jonny777 Posted February 5, 2020 Share Posted February 5, 2020 52 minutes ago, Pteremy said: Affordability depends on personal circumstance and inclination. But it is possible to compare 'cost' over time. Apparently (according to inter web) £1 in 1980 equates to £4.18 in 2018. So working backwards a £300 DMU would have been just over £70 in 1980. I don't know what the Lima 117 cost circa 1980, but I bet that most people would have considered a Bachmann version, with the quality of detail and operational functionality, DC or DCC (if it could have been utilised), worth the extra. I don't know what a Lima 117 cost in 1980 either, but I do remember buying a Lima Warship and that cost £10 brand new from a discount retailer. 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Administrators Phil Parker Posted February 5, 2020 Administrators Share Posted February 5, 2020 4 hours ago, Buckley Wells said: Some will point to the finally delivered the RnR crane, but at what price due to all that over clever engineering. Ok, maybe you can pose it at work. But most will buy it to run as part of a model breakdown train, not to raise the jib and leave it posed on a diorama in corner of the layout. When Hornby delivered the ridiculous moving cab doors on the Class 50 you didn't feel you were paying a fortune for something you would rarely, if ever actually use. To pick up on the crane, it's what's called a "Halo Product" - everyone looks at it and goes "Wow!" and this reflects well on the rest of the range. The clever engineering you decry is there to make the thing work, something it does very well. Anyone who has had a play is hugely impressed with the thing. I doubt you'd get the same effect with a locomotive and it's a million miles away from a set of opening diesel doors. Even if you don't buy one, you look at it and want one. More importantly, we were told today that the red livery has sold out and the others are very close. Some people are obviously happy to own something that they will rarely use, in the same way that people own supercars they don't drive. From Bachmann's point of view, they made an amazing product that has sold and presumably made them a profit. If that's bad business, someone needs to explain to me what good business is. 3 10 1 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold Enterprisingwestern Posted February 5, 2020 RMweb Gold Share Posted February 5, 2020 3 hours ago, Foden said: Bachmann are stuck between the devil and the deep blue sea here. Wrong shade of blue though! Mike. 5 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
MarkSG Posted February 5, 2020 Share Posted February 5, 2020 1 minute ago, Phil Parker said: More importantly, we were told today that the red livery has sold out and the others are very close. Some people are obviously happy to own something that they will rarely use, in the same way that people own supercars they don't drive. From Bachmann's point of view, they made an amazing product that has sold and presumably made them a profit. If that's bad business, someone needs to explain to me what good business is. I'm glad I bought one, then! I saw one "in the wild" for the first time on a layout at the Stafford show last weekend. It really does look good in the right setting, even just parked in a siding. I think there are plenty of opportunities to use them, even without needing to invoke Rule 1. Pretty much by definition, a crane went where it was needed. It's not difficult to posit a scenario where the crane is either en route to or from a job, or parked in a siding close by. I think the real danger is not that they will be unused, but that they will become a cliche - just like buses on bridges and weddings at lineside churches! 1 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
caradoc Posted February 5, 2020 Share Posted February 5, 2020 2 hours ago, GreenGiraffe22 said: I shall be 70 in 41 years, what do we think the retirement age will be by then? Optimistically, life expectancy will have risen so that the length of time spent retired remains the same. Pessimistically, Logan's Run will have become fact ! 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
wombatofludham Posted February 5, 2020 Share Posted February 5, 2020 8 minutes ago, Phil Parker said: To pick up on the crane, it's what's called a "Halo Product" - everyone looks at it and goes "Wow!" and this reflects well on the rest of the range. The clever engineering you decry is there to make the thing work, something it does very well. Anyone who has had a play is hugely impressed with the thing. I doubt you'd get the same effect with a locomotive and it's a million miles away from a set of opening diesel doors. Even if you don't buy one, you look at it and want one. Actually I don't. However, that's not the point - the fact it appears to have sold well can only be good news on two fronts, one, it makes money for Bachmann which can be re-invested in new models some of which I might actually want, and two, it does rather give lie to the accepted wisdom that UK modellers aren't prepared to pay for nice models. I know there are plenty of modellers who are on a tight budget but if an expensive piece of model railway tomfoolery like a crane, with all the bells and whistles, can sell at the price it has, it does suggest that there is a section of the modelling fraternity who are less price sensitive. It is a nice model, I just prefer to reserve the budget for the incoming Class 117 dmus! 7 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
