Starting a Dublo Collection

[Il Grifone]

It does seem to be the usual rubbish component....

 

Professional ones are really multi position switches with fixed resistors between the contacts (and a corresponding high price tag. The Marshal III is made like this, with 8 positions. The II is the same, but only four positions is not enough to give smooth control.

[2996 Victor]

7 hours ago, hayfield said:

Mark

 

I have read the first page so by missing the the others I could be going off on the wrong tangent. You started to say buying a few items and building a small layout for nostalgic reasons

 

Whilst you are collecting, you are not a collector for investment reasons. Unless you have changed tact I would just go out and buy inexpensive items, certainly give them a good service but either leave them as playworn (I think second hand salesmen call it patina. Or as some do carry out some light restoration. I have kept a couple of old 3 rail HD locos as they were my first, I do have some vintage track parts along with some old Jamieson locos and wooden coaches. I have always thought of building one of CJF's small layouts, Airfix and Builteze structures on soft board, whether I end up doing it is another matter.

 

In the end just go out and enjoy yourself

 

Hi,

 

Yes, you've pretty much hit the nail on the head. I wouldn't class myself as "a collector" in the normal sense of the term, rather I'm collecting some items that I like for a small layout.

 

Being a bit of a perfectionist, I'm looking for really nice items, ideally mint, but I'm not prepared to pay silly money so a dose of pragmatism is the order of the day.

 

I'm also happy to do a little light restoration if necessary, bearing in mind that that can affect the value of rarer items. But then, I probably won't be buying any of the rarer items, anyway!

 

As far as the layout is concerned, I can see it being "scenic", but probably using more traditional methods, Superquick-type buildings, for instance.

 

At the end of the day, it's all about nostalgia, and having a bit of fun!

 

Cheers,

 

Mark

[Wolseley]

7 hours ago, 2996 Victor said:

I wouldn't class myself as "a collector" in the normal sense of the term, rather I'm collecting some items that I like for a small layout.

 

Same here.  I'm a bit of both, I suppose, but more the latter than the former.  I have a handful of mint and rare items, but I buy them to run them, not to put them on display or stick them away in a cupboard.

 

Jim

[Wolseley]

17 hours ago, Nearholmer said:

Is the running quality of HD up to typical BLT operation?

 

I’m busily building a small 00 BLT, which was supposed to be for Triang Nellies, and I’ve already concluded that, as built, they are not really suitable for the job due to high gearing and wonder whether things like the N2, R1 and 2-6-4T might fall into the same bracket.

 

It took me a while to realise what BLT meant in this context.  Here it's a term used in cafes to describe a toasted sandwich with bacon, lettuce and tomato as a filling......

Edited January 27, 2020 by Wolseley
Correcting error

[Hroth]

1 hour ago, Wolseley said:

Here it's a term used in cafes to describe a toasted sandwich with beetroot, lettuce and tomato as a filling......

 

Ick.  Replace the beetroot with bacon, and minimise the lettuce and tomato and I would be tempted!

 

Its a long time since my HD 3-rail stuff has seen the light, I've enough track and points for an 8x4 double oval with a goods yard and engine depot.  Another thing to write up and put in the project book...

 

 

[Wolseley]

2 hours ago, Wolseley said:

 

Ick.  Replace the beetroot with bacon, and minimise the lettuce and tomato and I would be tempted!

 

Its a long time since my HD 3-rail stuff has seen the light, I've enough track and points for an 8x4 double oval with a goods yard and engine depot.  Another thing to write up and put in the project book...

 

me a while to realise what BLT meant in this context.  Here it's a term used in cafes to describe a toasted sandwich with bacon, lettuce and tomato as a filling......

 

I really should check what I have typed before I post it.  That should have read bacon, lettuce and tomato.....

 

There is also another sandwich you see on menus that is called a BLAT.  The same thing but with the addition of avocado.

