SteveyDee68 Posted January 29, 2020 Author Share Posted January 29, 2020 (edited) I asked for advice in general questions about the colour for the water. Since then, I realised there was a whole area devoted to paint! I searched and browsed through pages of entries, and nowhere did anyone say what colours they used to achieve a murky dock water colour! Everyone says the same thing ... "suitable murky colours were applied" - without saying exactly how to make said murky colours! My dilemma was everything I mixed went grey. I ended up decanting my latest batch of "grey murk" into separate small pots, and adding colours to those to experiment finding a colour. It is trial and error, in my case very much error. I have achieved a greener shade of murk that I have applied and will look at fresh later. I have used other folks' layouts as inspiration, and their water colours range from olive green to brown through to black (for a canal diorama) but copying those colours is difficult when my understanding of mixing colours is so poor that I constantly end up at grey! Reminding myself ... hours of "fun" (Ignore slippers and other non-model detritus - photo shows latest "water" colour ... a greenish grey! MISSING PHOTO HOURS OF FUN! Edited November 8, 2023 by SteveyDee68 Photo?! 10 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bo-Bo Posted January 29, 2020 Share Posted January 29, 2020 Nice work on the harbour wall, looks really good with the darker colours where the water line has been. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
SteveyDee68 Posted January 29, 2020 Author Share Posted January 29, 2020 9 hours ago, Bo-Bo said: Nice work on the harbour wall, looks really good with the darker colours where the water line has been. Thanks, Bo-Bo... No, I cannot take the credit! That is the work of downloads supremo, John Wiffen, as part of his quayside walls kit. Once I have finished the water surface, I do intend enhancing the tide marks on the walls with some flock etc to give it a bit more texture. Steve 2 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bo-Bo Posted January 29, 2020 Share Posted January 29, 2020 Steve the guy does produce impressive kits and they look so realistic. 1 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
SteveyDee68 Posted February 16, 2020 Author Share Posted February 16, 2020 (edited) Update: A recent Facebook post in the Microlayouts Group by Robert Kitching showed the "hole in the wall" next to The White Swan PH on the North Quay, Great Yarmouth, a space between two buildings just wide enough for a train to pass through. A-ha! A way to disguise my upper left track at the baseboard edge, I thought. But not enough room... A rejiggle of track components, substitution of a short Y point and suddenly not only do I have room, I also have an extra two wagon siding. Plus, the short headshunt will take two wagons and my 48DS or one wagon and any 0-6-0 tank loco! Photos to follow showing the realignment! Hours of fun! Edited February 17, 2020 by SteveyDee68 Typos! 3 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
SteveyDee68 Posted February 17, 2020 Author Share Posted February 17, 2020 (edited) An overall view, the arrows showing how I have managed to give a little more space between the track and the rear and front of the board respectively. The layout can be run as a self contained Inglenook, or with a fiddlestick or fiddleyard attached to the right hand side can run trains on and off scene. The "hole in the wall" idea borrowed from Great Yarmouth could also have a fiddlesticks added, perhaps for runnng coal wagons through to the coal yard? The second photo shows the rejigging of track on the right hand of the board. Amazingly, but for one short piece of straight track and a Y point, all the lengths are what were already on the board, just swapped about a bit! The extra two wagon (possibly three) at the rear provides either a stabling point for a loco or an unloading point for wagons. The grain wagons siding will be partially covered by a larger stone warehouse. The third photo shows a mockup for the "Hole in the wall" area. Bonus find - in some boxes of my dad's stuff I found both a Metcalfe pub and terraced house kits! (As my dad modelled in O gauge, he may have bought these to make a diorama for his 1:76 trams and buses.) The price tags suggest that these have been in the loft a long time... £6.50 for the pub?! Propped up quickly into place and they fit perfectly! So, repaint the track beds, trim a bit of trackage, and press on to the next stage of wiring the track and painting it prior to installation. Last photo shows my latest attempt at murky water colour ... a couple of thin washes of brown acrylic. Happier than before, so may try a few coats of varnish and see how that looks. 4 x MISSING PHOTOS HOURS OF FUN! Edited November 7, 2023 by SteveyDee68 10 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
