GER 10T Goods Van announced!

[MarkSG]

Got the same message, and I'm not particularly bothered either. Nor, to be honest, am I particularly bothered by the brake lever. I wouldn't have noticed unless it had been pointed out in this thread, and, if I ever get the layout it will run on to an exhibitable standard and people other than myself get to see it, I bet that 99% of them won't notice either.

[Compound2632]

12 minutes ago, MarkSG said:

Nor, to be honest, am I particularly bothered by the brake lever. 

 

It's an unnecessary error which lets slip that the designers don't really understand the prototype.

[Dunsignalling]

An error shared with a high proportion of Bachmann's wagons produced over many years, though few seemed to notice/be bothered by it, to comment.....

 

Fortunately, if the construction of Oxford's brake gear matches their previous wagons, it should be easier to put right than Bachmann's, which seldom seems to come apart without damage.

 

John 

Edited January 20, 2022 by Dunsignalling

[MarkSG]

15 minutes ago, Compound2632 said:

 

It's an unnecessary error which lets slip that the designers don't really understand the prototype.

 

It's unreasonable to expect that everyone who works for a model railway manufacturer in their CAD department is themselves a dedicated railway nerd who knows all there is to know about the prototypes they are creating designs for. Working in the design team for the likes of Oxford is just another job, and, while an interest in models and the things they are modelling is beneficial, there aren't enough skilled CAD designers out there for all of them to be subject experts as well as CAD experts. 

 

An error like this isn't a design error as such, it's a research error, and the researchers who set the brief for the designers should have checked the design against the brief and pointed out that this aspect was wrong. But then again, if you're only paying £14.50 for the resulting model, it's a fair bet that salaries of professional researchers aren't a huge part of the development budget. If you want that level of dedication and detail, you need to be prepared to pay Rapido prices.

[31A]

It seems to me to be a thing that is just as easy to get right as it is to get wrong, and one look at a photo or drawing of a real wagon and visualising what happens when you depress the brake lever would show whether it's right or not!

 

Not sure whether that makes me a 'nerd' or not, but things like that which are a mechanical impossibility just seem to shout out at me.

 

Agree that it looks as though it will probably be easier for a modeller to rectify than with some of Bachmann's wagon underframes, some of which I have rectified, but others I must admit I have ignored for now (tank wagons).

[31A]

n.

Edited January 20, 2022 by 31A
Duplicated post!

[Dunsignalling]

If a CAD is being prepared from an existing (accurate) drawing, or a scan from a preserved vehicle, it should be correct. 

 

The availability of reliable information should have been checked before picking the prototype to be modelled, let alone it getting into the same room as a CAD designer, irrespective of that person's knowledge/interest.

 

This error, and earlier instances from the other manufacturer I mentioned are more likely to be assembly errors. 

 

However, properly executed CAD should include ensuring the parts will only go together in the correct orientation. 

 

John

 

Edited January 20, 2022 by Dunsignalling

[Compound2632]

1 hour ago, MarkSG said:

An error like this isn't a design error as such, it's a research error,

 

OK I accept that my criticism was mis-directed and will slam Oxford's poor research instead. 

[Nile]

Could it be an assembly error? If so could it have been avoided by design?

Anyway it wouldn't be an Oxford wagon without at least one booboo. It helps divide the modellers from the collectors.

[Steamport Southport]

Might be worth waiting for what actually turns up. That photo has been online for ages.

 

 

 

Jason

[Flying Pig]

8 minutes ago, Nile said:

Could it be an assembly error? If so could it have been avoided by design?

Anyway it wouldn't be an Oxford wagon without at least one booboo. It helps divide the modellers from the collectors.

 

Yes - looks more like an assembly error.  Quite possibly a miscommunication of instructions between HQ and factory (not at all confined to Oxford). No doubt the parts could have been designed to be impossible to assemble incorrectly, but I doubt that is common in any manufacturer's range.

 

To look on the bright side, if that's what it is and there are no actual design errors in the model, then Oxford are making solid progress

 

 

[PaulG]

8 minutes ago, Flying Pig said:

 

Yes - looks more like an assembly error.  Quite possibly a miscommunication of instructions between HQ and factory (not at all confined to Oxford). No doubt the parts could have been designed to be impossible to assemble incorrectly, but I doubt that is common in any manufacturer's range.

 

To look on the bright side, if that's what it is and there are no actual design errors in the model, then Oxford are making solid progress

 

 

All I say on the matter is Oxford Rail used in my view all reasonable efforts to get the design correct.

 

Paul

[Compound2632]

29 minutes ago, PaulG said:

All I say on the matter is Oxford Rail used in my view all reasonable efforts to get the design correct.