 

 

Edited January 27, 2020 by Wolseley
correcting typo

[Il Grifone]

BLT means the sandwich here too, but the railway meaning is far more important IMHO. (My wife and I are not great bacon fans anyway and our daughter is vegetarian.)

 

I've been told to clear away the trains  ????????????????????????

[hayfield]

10 hours ago, 2996 Victor said:

 

Hi,

 

Yes, you've pretty much hit the nail on the head. I wouldn't class myself as "a collector" in the normal sense of the term, rather I'm collecting some items that I like for a small layout.

 

Being a bit of a perfectionist, I'm looking for really nice items, ideally mint, but I'm not prepared to pay silly money so a dose of pragmatism is the order of the day.

 

I'm also happy to do a little light restoration if necessary, bearing in mind that that can affect the value of rarer items. But then, I probably won't be buying any of the rarer items, anyway!

 

As far as the layout is concerned, I can see it being "scenic", but probably using more traditional methods, Superquick-type buildings, for instance.

 

At the end of the day, it's all about nostalgia, and having a bit of fun!

 

Cheers,

 

Mark

 

Mark

 

Just buy cheap items and do them up, I think most models that have been both played with and have no boxes are not worth much and as time goes by will probably reduce in value,

 

I have a friend who buys the metal coaches with windows punched out, then repaints them.

 

As well as Airfix and Superquick models look out for the old wooden Modelmaster kits. I also have quite a few bits of early track building parts & turnout kits

 

Are you interested in 2 or 3 rail ?

[2996 Victor]

1 hour ago, hayfield said:

 

Mark

 

Just buy cheap items and do them up, I think most models that have been both played with and have no boxes are not worth much and as time goes by will probably reduce in value,

 

I have a friend who buys the metal coaches with windows punched out, then repaints them.

 

As well as Airfix and Superquick models look out for the old wooden Modelmaster kits. I also have quite a few bits of early track building parts & turnout kits

 

Are you interested in 2 or 3 rail ?

 

Hi John,

 

I'm interested in 3-rail and tinplate, not sure about track just yet, whether to find good original or to modify PECO, or even use their Marklin stud-replacement strip. Incidentally, what would HD rail equate to in terms of rail "code".

 

Best regards,

 

Mark

[hayfield]

Mark

 

Hornby Dublo wheels are less course than Triang so normal Peco code 100 is fine, as for the centre rail again code 100, but I have no idea what height the centre rail should be. In theory its easy to add a third rail, the only issue is where it crosses the switch rail on points, just buy a couple of bits of 3 rail track and copy

 

I have some Peco "Indvidulay" 2' radius turnout kits as my Jamieson kits are 2 rail, easy to convert them to 3 rail, but Peco/Triang/ Hornby Dublo/ GEM etc can easily be converted to 3 rail

[2996 Victor]

17 hours ago, Il Grifone said:

They do suffer a bit from jack rabbit syndrome (but not so much as Tri-ang), but a decent controller either a variable transformer with pulse power* or  a modern electronic unit will tame them.  A current rating of at least 750mA is required however.

 

*Dublo Marshal III or H&M Powermaster for example. (Have the wiring checked on vintage Mains equipment!)

 

Markits/Romford do 9/64" diameter axles for Tri-ang frames or they can be bushed. Apparently the TT gears are the same diameter, but single start. A 30:1 ratio would curb Polly's enthusiasm, but good luck finding any however.

 

I have sorted out some track for a Dublo BLT, but have never set it up. When I come back to Airstrip One the UK perhaps....

The 2-6-4T has her magnetic shunt to improve slow running (at least the earlier examples- it had been deleted by the Wrenn period).

 

Hi David,

 

thank you for your thoughts regarding a suitable controller - to be honest I hadn't considered that aspect as yet! I've got Dad's transformer/controller, and it worked perfectly 35 years ago!!! But it hasn't been used since!!! So a recommendation for a suitable modern electronic unit that could be used for this and for a modern DC control (no DCC for me!) would be gratefully appreciated.

