Broadway Clive Posted January 24, 2020 Share Posted January 24, 2020 Whilst London is struggling with an epidemic of knife crime, much of it connected to gangs and drug dealing, Lambeth council in a notorious area of South London has targeted this famous hobby shop known to many of us. A covert under 18 age investigator bought a kit of tools containing a knife and now they've been heavily fined! https://www.wandsworthguardian.co.uk/news/18184395.ian-allan-book-model-shop-fined-thousands-selling-knife-teen/?ref=fbshr&fbclid=IwAR1iRR-tegRkdW1TPS6FjS2pl9Q0ULpO74vlAfek1kusqf3PJK1JFdjPFD4 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
peterl Posted January 24, 2020 Share Posted January 24, 2020 How stupid can they get? Obviously who ever set the investigator up got his position via the 'Peter's Principle'! Peter Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Premium Dava Posted January 24, 2020 RMweb Premium Share Posted January 24, 2020 In a previous century, I bought my first Swann Morton scalpel from Kings Cross Models at age 15, with blades. No questions. Today in Sainsbury's I had a lengthy inquisiton by the pharmacist when I asked for Cocodamol, including intrusive questions about why I wanted it and what alternatives I had tried. Have to think carefully about where to buy scalpel blades....Squires at model rail shows I guess. Knife crime among youths is horrific and nowhere more so than Lambeth area. Dava Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Premium boxbrownie Posted January 24, 2020 RMweb Premium Share Posted January 24, 2020 (edited) Oops, silly billies, but I find it odd as it was a “sting” operation with a 15 year old working with the authorities that there was also a victims award.......did the kid get an extra bunce for doing that? Edited January 24, 2020 by boxbrownie 3 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dave47549 Posted January 24, 2020 Share Posted January 24, 2020 32 minutes ago, Dava said: In a previous century, I bought my first Swann Morton scalpel from Kings Cross Models at age 15, with blades. No questions. I got my first Swann Morton at 14, almost four decades ago. Mind, the only person I've ever damaged with it (& its' successors) has been myself.... 2 5 3 2 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
rocor Posted January 24, 2020 Share Posted January 24, 2020 To put it in perspective, the youth could probably have obtained a much more deadly weapon from the knife block in his mothers kitchen. 7 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
JeffP Posted January 24, 2020 Share Posted January 24, 2020 I recently noticed how difficult it is now to buy both NON-retractable Stanley type craft knives and blades to suit. I have a pack of 1000 off ebay, but can I buy more????? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Moderators AY Mod Posted January 24, 2020 Moderators Share Posted January 24, 2020 The local media link Clive posted uses the content, pretty much verbatim, as per the Council's website (or maybe press release) so it looks that the 'story' has been pushed for the Council's profile rather than a news story from any court reports. I'll draw my own conclusions on that with regard to the likelihood of being an accessory to a potential unfortunate consequence. 1 2 2 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold Enterprisingwestern Posted January 24, 2020 RMweb Gold Share Posted January 24, 2020 1 hour ago, AY Mod said: I'll draw my own conclusions on that with regard to the likelihood of being an accessory to a potential unfortunate consequence. Yes, he could go P4! Mike. 1 9 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Premium polybear Posted January 24, 2020 RMweb Premium Share Posted January 24, 2020 Yet the scrote that was in court yesterday for whacking a a Police Officer round the head (7 times?) with a 2ft long rusty machette was found not guilty of possessing an offensive weapon. Fortunately he was found guilty of other charges, so will (I hope!) get sent down.... 3 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold Enterprisingwestern Posted January 24, 2020 RMweb Gold Share Posted January 24, 2020 20 minutes ago, polybear said: Yet the scrote that was in court yesterday for whacking a a Police Officer round the head (7 times?) with a 2ft long rusty machette was found not guilty of possessing an offensive weapon. Fortunately he was found guilty of other charges, so will (I hope!) get sent down.... That's OK then, I'll shoot people with a rusty gun, should get away with that?!! Mike. 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold TheSignalEngineer Posted January 25, 2020 RMweb Gold Share Posted January 25, 2020 Thinking of changing attitudes these days, at the age of about 18 I was working with the Birmingham Pole Gang. We were taking down a bit of route where a new sewer was being thrust bored under the track directly under one of the poles. We had put a cable in and rigged one of the adjacect poles as a new terminal pole. I was deputed to go next morning via my grandad's cabin at Curzon Street to borrow a suitable saw to cut the affected poles down. I walked up from Curzon St via the Bull Ring Open Air Markets to catch the train from New St to site carrying a five-foot long two-man crosscut. No-one gave me a second glance. 6 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
'CHARD Posted January 25, 2020 Share Posted January 25, 2020 8 hours ago, TheSignalEngineer said: at the age of about 18 I was working with the Birmingham Pole Gang. Still active, but with a different agenda and rules. 1 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nearholmer Posted January 25, 2020 Share Posted January 25, 2020 Pour encourager les autres. 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Premium dhjgreen Posted January 25, 2020 RMweb Premium Share Posted January 25, 2020 19 hours ago, Dava said: In a previous century, I bought my first Swann Morton scalpel from Kings Cross Models at age 15, with blades. No questions. Today in Sainsbury's I had a lengthy inquisiton by the pharmacist when I asked for Cocodamol, including intrusive questions about why I wanted it and what alternatives I had tried. Have to think carefully about where to buy scalpel blades....Squires at model rail shows I guess. Knife crime among youths is horrific and nowhere more so than Lambeth area. Dava Cocodamol contains the opioid codeine that is probably why the questioning. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Administrators Phil Parker Posted January 25, 2020 Administrators Share Posted January 25, 2020 Much as I love the Ian Allan shop, someone made a mistake here and they got caught. If it offends you, would you have the same indignation if the culprit had been your local open all hours corner shop? Knife crime is a big hit in the media at present with hysterical headlines every day. That means that those tasked with putting a sticking plaster on the problem have to be seen to be doing something. A high-ish profile case will remind a few others that they are supposed to ask the question when selling knives, that's the point of it all. 2 5 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
