RMweb Premium brushman47544 Posted February 7, 2021 RMweb Premium Share Posted February 7, 2021 12 hours ago, Gwiwer said: Of note the Colour-Rail image referred to is of a syp prototype unit with the smaller headcode numerals red buffet car and yellow first class stripes. The Bachmann release is of a plain green production-series unit (with matching early large headcode numerals) and no red stripe. No yellow first class band either. The images of the actual model are what you get. Unless the Bachmann images and description are incorrect certain retailers are showing the wrong details based upon either earlier information or the Colour-Rail image. Those who want a matching 12-car rake beware. Bachmann’s own description of the model still refers to an SYP so not the retailers’ fault. I’m not interested in plain green, I was expecting the model as described. I wonder why they’ve changed it? 2 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold Oldddudders Posted February 7, 2021 RMweb Gold Share Posted February 7, 2021 1 hour ago, brushman47544 said: Bachmann’s own description of the model still refers to an SYP so not the retailers’ fault. I’m not interested in plain green, I was expecting the model as described. I wonder why they’ve changed it? But the page is Bachmann's own website, not a retailer......... I suggest that adding an SYP and red and yellow cantrail stripes is not the biggest of challenges for a modeller. 2 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Premium Gwiwer Posted February 7, 2021 RMweb Premium Share Posted February 7, 2021 3 hours ago, Oldddudders said: But the page is Bachmann's own website, not a retailer......... I suggest that adding an SYP and red and yellow cantrail stripes is not the biggest of challenges for a modeller. Correct in some cases Ian but not all. A wider issue has been picked up by the Modelling Officer of the Southern Electric Group who has flagged Hornby's recent green coaches for similar inconsistencies. They are illustrated by Hornby as having BR crests which is wrong other than for brake vehicles. The models themselves correctly are devoid of these embellishments but the inconsistency (error if you like) might put a few people off for whom the detail matters. I wouldn't want to paint lines along a unit I have paid around £400 for, neither would I wish to add the small yellow panel. The headcode also requires changing. The headcode font is wrong for syp - approximately - because the date the roller blinds were changed does not necessarily coincide with the date the livery was modified but may do. It is also harder to remove yellow / red areas if one was expecting a plain green unit and the syp / lined version arrived. Whist some of these details can be "fixed" by some of us under the general heading of "modelling" it is the inconsistency and uncertainty which is more the issue here. Just what are we to receive for our money? 3 2 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
JSpencer Posted February 7, 2021 Share Posted February 7, 2021 3 hours ago, Gwiwer said: Whist some of these details can be "fixed" by some of us under the general heading of "modelling" it is the inconsistency and uncertainty which is more the issue here. Just what are we to receive for our money? I ended up changing my order for the 2-HAP twice as I wanted one as it ran in the south east. First I went for the NSE thinking it would SE division. Then it was said it would be south western division and the blue-grey in south eastern div so I called and changed my order. Then finally we see the painted samples and first reviews and the Blue Grey is a South Western unit while the NSE is a South Eastern. Poor KMRC having to cope with me changing my mind twice after the initial order. With the BEP, it will be blue-grey regardless so maybe I won't have the same issues here. But can feel for those expecting a green BEP at a certain period only for it to be changed. 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
letterspider Posted February 7, 2021 Share Posted February 7, 2021 You are fortunate to read print that small - my eyes are so bad I might need to move to G scale - 2 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Class 158 productions Posted February 7, 2021 Share Posted February 7, 2021 Will these feature the new Plux 22 dcc interface? Or am I right in saying this is the decade old cep with a new buffet? 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Venator Posted February 7, 2021 Share Posted February 7, 2021 Looks good. I'd actually say given the price of the 2HAP the 4BEP isn't as outrageous as it might first seem. I'm looking to plug the gap in my eras on my layout, I have a 4CEP in green and 4VEP in NSE so a 4BEP in blue and grey will do nicely. 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Premium spamcan61 Posted February 7, 2021 RMweb Premium Share Posted February 7, 2021 (edited) 2 hours ago, Class 158 productions said: Will these feature the new Plux 22 dcc interface? Or am I right in saying this is the decade old cep with a new buffet? I think they've re-worked the electrics to use 1 decoder and multi-pin connectors between coaches like the 117. Edited February 7, 2021 by spamcan61 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Premium Gwiwer Posted February 7, 2021 RMweb Premium Share Posted February 7, 2021 Let's just say that questions have been asked of Bachmann by several well-known retailers and others regarding the 4-Bep. Will it be an all-green 7005 or a green syp 7003? Possibly both although the catalogue number is currently the same suggesting two green versions are not about to appear together. Watch this space ..... Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Georgeconna Posted February 7, 2021 Share Posted February 7, 2021 On 10/02/2020 at 21:59, John M Upton said: When you consider that at one point 4-CEP's were being practically given away for a shade under seventy sheets, that price is eye watering... Quite, I;ll let the Stampe run in @ full price and maybe, just maybe will pick one up at the ol bargain prices at a later stage or even at one of the Actions. Never knew I needed one till know though! 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold Geep7 Posted February 7, 2021 RMweb Gold Share Posted February 7, 2021 I can't remember which connectors they have used on the 2-Hap, as this might point towards what they plan with the 4-Bep. As regards the price.... £440 does seem rather a lot of money compares to the 4-Cep. However, I'll only ever need 1 4-Bep. Just as a slight comparison, recently I've got into modelling Spanish outline, and managed to pick up an Electrotren (Hornby) 3-car DMU with DCC Sound, which is of a similar quality to the Bachmann Cep/Bep, and the price at Hornby is £380, roughly what the Bep will be in the shops, sans any DCC.... though admittedly the Best is one coach more. Just thought it worth a rough comparison of perhaps something with a similar run size. 