SteveyDee68 Posted March 23, 2020 Author Share Posted March 23, 2020 Update: I crave RMWeb's patience as, once again, I update not with concrete progress but with philosophical meanderings as I ask myself a few questions and perhaps receive some wisdom from others in the process. So, what has been (not) going on at Woodhey Quay? I recently purchased the Metcalfe factory entrance and boiler house kit, as I have the remains of a chopped about Metcalfe Brewery kit that I thought I might be able to use to create an industrial complex, perhaps a maltings, perhaps a brewery. Blu-tacking the basic building carcass together, I realised that the sidings would need re-arranging in order to get a siding to run through the gatehouse. I did this, and was relatively pleased with the result, although now I had some straight sidings and had lost the curvy nature of the right hand of the board. Some more blu-tack and half relief industrial buildings sprang up, together with a second hand Superquick building (which I plan to rebuild entirely!) at the left hand end of the board opposite my half completed butchered Metcalfe terrace house and... And that is where things stopped. I walked away for a while, mainly because life as a supply teacher suddenly became very busy as teachers started self isolating due to the Corona virus. But it did give me a chance to look at the whole again. And I think I lost my way! The industrial side is now heavily unbalancing the look of the micro - and sadly I think the gatehouse is simply too big a structure. I do want some industrial buildings to justify the sidings (even though really this is simply an Inglenook). Annoyingly, I can't serve the quayside by rail. Or, rather, I am at a loss how to do so. If I could, I would simply have a siding running along the quayside... And so, throwing caution to the wind, I took everything up, reversed the entire trackplan so it is back to a simple Inglenook, with sidings serving the quayside area and warehouses at the rear. There's far less track than there was, and the curved sidings have all but disappeared. Has that improved things? I cannot say yet - it is back now to being a self contained Inglenook, goods traffic only. Maybe less really is more. The only plus side to the Covid-19 situation ... plenty of time to find a solution! Hours of fun! 2 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
sb67 Posted March 23, 2020 Share Posted March 23, 2020 It's frustrating when ideas don't quite work out the way you want, I've been there many a time. Keep re arranging things and something might come together. Looking at your last photo's, personally I would start by losing one of the sidings nearest the front of the layout and try putting the gatehouse on the siding where the grain hoppers are. Then you could straighten the siding nearest the dock edge and maybe extend the dock edge a bit. Just a couple of ideas to get you started. 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
SteveyDee68 Posted March 23, 2020 Author Share Posted March 23, 2020 (edited) Thanks Steve (sb67) - that is an interesting proposal, particularly as the front curved siding was the entrance/exit route rather than a siding. That has made me think again. As it is, I have a more orthodox Inglenook arrangement on the left with the headshunt to the right. Although this simplifies things a lot, I feel like my layout lost something in the process. I'll add a photo (although the area is currently a bit of a mess!) Another consideration is that my short Y point has made its way over to my DRS Engineering micro, where it has substituted for a medium RH point and means a long wheelbase wagon can now be shunted into the works building (there wasn't quite room before!) Although that layout is also supposed to be an Inglenook puzzle, I messed up with the headshunt length and also the 5 wagon train would be made up over pointwork, so as that is a 'naughty' I am changing the whole premise of that layout ... which means I can't have my Y point back!! Any suggestions/comments gratefully received! MISSING PHOTO HOURS OF FUN! Edited November 7, 2023 by SteveyDee68 4 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
sb67 Posted March 23, 2020 Share Posted March 23, 2020 That's me not looking properly and influenced by the fact most of the layout's I've built enter from the left hand side. If you were entering the layout from the right I'd probably lose the siding that has no wagons on it. You might then have a bit of room to put the factory entrance on the siding with the grain wagons on it. 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
SteveyDee68 Posted March 24, 2020 Author Share Posted March 24, 2020 3 hours ago, sb67 said: That's me not looking properly and influenced by the fact most of the layout's I've built enter from the left hand side. If you were entering the layout from the right I'd probably lose the siding that has no wagons on it. You might then have a bit of room to put the factory entrance on the siding with the grain wagons on it. Hi Steve Thanks for your thoughts - looking at my previous set up, I see what you mean. However, the empty siding is part of the Inglenook puzzle - the siding at the back (wth the grain wagons) only has room for one wagon to be shunted in/out at a time, so can't be part of the Inglenook puzzle. What do you think of my "new" arrangement? The "White Swan" pub will be in the low right hand corner across the tracks from the half completed terrace house. I like the idea of glimpsing the loco shunting across the road running between the houses at the front, but as the headhunt only just fits the three wagons and loco before the point, it might make it tricky not to run off the edge of the layout! Maybe I should rethink the river banking? Hmmmm.... Hours of frustration fun! 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