 

All the best,

 

Mark

[Wolseley]

43 minutes ago, 2996 Victor said:

I'm interested in 3-rail and tinplate, not sure about track just yet, whether to find good original or to modify PECO, or even use their Marklin stud-replacement strip. Incidentally, what would HD rail equate to in terms of rail "code".

 

Dublo pickups will not work on stud contact track, as the collector shoes or plungers (depending on which locomotives we're talking about) will drop into the spaces between the studs.  If you want to use stud contact track, you might have to fit Marklin skates to all your locomotives.  I remember that, back in the 1960s, Peco sold individual rails and spikes so that you could convert Streamline track into three rail, but I would be surprised if you could get that today.

 

David (Il Grifone). would be able to confirm, but I think Dublo rail would be somewhere between code 110 and 120.

 

There is an American brand of track, Gargraves, that has a blackened centre rail (they call it a phantom rail) and has sleepers not unlike Peco Streamline in appearance.  I have never seen any of the track myself, but I have seen photographs of it, and it looks quite realistic.  It does, however, appear to be rather expensive.

 

In any case, isn't one of the major attractions of HD three rail the sound that the trains make when they run over the tinplate track?

 

Jim

 

 

Edited January 27, 2020 by Wolseley
added a sentence

[2996 Victor]

17 hours ago, sagaguy said:

A decent modern electronic controller should sort that out,i use Trax feedback HH controllers on my layout.With clean track,wheels & p/ups,slow running isn`t a problem.The best electronic HH controller i ever had was a H & M Walkabout,sadley the linear pot wore out & no replacements could be found.

 

                                    Ray.

 

Ray,

 

thanks for the pointers regarding the best type of controller - I mentioned in my reply to David @Il Grifone that I'd be ideally looking for a controller that I could use for both an HD layout and also for my planned EM-gauge finescale layout (DC, not DCC). So any advice would be gratefully received! 

 

Thanks in advance!

 

Mark

[hayfield]

Mark

 

I went to a local model railway show and there were s/h controllers available at reasonable prices, nothing wrong with buying 12 volt controllers

 

18 mths ago I bought 1 mains controllers (Codar Track king) and 2 12 volt (Codar CRC & ECM Compspeed with a rambler) for a fiver at the end of the show, all work extremely well. Do though be careful with mains supply units, wise to get them checked.

 

In addition I have 3 H&M units plus several old and modern 12 volt hand held units

[2996 Victor]

14 minutes ago, Wolseley said:

 

Dublo pickups will not work on stud contact track, as the collector shoes or plungers (depending on which locomotives we're talking about) will drop into the spaces between the studs.  If you want to use stud contact track, you might have to fit Marklin skates to all your locomotives.

 

There is an American brand of track, Gargraves, that has a blackened centre rail and has sleepers not unlike Peco Streamline in appearance.  I have never seen any of the track myself, but I have seen photographs of it, and it looks quite realistic.  It does, however, appear to be rather expensive.

 

In any case, isn't one of the major attractions of HD three rail the sound that the trains make when they run over the tinplate track?

 

Jim

 

Hi Jim,

 

many thanks for the extra info - I hadn't considered how the sprung pick-up shoe would drop between the studs! At the moment, I'm considering my options with regard to track, so any thoughts or advice are very welcome.

 

All the best,

 

Mark

[sagaguy]

5 minutes ago, 2996 Victor said:

 

Ray,

 

thanks for the pointers regarding the best type of controller - I mentioned in my reply to David @Il Grifone that I'd be ideally looking for a controller that I could use for both an HD layout and also for my planned EM-gauge finescale layout (DC, not DCC). So any advice would be gratefully received! 

 

Thanks in advance!

