They produced some appealing models, but finding this sort of thing secondhand is difficult, a bit of a lottery really.

 

- Richard.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

 

17 hours ago, 47137 said:

 

The last time I found Firedrake online, their web site explained they had ceased trading so the proprietor could give full-time care to his wife. Looking today, they seem to have vanished altogether. If someone has a postal address, I would write to them and ask if I could buy the moulds / masters. They produced some appealing models, but finding this sort of thing secondhand is difficult, a bit of a lottery really.

 

- Richard.

 

Not sure about specific Firedrake products, but you may be better asking on British HO website.

 

They have an IO Groups site HERE which has a database of former products, and who now holds the masters, but I suspect you probably need to join the British HO Society to access the IO Group. (membership is free!)

 

Hope this helps

 

Moxy

Edited by Moxy
Add link to IO groups
  • Thanks 1
  • Informative/Useful 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I've updated the table to add the Hornby 48DS, because I've just bought one, it is a beautiful thing and its chassis looks suitable for a freelance industrial project. Also the chassis kit for the 48DS by RT models, because it looks the part for a BR class 02 or indeed another project needing a 6ft wheelbase.

 

I think it's quite funny how the discussion here has moved on to coaches quite so quickly. If we find a useful resource for coaches or indeed wagons, I can put the details into the table and change the title of the topic into something broader.

 

- Richard.

Edited by 47137
  • Like 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Don't forget the original Bachmann GE44 loco, with 2 motor bogies. Well liked by narrow gauge modellers. Can still be found, its the one tat is not DCC ready or onboard. About same size as the Ruston. There are other small Bachmann motor bogies which coud be useful, eg the San Fransisco tram/trolley car. Then there is the OO Wickham trolley whichmust be useful.

As for coaches and wagons, I have the coach bodies  covered for 3D printing(all my designs include HO). For bogies I would recommend a basic internal chassis for bogies(easy to design for 3D printing) with a range of different wheelbases, and sides produced separately.

  • Informative/Useful 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I've given my thought to basic loco chassis. Assuming axles are normally 1/8in, what isthe recommended size for bearings. Romfords/Markits do ones in 3.something up to 4mm. I can make holes suitable for any, but would only want to do one size. I checked out motor/gearboxes and Ithink they can just be fitted inside frames so as long as that is minimum of 9.3mm then abasic chassis is easy to do. Far easier than trying to work out positions of motors and gears. 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
4 hours ago, rue_d_etropal said:

Don't forget the original Bachmann GE44 loco, with 2 motor bogies. Well liked by narrow gauge modellers. Can still be found, its the one tat is not DCC ready or onboard. About same size as the Ruston. There are other small Bachmann motor bogies which coud be useful, eg the San Fransisco tram/trolley car. Then there is the OO Wickham trolley whichmust be useful.

As for coaches and wagons, I have the coach bodies  covered for 3D printing(all my designs include HO). For bogies I would recommend a basic internal chassis for bogies(easy to design for 3D printing) with a range of different wheelbases, and sides produced separately.

 

I will add the Bachmann GE44 chassis if it has a straight application for a prototype used in Britain other than a GE44, or if you can supply the basic dimensions, or both. But saying it is well-liked by narrow gauge modellers seems completely off-topic. We need focus if this table is going to be of value. I cannot even work out whether you are describing a 9 or 16.5mm gauge locomotive.

 

The Bachmann Wickham trolley has the motor in the trailer, and tiny wheels. Surely, no locomotive would be built from such a tiny basis?

 

- Richard.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I have finally (!) got around to digging my "Austerity" chassis out from storage, it was well buried.

Wheels are 14.95mm diameter and wheelbase is 19.30mm+19.30mm, unfortunately I'm a bit too focussed on other things to concentrate on the build right now.

I found Simons post here useful as I happen to have one of these, it was gift from a friend many years ago;

 There are other small Bachmann motor bogies which coud be useful, eg the San Fransisco tram/trolley car.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Create an account or sign in to comment

You need to be a member in order to leave a comment

Create an account

Sign up for a new account in our community. It's easy!

Register a new account

Sign in

Already have an account? Sign in here.

Sign In Now

×
×
  • Create New...

Important Information

We have placed cookies on your device to help make this website better. You can adjust your cookie settings, otherwise we'll assume you're okay to continue.