SteveyDee68 Posted March 24, 2020 Author Share Posted March 24, 2020 (edited) Steve’s @sb67 comments made me rethink my layout again, not least because he says "most of the layouts I've built enter from the left hand side". And it struck me that my latest plan (above) changed the orientation of the "hole in the wall" by The Swan public house, which explained why something didn't "sit right" with me about the plan... So, up came all the track again! I tried to get a siding alongside the dock edge at the right hand side, but that meant I couldn't get a 5 wagon capacity siding in for the Inglenook puzzle! Starting top left of the board, I needed a loco+3w capacity before the first set of points, for the headshunt to function correctly. If that first point led to the two 3w sidings, the remaining siding had to be 5w capacity. Before, I had multiple curved sidings, which were not conducive to the gatehouse being used. This time, however, I could use it at the end of the first siding! For aesthetic reasons I really wanted track along the quay. Squeezing a kickback siding off the 5w siding meant I could have that, although shunting it would be tricky (in model form). This actually left me with a 4w siding (comfortably) with the fifth and final wagon added when the marshalled train was ready to depart! So, here is my most recent rearrangement. The two photos show the layout from left to right - please excuse the mess! [Apologies - just noticed the first photo is blurred] Any comments or suggestions gratefully received! Thanks again to Steve (sb67) for prodding my little grey cells into action once again! MISSING PHOTOS HOURS OF FRUSTRATION FUN! Edited November 8, 2023 by SteveyDee68 Missing photos need to be restored 5 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
sb67 Posted March 24, 2020 Share Posted March 24, 2020 I really like the 'white Swan' entrance. That little corner looks really good to me. Maybe we're getting our orientation crossed but I see it as top left viewing from the front. Personally I would straighten the kick back siding and the quayside accordingly. I couldn't see the second photo but could you change the kick back point to a right hand point. It's all looking good and as you say ''getting the grey cells in to action'' 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
SteveyDee68 Posted March 24, 2020 Author Share Posted March 24, 2020 (edited) On 24/03/2020 at 06:33, sb67 said: I really like the 'white Swan' entrance. That little corner looks really good to me. Maybe we're getting our orientation crossed but I see it as top left viewing from the front. Personally I would straighten the kick back siding and the quayside accordingly. I couldn't see the second photo but could you change the kick back point to a right hand point. It's all looking good and as you say ''getting the grey cells in to action'' Again, thanks for the constructive feedback. The "White Swan" corner is mocked up at present, and I am happy with the composition and so that will now be the entrance/exit to a fiddlestick (should I decide to add one in the future). I didn't realise the second photo hadn't uploaded! Have added it now! The point on the kickback siding is a left hand point - I am using only what I have (hence the use of settrack and some odd bits of previously cut flexible track being swapped back and forth between this and DRS Engineering!) ... plus of course the "Stay At Home" instruction stops me nipping down to The Locoshed (my local model shop) to pick up any more second hand track! That and the shop being closed, of course! I hear what you say about straightening the quayside siding... will mock that up and see what you think -- mock up three times, Dremel once!! HOURS OF FUN! Edited November 8, 2023 by SteveyDee68 3 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nathaniel Posted March 24, 2020 Share Posted March 24, 2020 Very nice, cannot wait to see this develop to the next stage after deciding the track plan. 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
SteveyDee68 Posted March 24, 2020 Author Share Posted March 24, 2020 (edited) Earlier today, I went browsing on my computer looking at inspirational photos I had downloaded from other people's layouts. Trouble is, I tend not to make a note of which layout they are from... And taking a quick peek at Pecketts Wharf and Metcalfe Yard, it hit me that I had a lot of photos saved from those layouts, so without having too much of a fanboy moment I am dead chuffed that sb67 (Steve) is giving me feedback and suggestions! If I could get to half the standard of his layouts with Woodhey Quay, I would be well happy! Anyway, Steve suggested straightening the track in the right side of the board and using a RH point for the kickback onto the quayside. I've pushed track about a bit and come up with the following. MISSING PHOTO To make this work I would need to infill the river bank and extend the quay so the track is supported. The Inglenook puzzle still (just) works, with the final wagon in the consist (in this instance the meat van) blocking the kickback point only as the consist is completed. The factory gatehouse just fits (with a short piece of straight track off the curve through the arch) MISSING PHOTO Any thoughts? Hours and hours and hours of playing planning! Edited November 8, 2023 by SteveyDee68 4 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