stewartingram Posted February 5, 2020 Share Posted February 5, 2020 1 hour ago, melmerby said: An old catalogue from 1980 (online with manually appended prices) has the DMU motor as £14.65, so about £20 with the trailer. I can't vouch for the accuracy of that. Probably find it more interesting to compare prices/wages in the 50s/60s? 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
truffy Posted February 5, 2020 Share Posted February 5, 2020 (edited) 56 minutes ago, TomE said: I think it's to indicate that the models announced yesterday (during winter) will arrive in spring. The Spring announcements will be for items due to arrive in Summer and the announcements & club event for those will be held on the 5th May in Bristol which was confirmed at today's event. 55 minutes ago, AY Mod said: I'd slapped Q1 on the topic when I kicked it off yesterday but changed it when the theme of the presentation today centred upon what is to arrive during Spring. But the announcement itself (the subject of the thread title) was made in winter/Q1*. Actual delivery will depend on several factors, only some of which might be 'expected'. 29 minutes ago, Phil Parker said: Even if you don't buy one, you look at it and want one. I would've bought one if it were the right era/region. IMO, a crane isn't pretty enough to apply rule#1, but could definitely be accommodated beyond that. I'm curious to see what OR comes up with. * edit: incidentally, I think Qn, where n is an integer in the range 1-4, is less nebulous than season. I assume that B plan one announcement per quarter. Edited February 5, 2020 by truffy Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Premium newbryford Posted February 5, 2020 RMweb Premium Share Posted February 5, 2020 Comparison of price/wage over the years is not a true measure. The quality and fidelity of the models has increased by a more than significant amount. (Unless you're referring to the Bachmann PAA.........................) 1 3 3 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Star-rider Posted February 5, 2020 Share Posted February 5, 2020 It’s terribly unfashionable (and somewhat frowned upon) to say “nothing for me”, so I won’t for fear of being put in the Naughty Corner. I seem to have been waiting for eternity – well at least the span of two Prime Ministers and governments – for my Bachmann sound fitted Earl, only to find that having given up on it and blown my pocket money on another Dapol Railcar and Youchoos decoder it has immediately turned up in the shops. Oh well, maybe next month if there are still any around. It is understandable why Bachmann are proposing to announce as they are; I’ve resisted jumping in on the Long Delay Joke bandwagon as they are generally unfunny like references to Germans, sun loungers and beach towels, however it is a fact that the way they have announced previously and failed to deliver has caused exasperation and loss of credibility to their business, it needed to be brought into line. I like Bachmann product, the locomotives generally run smoothly and reliably. Three of my four purchases last year were from other manufacturer’s ranges and all of them seem unable to circuit my layout without repeated poking in the bunker. The Bachman stuff is pricy but I wish they had made the 1363, Dean Goods and 48XX, I’d have been happy to pay an extra 15-20% to watch them go round without human intervention. As for price, I try to apply a little context. The discounted figure for the sound fitted Earl is a tolerable £220 but as others have suggested on here I will be looking to write off that cost over perhaps 20 years of ownership. One could spend the money on: Two and a half sleeves of Chesterfield Red King Size (will last about 25 days) A ticket for you the wife and two kids to a Premier League match (will last about 90 minutes plus a break in the middle to consume a pie*) An evening at the opera (will last about 3-4 hours unless you cop for Wagner’s Ring Cycle in which case you may have to shell out for counselling afterwards) About eight tank-fulls of fuel / days out on a Kawasaki GTR1400 (lasts around 64 hours including doing tourist stuff when off the bike. This is my favoured British Summer Time hobby, the model railway gets left alone but these days, deep down I am wondering if I am really running round burning fossil fuels for my own pleasure or just to annoy Greta Thunberg). Happy Bachmann Day to all, I hope there’s something that you want at a price you are prepared to pay. Pete. *Pie not included in price. Terms and conditions apply. 