jchinuk Posted January 25, 2020 Share Posted January 25, 2020 20 hours ago, Dava said: Today in Sainsbury's I had a lengthy inquisiton by the pharmacist when I asked for Cocodamol, including intrusive questions about why I wanted it and what alternatives I had tried. Dava While annoying, there was a case in our local paper where a bloke was touring local pharmacies buying a bottle of some 'over the counter' cough medicine, thereby accumulating litres of the stuff. He was banned from all the local pharmacies. It's annoying for the likes of you & me, but some idiot with serious issues spoils it for everyone. jh 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Premium Martino Posted January 26, 2020 RMweb Premium Share Posted January 26, 2020 Here in the US we cannot get any codine cough syrup over the counter - you have to get the doctor to prescribe it, unlike in the UK. Because of course you may use it to do damage to yourself. You can however buy guns of any description without background checks or registration (here in Florida). In the UK you can’t buy Melatonin. My understanding, from a doctor friend, is that it can’t even be prescribed! Here you can buy it in supermarkets. Funny old world eh? 2 2 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Premium polybear Posted January 26, 2020 RMweb Premium Share Posted January 26, 2020 8 hours ago, Martino said: You can however buy guns of any description without background checks or registration (here in Florida). What's even more worrying is that you can also buy "Tannerite" in those same shops with no licence or permit etc. (some States can't sell it). https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tannerite Take a look on Youtube for some videos of people messing with the stuff... https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DjlOEhUr4Ys https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=S6V0S1m5a7U 1 1 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Premium boxbrownie Posted January 26, 2020 RMweb Premium Share Posted January 26, 2020 10 hours ago, Martino said: Here in the US we cannot get any codine cough syrup over the counter - you have to get the doctor to prescribe it, unlike in the UK. Because of course you may use it to do damage to yourself. You can however buy guns of any description without background checks or registration (here in Florida). In the UK you can’t buy Melatonin. My understanding, from a doctor friend, is that it can’t even be prescribed! Here you can buy it in supermarkets. Funny old world eh? That’s wrong, Melatonin is even prescribed for children in some case of sleep problems. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RLBH Posted January 26, 2020 Share Posted January 26, 2020 21 hours ago, Phil Parker said: Much as I love the Ian Allan shop, someone made a mistake here and they got caught. If it offends you, would you have the same indignation if the culprit had been your local open all hours corner shop? Knife crime is a big hit in the media at present with hysterical headlines every day. That means that those tasked with putting a sticking plaster on the problem have to be seen to be doing something. A high-ish profile case will remind a few others that they are supposed to ask the question when selling knives, that's the point of it all. This is the crux of it: the political mindset of 'Something must be done. This is something, therefore it must be done.' It is possible both for the shop to have been breaking the law (they were) and for the law to be an ass. Unfortunately, the more difficult life is made for the majority of us who are responsible members of society, the easier it is to say that efforts are being made. Actually addressing problems would cost too much, offend someone, or both. 3 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Administrators Phil Parker Posted January 26, 2020 Administrators Share Posted January 26, 2020 14 minutes ago, RLBH said: It is possible both for the shop to have been breaking the law (they were) and for the law to be an ass. Unfortunately, the more difficult life is made for the majority of us who are responsible members of society, the easier it is to say that efforts are being made. I'm curious how having to confirm your age when you buy a knife if you look under 18 is a great difficulty. For most of us, the question never arrises. 14 minutes ago, RLBH said: This is the crux of it: the political mindset of 'Something must be done. This is something, therefore it must be done.' The mindset is driven by hysterical headlines in the press. You see a rise in stabbings, people get upset, politician looks for a fix because if they don't the press take them to task. Sadly, the options for fixing this are more complex than you can cover in large letters on a tabloid front page. 3 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mark Saunders Posted January 26, 2020 Share Posted January 26, 2020 What next Burt’s Burger van in court for giving away a free plastic knife & fork with every meal? 1 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Titan Posted January 26, 2020 Share Posted January 26, 2020 To me this seems on the verge of entrapment. It seems the product that was bought was specifically chosen to increase the chances of a knife being accidentally sold - it was part of a toolkit rather than a knife or knife set, and although the shop should have realised the toolkit contained a knife, one has to ask that if a craft knife by itself had been chosen, would the shop have refused the sale? Did they target any other shops with a similar strategy and this was the only one that they managed to buy a knife? Or did they just try this out on Ian Allan? 5 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Premium melmerby Posted January 26, 2020 RMweb Premium Share Posted January 26, 2020 On about age checking. At the Christmas Market in Brum a "yoof" came up to one of the drinks stalls and the first thing the server asked was "Have you ID?" Once shown, the customer then asked for a fancy alcopop drink that I'd never heard of. Sorry we don't have that. Then he asked for something else (Cider?) No we don't have that. Then he asked another drink. No. don't have that. Then the customer walked away. The fact that the stall had a price list and it only had Beer and Gluhwein on it hadn't registered with the customer.. 1 3 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
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