 

What evidence do you have to support this assertion? Were you involved?

[Dunsignalling]

40 minutes ago, Flying Pig said:

 

Yes - looks more like an assembly error.  Quite possibly a miscommunication of instructions between HQ and factory (not at all confined to Oxford). No doubt the parts could have been designed to be impossible to assemble incorrectly, but I doubt that is common in any manufacturer's range.

 

To look on the bright side, if that's what it is and there are no actual design errors in the model, then Oxford are making solid progress

 

 

Errors involving handed features are something Oxford have suffered from before.

 

Maybe they need to recruit a designer who has worked in the footwear industry, where they seem to manage that sort of thing quite well.

 

John

[Wickham Green too]

20 minutes ago, Dunsignalling said:

..... Maybe they need to recruit a designer who has worked in the footwear industry, where they seem to manage that sort of thing quite well.

Not exactly ....... the footwear industry generally manage to produce pairs of left and right shoes OK - but they avoid the tricky bit, i.e. getting them on the correct feet !

[NXEA!]

35 minutes ago, Compound2632 said:

 

What evidence do you have to support this assertion? Were you involved?

Given that Paul is an esteemed member of the GER society I’d suggest yes! I’m sure he’ll confirm either way though. 
 

The way I look at it is could I make a better fist of this model than Oxford have done here? The answer is a resounding no - it looks fantastic and I didn’t even notice the brake lever until mentioned. It’ll do for me, it may even be the only RTR GER goods vehicles we get. 

[Compound2632]

8 minutes ago, NXEA! said:

Given that Paul is an esteemed member of the GER society I’d suggest yes! I’m sure he’ll confirm either way though.

 

That's reasonable. There are so many unsupported assertions made here it is difficult to distinguish statements made in good faith.

Edited January 20, 2022 by Compound2632

[Nile]

All the right parts, but not necessarily in the right places.

[Bucoops]

9 minutes ago, Nile said:

All the right parts, but not necessarily in the right places.

 

Thank you Eric

 

Definitely in the top 3 comedy sketches of all time (IMO of course).

[The Johnster]

Just pre-ordered my from Rails, BR livery, £14.50.  Nice van with a lot of character...

[Wickham Green too]

If no-one reminds me that I pre-ordered one yonks ago I'll have to assume I didn't ....... and rectify the situation !

[HonestTom]

18 hours ago, Dunsignalling said:

Errors involving handed features are something Oxford have suffered from before.

 

Maybe they need to recruit a designer who has worked in the footwear industry, where they seem to manage that sort of thing quite well.

 

John

Oxford brogues?

[Mike Harvey]

On 20/01/2022 at 16:23, Flying Pig said:

 

Yes - looks more like an assembly error.  Quite possibly a miscommunication of instructions between HQ and factory (not at all confined to Oxford). No doubt the parts could have been designed to be impossible to assemble incorrectly, but I doubt that is common in any manufacturer's range.

 

 

 

Kato seem to design to avoid assembly errors by making things only fit the intended way round. The recent GWR Class 800 was delivered with the first class seating at the wrong end of the composite coach. You could not just flip it from end to end to correct it, so Kato retooled the interior to the correct layout and supplied it to the importers/dealers.

[David Stannard]

27 minutes ago, Mike Harvey said:

 

Kato seem to design to avoid assembly errors by making things only fit the intended way round. The recent GWR Class 800 was delivered with the first class seating at the wrong end of the composite coach. You could not just flip it from end to end to correct it, so Kato retooled the interior to the correct layout and supplied it to the importers/dealers.

 

 The Japanese manufacturers pride themselves with making sure models are accurate and any defects they will try and resolve as quickly as possible, some N scale examples I can personally give is I returned a container flat at the cost of the supplier due to a misprint on the containers and received a replacement model a couple of weeks later, I have a spare EF210-300 locomotive at no cost as the original models were sent out with the wrong coloured handrails that you need to fit, it also had traction tyres fitted which were not intended for the model as it was supposed to be used as a banking engine and needed a degree of slip when pushing a train, they sent me a replacement with the corrections. With the EF210-300 I could get the correct white handrails when they have them available as spare parts or I could simply apply a lick of paint to the blue ones supplied with the model, given I want to use the locomotive for normal freight duties and not as a banking engine the traction tyres will come in handy.

[Wickham Green too]

That sort of thing is wonderful for 'customer relations' but not so good for bank balance .................. I had a camera pouch that had a 'lifetime guarantee', at one time, and asked if they could repair it when the support straps wore thin - they sent a complete new pouch .... and have since gone out of business !