SteveyDee68 Posted March 24, 2020 Author Share Posted March 24, 2020 (edited) Okay... Can we just agree that I am "thinking out loud in a public space" and not get mad at me? I reread @sb67’s earlier post, and thought maybe I misunderstood his suggestion? After head scratching for a bit, I decided to swap out the full curve angling from the back towards the front with a half curve instead, to ease the angle and perhaps not have to build out to support the track. I need a slightly longer straight between the houses top left but this meant the "hole in the wall" could be narrower (instead of allowing for overhang of locos swinging around the curve). The two short sidings now moved inwards on the board. Swapping the two points at the top meant I could now run a 3 wagon siding parallel to the edge of the board, and there was room for the gatehouse at the end of the siding. (I could, in future, add a fiddle stick beyond the gatehouse to allow longer rakes of wagons to be shunted "into" the complex, too!) Replacing the angled curved front siding with a straight track means I have two parallel tracks running diagonally towards the front of the board. The rear of the two will hold 3 wagons, and the front will hold 4 wagons clear of the kickback point to the quayside. The quayside siding is now straight and parallel with the quayside edge... it will hold 3 wagons comfortably. I mocked up these new straight sidings with some flexible track to get an idea of the look/flow across the board. To form a 5 wagon train the last wagon will foul the kickback point, but I can live with that. There is also an S curve into the middle siding, but I don't see how to avoid that on a board shorter than 4 feet long. The track layout is far more conventional for an Inglenook (gone are the curved sidings) but maybe this is the final throw of the dice? I have the "hole in the wall" entrance rear left, a siding serving the quayside, inset track but pointwork ballasted (easier for me to achieve!), incorporated the gatehouse to imply further buildings off stage to the right, and kept the foreground uncluttered with room to reinstate a riverbank. Being able to post my ideas up here and get feedback and suggestions has been incredibly helpful to get me to think and think again. Looking at the latest photos, the trackbed of the original layout can be seen painted grey on the board. How things have changed since I began this! With thanks especially to @sb67 (Steve) for prodding me into finding a way of getting a quayside siding! HOURS DAYS OF FUN! Edited November 8, 2023 by SteveyDee68 3 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
SteveyDee68 Posted March 24, 2020 Author Share Posted March 24, 2020 Footnote I am using set track. With really sharply curved points. Code 100. It won't win awards for tracklaying or realism. But it is a start. After a gap of 30 years! And I intend to learn a few skills along the way. Actually, quite a lot of skills! Feel free to comment or give feedback. But I promise no more updates for at least an hour a day week! Stay safe and well, RM-Webbers. Steve S 2 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
sb67 Posted March 25, 2020 Share Posted March 25, 2020 Hi, Steve. I'm flattered to hear you've been looking at my layouts for ideas, most of mine are inspired by other peoples layouts, I've got loads of pics saved to my laptop. I like the way your layout is looking, the view blocks look good and you've managed to get the gatehouse in. I wouldn't worry about the 5th wagon fouling the kickback point, that will give you something to think about when shunting. I'll look forward to seeing more updates 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
SteveyDee68 Posted April 6, 2020 Author Share Posted April 6, 2020 (edited) I have spent some time researching (aka trawling the internet using Google!) the "hole in the wall", the White Swan and the White Swan coal yard, really to get the atmosphere for my "homage" on my layout, as the buildings will be adapted rather than scratch built. Then I discovered a photo on the Great Yarmouth Courier website of "Laughing Image Corner" (photo 1 below) when flooded in 1905 - and it turns out that was the name of the area next to the White Swan! Using that photo, Google maps (for the roof layout of The Swan - everything else has gone!) and a postcard of the same area, I sketched out an approximation of the layout of buildings as I could glean it from the photo, and then an elevation sketch (photo 2). It isn't 100%, but it was a starting point. From that, I then sketched a layout of buildings using the Metcalfe kits I have, in order to create a similar feel to the "original" Laughing Image Corner (photo 3). I will need to scratchbuild one building (the harbour master's house) but I will have spare windows from the Metcalfe kits to use. I may also "re-skin" the Metcalfe terraced pub similar to the original "White Swan". The only other change to my original idea is that the warehouse/shed at the bottom left of the layout is changed for the tower that was behind the White Horse pub at Great Yarmouth. Again, this will be an impression rather than an accurate model, but I thought