10 2 3 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold TheSignalEngineer Posted February 5, 2020 RMweb Gold Share Posted February 5, 2020 7 minutes ago, newbryford said: Comparison of price/wage over the years is not a true measure. The quality and fidelity of the models has increased by a more than significant amount. (Unless you're referring to the Bachmann PAA.........................) The price of the Dublo West Country in the final catalogue would be about £120 now based on the inflation index figure. Compare the look of that to the current Hornby offering. The only better thing about the Dublo version is that mine still runs perfectly nearly 60 years after my Dad gave up smoking until he had saved up enough money to buy it for my Christmas present. 2 2 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Premium Clive Mortimore Posted February 5, 2020 RMweb Premium Share Posted February 5, 2020 (edited) 2 hours ago, maico said: Turnout was inversely proportional to age group. A well known phenomenon in referendums which limits their accuracy as a reflection of views held. With a so called secret ballot knowing the age of the voter surely is unknown. Therefore that is only a sample poll and should not be taken as being accurate. Back to Bachmann I have been waiting for the class 24/1 in green with small yellas for so long I am sure its first advertised price was 52 bob and 11 pence. Edited February 5, 2020 by Clive Mortimore 3 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold TheSignalEngineer Posted February 5, 2020 RMweb Gold Share Posted February 5, 2020 4 minutes ago, Clive Mortimore said: I have been waiting for the class 24/1 in green with small yellas for so long I am sure its first advertised price was 52 bob and 11 pence That would probably be the price if Triang had made one around the time BR started using SYP. 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold The Johnster Posted February 5, 2020 RMweb Gold Share Posted February 5, 2020 29 minutes ago, MarkSG said: I'm glad I bought one, then! I saw one "in the wild" for the first time on a layout at the Stafford show last weekend. It really does look good in the right setting, even just parked in a siding. I think there are plenty of opportunities to use them, even without needing to invoke Rule 1. Pretty much by definition, a crane went where it was needed. It's not difficult to posit a scenario where the crane is either en route to or from a job, or parked in a siding close by. I think the real danger is not that they will be unused, but that they will become a cliche - just like buses on bridges and weddings at lineside churches! It’s an exceptional example of what volume RTR can achieve, but.... It’s a breakdown crane, and by definition never ‘parked in a siding close by. It has two states of existence; at depot on standby ready at short notice for call out, or on a call out; when it is on route to the call it is class 1, and as soon as it is stood down it returns to depot to resume standby duty as class 9. While it is attending the call, and if it is booked out on an engineering job, cover must be provided by another depot’s crane and crew until ‘our’ crane is back at its home depot on standby. 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Premium John M Upton Posted February 5, 2020 RMweb Premium Share Posted February 5, 2020 I think it is interesting that we are now one day past the announcement, eleven pages up and discussion of the products actually announced is negligible almost to the point of non-existence!! We used to have lots of thread directions as people discussed design diagrams, allocations, variations, which one was going to be the first to buy a £100+ model and take a razor saw to it, etc. Mind you over on the N scale equivalent thread, the response can be summed up as 'Oh, is that it' followed by silence as a tumbleweed goes by... 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Premium Clive Mortimore Posted February 5, 2020 RMweb Premium Share Posted February 5, 2020 1 hour ago, AY Mod said: I'd slapped Q1 on the topic when I kicked it off yesterday but changed it when the theme of the presentation today centred upon what is to arrive during Spring. My daft side of my brain got all excited about a Q1, the one at the Bluebell is one of my favorite preserved locos. Then the slower but more sensible side of my brain woke up and reminded the other side I don't model the Southern. Nothing wrong with the Southern, lovely EMUs, but you cannot model everything, but we all know Bachmann should , well they should model want I want, now and at a price my wife can afford to buy them for me. If anyone takes this post serious then you are dafter than me. 2 2 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold TheSignalEngineer Posted February 5, 2020 RMweb Gold Share Posted February 5, 2020 6 minutes ago, John M Upton said: Mind you over on the N scale equivalent thread, the response can be summed up as 'Oh, is that it' followed by silence as a tumbleweed goes by... Not as many N scale modellers? 