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold RFS Posted February 7, 2021 RMweb Gold Share Posted February 7, 2021 29 minutes ago, Geep7 said: I can't remember which connectors they have used on the 2-Hap, as this might point towards what they plan with the 4-Bep. The 2-HAP has the same connectors as the 2-EPB, plus it also requires a 21-pin decoder. There does seem to have been an improvement in the lighting: you now have a switch on the underside whereby you can turn off the interior lights and/or the head codes. This is similar to what was done with the Kernow class 205s. I was hoping the poor lighting in the 4-CEPs (especially the motor coaches which are extremely dim) would be rectified in the 4-BEP by using the same circuitry as the 4-TC. The latter's lighting is perfect - 4-way connectors so every axle acts as a pickup for the decoder and lights. But I will wait and see before thinking about ordering. I am also one those who picked up a couple of 4-CEPs a few years ago from Hatton's for £69 each. Those were the days...... 2 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Paul.Uni Posted February 7, 2021 Author Share Posted February 7, 2021 1 hour ago, Gwiwer said: Will it be an all-green 7005 That is what the 2021 combined volume shows Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Premium Gwiwer Posted February 8, 2021 RMweb Premium Share Posted February 8, 2021 Confirmation from Bachmann via Kernow MRC that the green one has been revised to match the images. Namely it is a plain green unit with large headcode numerals. Anyone with a green syp on order for whom that makes a difference is advised to contact their retailer. 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
andyman7 Posted February 8, 2021 Share Posted February 8, 2021 21 hours ago, RFS said: I am also one those who picked up a couple of 4-CEPs a few years ago from Hatton's for £69 each. Those were the days...... Cheapest of all were Green SYPs in Modelzone for £52 each. But they were rapidly going under so that price was clearly unsustainable 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Premium brushman47544 Posted February 8, 2021 RMweb Premium Share Posted February 8, 2021 54 minutes ago, Gwiwer said: Confirmation from Bachmann via Kernow MRC that the green one has been revised to match the images. Namely it is a plain green unit with large headcode numerals. Anyone with a green syp on order for whom that makes a difference is advised to contact their retailer. Did Bachmann have lots of the previous 4-CEP release unsold in its warehouse? Were they sent back to China to be reworked with the SO replaced by the new Buffet coach and renumbered, rather than manufacture all new as originally planned? Would explain the late change of green livery... No I don’t actually believe that. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Premium Gwiwer Posted February 8, 2021 RMweb Premium Share Posted February 8, 2021 56 minutes ago, andyman7 said: Cheapest of all were Green SYPs in Modelzone for £52 each. But they were rapidly going under so that price was clearly unsustainable I think I paid £99 for each of my green ones which were both significantly discounted; much more for the b/g ones at more like retailer's shelf prices 47 minutes ago, brushman47544 said: Did Bachmann have lots of the previous 4-CEP release unsold in its warehouse? Were they sent back to China to be reworked with the SO replaced by the new Buffet coach and renumbered, rather than manufacture all new as originally planned? Would explain the late change of green livery... No I don’t actually believe that. Neither do I But then I also find it hard to believe that a unit which has only required one coach out of four to be r&d's from new has taken so long to bring to market and now costs far more - in comparative terms - than its earlier sisters did. Even allowing for the steep rises in Chinese production costs. There are some tweaks including, I understand, a better and more evenly-balanced lighting system and possibly use of a more recent power-bar coupler than the somewhat flimsy originals but this is still fundamentally 75% a green 4-Cep which could make use of written-down tooling. 2 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
miles73128 Posted March 1, 2021 Share Posted March 1, 2021 On 08/02/2021 at 20:10, andyman7 said: Cheapest of all were Green SYPs in Modelzone for £52 each. But they were rapidly going under so that price was clearly unsustainable Now £499 RRP. Gulp. 2 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Class 158 productions Posted March 1, 2021 Share Posted March 1, 2021 36 minutes ago, miles73128 said: Now £499 RRP. Gulp. Looking at the recent model railways direct sale, 117s,121s, 2-HAPs, EPBs,158s, CEPs etc were all in there. These new Bachmann units whilst fabulous don’t seem to have sold in some retailers. I can see these going the way of the original CEP and being reduced heavily 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stevelewis Posted March 1, 2021 Share Posted March 1, 2021 I seem to remember buying 4 CEPs for around £80ish around 12 months after original launch or am I just dreaming 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold RFS Posted March 1, 2021 RMweb Gold Share Posted March 1, 2021 1 hour ago, Stevelewis said: I seem to remember buying 4 CEPs for around £80ish around 12 months after original launch or am I just dreaming Little bit OTT there - I only paid £69 each for my last two! 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold adb968008 Posted March 1, 2021 RMweb Gold Share Posted March 1, 2021 4 hours ago, miles73128 said: Now £499 RRP. Gulp. Makes the 4TC look a bargain at nearly half the price. 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stevelewis Posted March 2, 2021 Share Posted March 2, 2021 19 hours ago, RFS said: Little bit OTT there - I only paid £69 each for my last two! Ah yes I remember now £69, at one time we had 11 4-CEPs , but not so many now! Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
JSpencer Posted March 3, 2021 Share Posted March 3, 2021 On 01/03/2021 at 21:47, adb968008 said: Makes the 4TC look a bargain at nearly half the price. Kernow are currently doing a 4-TC and a class 33/1 for just under £300. 1 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
phil gollin Posted July 3, 2021 Share Posted July 3, 2021 . A Rails e-mail says that these are due in shortly. Then we can see if it has a small yellow panel, or not (but they are still ridiculously over-priced). . Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
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