 

Mark

Hi Mark,i use Trax controllers these days in preference to Gaugemaster HH,the Trax supplies one and a half amp wheras Gaugemaster deliver one amp.Sometimes,the trains need a liitle bit of oomph.Thing is,with all electronic controllers,they need separate 16VAC inputs which must be from separate transformers ,i use a Gaugemaster cased twin 16v AC power supply for mine.These controllers will operate any 12vDC layout.

Hope this helps,Ray.

[2996 Victor]

9 minutes ago, sagaguy said:

Hi Mark,i use Trax controllers these days in preference to Gaugemaster HH,the Trax supplies one and a half amp wheras Gaugemaster deliver one amp.Sometimes,the trains need a liitle bit of oomph.Thing is,with all electronic controllers,they need separate 16VAC inputs which must be from separate transformers ,i use a Gaugemaster cased twin 16v AC power supply for mine.These controllers will operate any 12vDC layout.

Hope this helps,Ray.

 

Hi Ray,

 

that's most helpful. I'm afraid I'm not well-versed in electrics/electronics and as such I aim for simplicity!

 

Many thanks,

 

Mark

[gtis]

Hi mark 

I use gaugemaster 100m and hh controllers

peco still make rail and spikes to make 3 rail but they go on the outside of track as in 

3 rail track used in the southern area

but you Should be able to use it in the center or you could solder it to some track

pins

link to the spikes and the rail

 

 

https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/PECO-IL-120-100-Conductor-Rail-Chairs-Track-Components-16-5-18-2-18-83mm-Gauges1/171555277399

 

 

 

https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/PECO-IL-1-6-x-24-Long-Nickel-Silver-Code-60-Flat-Bottom-Rail-Track-SectionT48/361127391298?epid=1105529281&hash=item5414deb042:g:ci4AAOxyrM5TItYT
Neil

 

Edited January 27, 2020 by gtis

[Il Grifone]

Dublo rail is code 125 for 3 rail (1/8" - imperial as always!) and 110 for 2 rail. The latter will connect to Peco streamline . The difference in height causes a slight bump, but nothing one can't live with. especially if it's in a tunnel or something.

 

Peco used to sell a strip to convert streamline to stud contact, but I don't know if they still do. The closure rails are insulated on Dublo and Märklin so that the pickups/skate do not cause a short. In the olden days, when 'scale' modellers still used such things, the stud specification was 1/16" above the sleepers rising to 1/16" above the rail on pointwork (IIRC it was a long time ago!). Märklin is 'all level'.

 

I have read that the Dublo pickup will run on Märklin studs though clattering while it does so. I've never tried in myself as the Märklin track I have is all 3 rail (pre 1955 IIRC). Märklin skates are still available as spares (you might have to order from Germany) and cost less than the Dublo pickup on the spares market.

Many years ago there was an article on converting Dublo locos to stud contact. It involved filing the sides of the shoes in line with the holder and making a cover to fit over everything secured by two tags around the  shoes. The filing seems unnecessary to me as it would only be necessary to shape the skate appropriately.

 

Dublo transformers are rated * 0r 9 V.A. (volt- amperes  the same as watts in DC but not in AC. I won't go into the maths....)  which suggests a max load of 750mA which is about right, unless you wish to indulge in double-heading when a bit more wick is required.

Edited January 27, 2020 by Il Grifone

[Wolseley]

I use Gaugemaster Combi controllers for my layout.  I suppose it might be better to use a controller with an output of more than 1 amp but they work for me and, to my way of thinking, if a loco starts to draw more than 1 amp, it's time to take it out of service and give it a good clean and overhaul.

[hayfield]

1 hour ago, 2996 Victor said:

 

Hi Jim,

 

many thanks for the extra info - I hadn't considered how the sprung pick-up shoe would drop between the studs! At the moment, I'm considering my options with regard to track, so any thoughts or advice are very welcome.