it might make an interesting sight blocker. The right hand end of the layout is still to be finalised, but will feature the Metcalfe factory gatehouse, elements of the brewery kit (probably unrecognisable having been chopped about!) and the boilerhouse (arranged much like the brewery on Chris Nervard's Brew Street layout). STAY HOME - STAY SAFE - KEEP MODELLING Photo 1 (Great Yarmouth Mercury - newspaper photo archive) MISSING PHOTO Photo 2 - my "guesstimated" layout and elevation of Laughing Image Corner MISSING PHOTO Photo 3 - my "Metcalfed" layout : the 'Harbour Master's House' will have the same roofline as the original photo but windows to suit from the cut down 3-storey terrace of shops to the right! The terrace house on the right is the other half of the kit used to produce the terrace house on the left - if it fits before the brewery/boiler house! Greenery is .... fanciful!, MISSING PHOTO Edited November 8, 2023 by SteveyDee68 Labelling photos 7 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
SteveyDee68 Posted April 7, 2020 Author Share Posted April 7, 2020 From left to right, top corner... Metcalfe terraced house (old kit, cut in half to make single building) Row (alley) House gable end - low relief (cut down Superquick "White Swan" pub - how appropriate!) Scratchbuilt house (utilising spare windows from both the Superquick "White Swan" and cut down three storey shops) Row (alley) Two storey shop (cut down Metcalfe three storey low relief shop) Two storey pub (cut down Metcalfe three storey low relief pub) Row (alley) House gable end - low relief (cut down Superquick "White Swan" pub - the other part of the structure) Road Metcalfe terraced house kit (the other half, facing in) I have had to leave out the broker's office as there isn't room. By rights, I should also leave off the second pub and have a second house instead - I have just found the Metcalfe cottage I got free with a magazine (*ahem*) so may try that instead of the pub. Using paper mock ups to help visualise - will probably post up some variations and ask opinions upon which look best! STAY HOME - STAY SAFE 4 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
SteveyDee68 Posted April 24, 2020 Author Share Posted April 24, 2020 (edited) Four AM Update Or should that be three steps forward and four back? Wednesday evening I had produced another paper mockup for another building and was feeling like the overall picture was coming together when I noticed that the foam board surface had come away a little in the middle near the front edge. Never mind, I thought, a spot of glue will sort that. Then whilst moving some stuff under the eaves I noticed the back right corner had lifted. As has the rear left corner. I just woke up with the realisation that spray-on carpet glue does not do as good a job with non-porous foam board to wood as it might do to a semi porous carpet backing and wood: the whole blessed lot is going to have to come up and start again. Time for a choice word or three ... On the plus side, I've finalised the track plan but nothing yet has been fixed down. Phew. So, the big question is (and do feel free to make suggestions) do I try again with foamboard, try again with mounting board or simply lay the track direct on the baseboard? (Forget cork - it ain't gonna happen!) And with that off my chest I can return to the Land of Nod. Stay safe, folks Edited April 24, 2020 by SteveyDee68 Autospell changes on to in ... why?! 3 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
sb67 Posted April 24, 2020 Share Posted April 24, 2020 That's a shame to hear the foam board has lifted. I've had no experience of using it for a baseboard or using carpet adhesive. I would have thought that PVA would hold it down. Could you just sick the offending bits back down? But then you have the thought ''what if another bit lifts'' If it were me I would probably lay the track directly on the boards. 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
SteveyDee68 Posted April 27, 2020 Author Share Posted April 27, 2020 I have decided to lift the foamboard off the baseboard and lay the track direct onto the board. But before I do, I am left pondering... do I keep my most recent track plan, the one most like the standard Inglenook design, or do I revert to a version with curved sidings? The straight sidings are easier, but looking at photos of vans curling around a siding look more interesting. There is a lot to be said to not overthinking things and just doing it!! Steve S 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Premium MAP66 Posted April 28, 2020 RMweb Premium Share Posted April 28, 2020 Hi Steve I'm just wondering about the foam board, was the layout stored in the loft where temperatures were fluctuating and not constant as moisture and temperature fluctuations may have caused the foam-board to warp or shrink and cause it to become unstuck. I read accounts of people who have used no6 screws to screw the foam board back down with glue where it has lifted. That could work with a washer as well to spread the load. Then the depression can be disguised with filler and ground cover. Maybe give that a go first before ripping it all off, if I'm not too late with the advice. All the best Mark 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
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