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Administrators Phil Parker Posted February 5, 2020 Administrators Share Posted February 5, 2020 The best thing I saw today? * The new Trumpeter model of the Titanic. At 1347mm long, the one-piece hull is amazing. @AY Mod was jiggling with excitement so much that he couldn't take a clear photo... Over 1200 parts including etched details and a full LED lighting set. Yours for just under £400. When our video from the day appears, hopefully there will be more images, but seriously, this is a LOT of kit. *OK, there were some cracking trains and very interesting tools and scenic materials too and I'm more likely to hand over money for those. 9 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
truffy Posted February 5, 2020 Share Posted February 5, 2020 20 minutes ago, Phil Parker said: The best thing I saw today? * That is a biiiiig planter! We expect some cracking tomatoes this year, Phil! 1 3 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold Budgie Posted February 5, 2020 RMweb Gold Share Posted February 5, 2020 1 hour ago, Phil Parker said: The new Trumpeter model of the Titanic. At 1347mm long, the one-piece hull is amazing. @AY Mod was jiggling with excitement so much that he couldn't take a clear photo... Over 1200 parts including etched details and a full LED lighting set. Yours for just under £400. When our video from the day appears, hopefully there will be more images, but seriously, this is a LOT of kit. Is that a fully working model of the Titanic? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bernard Lamb Posted February 5, 2020 Share Posted February 5, 2020 1 hour ago, Phil Parker said: The best thing I saw today? * The new Trumpeter model of the Titanic. At 1347mm long, the one-piece hull is amazing. @AY Mod was jiggling with excitement so much that he couldn't take a clear photo... Over 1200 parts including etched details and a full LED lighting set. Yours for just under £400. When our video from the day appears, hopefully there will be more images, but seriously, this is a LOT of kit. *OK, there were some cracking trains and very interesting tools and scenic materials too and I'm more likely to hand over money for those. I can't wait to see the model of the iceberg. Bernard 1 2 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Steamport Southport Posted February 5, 2020 Share Posted February 5, 2020 The Bill Tidy classic. Jason 3 4 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
woodenhead Posted February 5, 2020 Share Posted February 5, 2020 1 hour ago, Phil Parker said: The best thing I saw today? * The new Trumpeter model of the Titanic. At 1347mm long, the one-piece hull is amazing. @AY Mod was jiggling with excitement so much that he couldn't take a clear photo... Over 1200 parts including etched details and a full LED lighting set. Yours for just under £400. When our video from the day appears, hopefully there will be more images, but seriously, this is a LOT of kit. *OK, there were some cracking trains and very interesting tools and scenic materials too and I'm more likely to hand over money for those. I hope you have a big bath to play with that. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold tomparryharry Posted February 5, 2020 RMweb Gold Share Posted February 5, 2020 3 hours ago, caradoc said: Optimistically, life expectancy will have risen so that the length of time spent retired remains the same. Pessimistically, Logan's Run will have become fact ! I quite like Logans Run, with Ms. Agutter running about. Knowing my luck, I'll be bumbling about like Peter Ustinov...... 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Widnes Model Centre Posted February 6, 2020 Share Posted February 6, 2020 2 hours ago, Phil Parker said: The best thing I saw today? * The new Trumpeter model of the Titanic. At 1347mm long, the one-piece hull is amazing. @AY Mod was jiggling with excitement so much that he couldn't take a clear photo... Over 1200 parts including etched details and a full LED lighting set. Yours for just under £400. When our video from the day appears, hopefully there will be more images, but seriously, this is a LOT of kit. *OK, there were some cracking trains and very interesting tools and scenic materials too and I'm more likely to hand over money for those. Having attended the Retailers Day on Tuesday, we were informed that some of the items we were looking at would be with us soon. Fast forward to five minutes ago..... Emailed invoice, the Titanic will be with us later today. Just need to find a place to display it. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts
Create an account or sign in to comment
You need to be a member in order to leave a comment
Create an account
Sign up for a new account in our community. It's easy!
Register a new accountSign in
Already have an account? Sign in here.
Sign In Now