 

All the best,

 

Mark

 

Mark

 

I would go to local shows and swap meets plus look on sites like eBay, whilst some seem to want a Kings ransom for items, others seemingly are asking realistic prices. Initially I would go for old s/h RTR track. However I think it is quite possible to convert code 100 track and points to 3 rail operation

[ELTEL]

On 21/01/2020 at 10:17, 2996 Victor said:

Dear All,

 

I hope you will accept my apologies in advance, as I'm certain to repeat previously-asked questions.

 

As if I haven't got enough to do, I've recently decided that I'd like to collect a few Hornby Dublo 3-rail items, and perhaps build a small layout for them to run on. It's pure nostalgia, of course: some forty-five-odd years ago as a small child of six or seven, I was allowed to play (carefully!) with my Dad's Dublo set, one which he had had as a child in the 1950s. I wasn't allowed to run the loco (BR 2-6-4t), though, so my "engine" was an Esso Royal Daylight tank wagon! Sadly, Dad sold his collection when we were building a GWR BLT layout together, which in hindsight was a massive shame as most if not all the set and wagons were mint in their boxes!

 

I've decided I'm collecting only lithographed tinplate items, as they have a certain extra special aesthetic. So, to kick things off, I've bought a couple of items from that well-known internet auction site, and I'm on the look-out for others. Of course, its no surprise that Dublo items, being of the age they are, are often a bit knocked about, and to be fair I really want "nice" pieces. That's not to say that I'm not open to doing restoration work, but therein lies the rub.

 

For instance, one of my recent purchases is a BR High Capacity Wagon #32050 (bogie brick), which is generally in very nice condition with no dents and no real marks or scratches. However, the corners where the body is folded (I'm assuming the litho bodies were printed as flat sheets and then folded up around formers) a very small amount of paint is missing. Is this due to the production method, or is it play wear? I think I've been quite lucky with this wagon, but if paint loss were more severe, how difficult would it be to remedy and are there any special techniques? 

 

Quite a lot of the Dublo wagons one sees for sale have chipped underframe paintwork. Is is possible to detach tinplate bodies from their underframes and then reattach them afterwards? If so, it would presumably be a simple (!) matter to strip the damaged paint from the underframe and sympathetically repaint it. What type of paint would have been used originally, I wonder? Probably something containing lead.....! Also, with respect to the bogie brick wagon, if it were necessary to detach the bogies, is it possible to find replacements for the pivots (which appear to be rivets)?

 

I also have a low-sided wagon, sadly without its container, which is quite badly chipped. On this wagon, the body appears to be die-cast and is held to the underframe by the brass rivets that also secure the couplings. Are these rivets available? And if it were to be completely stripped down, are suitable transfers available to restore the livery?

 

I do apologise if these questions have been covered previously - I have searched this forum and while I've found a few references to restoration of Dublo rolling stock, actual techniques or processes seem to be difficult to unearth. So I would be very grateful if our erudite members could tell me a bit more about it and help me along with my second childhood!

 

With many thanks in advance,

 

Mark

H Mark

 

The weekend just gone (25th & 26th January) I was exhibiting my layout Camel Quay at Kendal Model Railways Exhibition 

 

One of the Trade stands was a specialist trader dealing in both Wrenn & Hornby

The trader purchased a small collection of early Hornby 00 items which may be the type you are collecting.

 

The trader will be at our STAFFORD exhibition this coming weekend.

 

Hope it helps 

 

Terry 

 

Details of our exhibition can be found at www.staffordrailwaycircle.org.uk/exhibition 

[sagaguy]

Marklin skates are readily available at Gaugemaster, that's where I get mine. 

 

        Ray. 

[gtis]

Hi

there are a couple of sellers on eBay selling skates I have ordered 1 second hand £5 plus £2.20 p&p

neil

[sagaguy]

That's pretty expensive.£4.95 new from Gaugemaster, Marklin cat.no.7164.They are the ones I use. 

 

       Ray.