Hornby Series pre war Tank Wagons

[Bassettblowke]

Well after that quick soirée into my dim and dismal past it was time to have a rustle in my box of rattle cans this turned up a can of blue paint that looked like it might fit the bill for the chassis and ladder and end bars.

This might not be the pro restorers approach to a restoration project but it has one big redeeming virtue it doesn’t incur any cost over and above the money spent on the previous project which was an Austin Somerset Dinky toy. Initially the rusty can didn’t look that promising but it still proved up to the task. See results below.

 

Edited February 21, 2020 by Bassettblowke

[Bassettblowke]

After taking the plunge and going for a random blue colour I saw little point in forking out for one of the recommended whites unless I had to. Rooting about in the old spray cans turned up a large can of appliance white and a very small can of Tamiya TS-7 Racing White. The Tamiya was my favoured choice but the can only contained a miserly 100 ml when new,  what was in it now was guess work, nevertheless I took the plunge. To make the situation even more dicey I botched the first coat leaving a series of runs, these were flatted out using 1200 wet and dry paper and the next coat went on, this coat flagged up how bad white was at obliterating the grey primer (should have used a white primer) I was now at the stage where the can would only spray when held perfectly level so the level was obviously low. Next coat is the last chance saloon stay tuned for a right old mess and start again or something acceptable hopefully.

Edited February 21, 2020 by Bassettblowke

[Bassettblowke]

Well the final coat is on, I should make clear that it was the final coat for no other reason than the can ran dry which wasn’t altogether unexpected, one of the drawbacks to the penny pinching approach I’ve taken with this project. The finish in places has a slight orange peel effect caused at the end by the paint running dry and excess propellant entering the paint stream.One of the conclusions I’ve drawn from this is a hobby type air brush would more than likely have done a better job.

The gloss paint finish not unexpectedly flagged up  every minor dent and imperfection again a draw back of my penny pinching, a better prep and application of an appropriate filler like Milliput would have produced a better job. Still all said and done so far so good, I never set out to create a perfect restoration just a usable runner.

the following pictures show it loosely assembled, the other major issue was how would the colour choice pan out, to be frank at the moment I am undecided. As always it depends a lot on the light, at night time under artificial light it jars my eye in day light I think it looks fine. Time will tell, I am yet to decide whether or not to give it a finishing coat of varnish and of course that may well alter the colour perception again. Next step is to acquire the decals/transfers and the missing parts sadly cart before the horse as usual.

Any comments more than welcome I'm not an experienced restorer and I am more than happy to take on board criticism.

 

Eagle eyed Hornby fans will spot the white tank supports/cradle which should be blue, these will eventually be painted blue they were left on whilst spraying the tank to make the job more stable as it tended to spin when being sprayed.

 

Edited February 22, 2020 by Bassettblowke

[Porkscratching]

Looks really great to me, I don't think a pristine finish is the point on these anyway. With decals it's going to look brilliant!

Coincidentally I'm just off to buy some paint stripper and grey primer with a view to re assembling some of my junk spares box parts into a wagon or two... so looks like you've inspired me there !!

[Nearholmer]

I like the colours.

 

I’m not sure whether or not they accurately match Hornby, but slightly muted colours tend to look better Than very stark primaries anyway.

 

This is Hornby’s best tin wagon, IMO, although I like the slightly later W-irons better, and I think you are doing it justice.

[brianusa]

Excellent!  Now its seen in its naked state, its amazing how much the decals make to this wagon into a most interesting vehicle.  No wonder it's so popular and commands a high price, especially with a box.  (Who needs a box though!)

    Brian.

[Il Grifone]

These tank wagons were quite expensive, resulting in relatively  low sales and few survivors, hence today's high price. The survival rate of boxes is even lower....

[Bassettblowke]

A breather now from the nuts and bolts jobs whilst I try to source the parts required to finish the task, everyone is probably aware that there are other Tinplate United Dairies tank wagons to be had here’s some pictures for comparison. The early Ace version has the brake gear fitted and is only slightly smaller than the original Hornby version, The ETS/B/Lowke version is noticeable smaller but a personal favourite the finish is top drawer. Also noticeable is the Ace version is White whilst the ETS model is Cream other differences as well in colour and fittings and transfer positioning but I like them all.

Edited February 23, 2020 by Bassettblowke

[Nearholmer]

I too like the modern BL one. It’s pretty close to the real, 1930s, BL one, which was even better than the contemporary Hornby.

 

Unfortunately, I don’t have a milk tanker, but this should give an idea for the quality of the 1930s BL tanks, i.e. very good indeed. A bit ‘weathered’, and the other side more so, but too good to strip.

 

 

Edited February 23, 2020 by Nearholmer

[Nearholmer]

Here’s a stolen picture of the milk tank, with replacement iron wheels by the looks of it.

 

I wonder if it’s varnish that makes them that lovely colour.

 

For completeness, Darstaed also made/sold tin 4-wheel milk tanks, although possibly not in UD livery.

 

 

[Bassettblowke]

Agreed that vintage Bassett Lowke tank is the bee’s knees dread to think how much they go for nevertheless I will be keeping my eyes peeled.

[Nearholmer]

You can buy one now, if you're feeling flush https://thestationmastersrooms.co.uk/catalogue/product-details.aspx?id=J34077&t=Bassett+Lowke+O+Gauge+Vintage+GW+United+Dairies+Milk+Tanker+Wagon

 

I guess its not sold because people who are prepared to go that high prefer to wait for one in more original condition.

 

Edited February 23, 2020 by Nearholmer

[Bassettblowke]

When I look at prices like that I always think of the great pile of junk I could buy for the same amount. Horses for courses  but not for me.

[Nearholmer]

Yes. I'm not into too many resto projects, much as I'd like to be, because of limited spare time, but that is an awful lot to pay for one wagon. The Gargoyle one above cost me £36, in a bundle with an unusual orange-livery French Hornby petrol tanker, which I was able to sell on for £20. The dealer thought both were Hornby, and based his price on what he usually sold Hornby petrol tankers for. A very rare instance of me sealing a good deal!

[Il Grifone]

It's another in the mould of our 'friends' Gostude and Cartmel, with a highly inflated idea of the value of their wares....

"It has had some restoration paintwork which apart from this all else does look to be original. "  translates as, " Some white paint has been slapped all over the tank".

 

Still the price has been reduced from £229.99 to £149.99....

Edited February 24, 2020 by Il Grifone

[Nearholmer]

Kevin Finch (The Station Master) is a very reliable, widely trusted trader, whose sale prices (which often aren’t the same as his advertised prices, because he is open to offers) are always fair, below the highest around, and he turns over a heck of a lot of stock as a result ........I don’t think you’ll hear a bad word said about him in old-0 circles.
 

So, he might have started this one high and be in the process of seeing what the market will bear, but it isn’t fair to compare him with a well-known NW eBay trader, whose prices are a standing joke in old-0 circles.

 

(as as satisfied customer only)

 

Kevin (a different Kevin)

[Bassettblowke]

I too found the description off putting and the drastic price reduction even more so. Operating in the world of tat as I do  this particular trader wouldn’t be my first port of call. I would suggest that anyone requiring a handle on prices register with the various auctioneers who specialise in toy sales and look through their back catalogue of sale prices bearing in mind any additional fees. Vectis  is one that springs to mind but there are others. I suspect much of the vintage stock sold by online retailers is trawled in from auction houses and promptly sold on, by dealing direct with the auctioneers you are effectively cutting out a layer of middleman.

Looking at the example for sale I wouldn’t be prepared to pay more than £45 -50 and even then at that price I would be agonising over it, yes I could be tempted but on past performances would more likely walk on by  as in all probability another one would be sure to crop up in better condition.

 

Edited February 24, 2020 by Bassettblowke

[Nearholmer]

9 minutes ago, Bassettblowke said:

suspect much of the vintage stock sold by online retailers is trawled in from auction houses and promptly sold on, by dealing direct with the auctioneers you are effectively cutting out a layer of middleman.

Very definitely.

 

The two downsides of auction-buying, though, are that it consumes time (not so much by on-line bidding, of course), and lacks certainty. 
 

if neither of those is a negative for the individual, it’s certainly cheaper, even when all the (not insignificant) fees are counted-in.

 

The other factor is the sheer satisfaction derived from fixing-up an ‘old crock’, but that again comes at a large price in terms of time ....... I’ve got a drawer-full of half-finished clockwork and 1930s electric loco restorations to prove that time is a factor! If ever I can move from ‘semi’ to ‘fully’ retired, I will have plenty to keep me from doing the Jobs on the DIY list.

 

 

Edited February 24, 2020 by Nearholmer

[Il Grifone]

I wasn't saying that any of the dealers I mentioned was untrustworthy in any way (they wouldn't still be around if that were the case!). It's just that their prices are rather on the high side.

[Nearholmer]

“I wasn't saying that any of the dealers I mentioned was untrustworthy”

 

I didn’t mean to imply that either, although perhaps I accidentally did.

[Porkscratching]

I wouldn't, and couldn't, pay fancy prices for stuff, I've been buying job lots of stuff ( which helps on postage too) and getting a few good wagons ( tho nothing 'rare') plus lots of useful spares in most cases.

I too like tinkering etc, I've got enough bits to create a few 'unique' wagons from parts, always fun!

[Porkscratching]

Duplicated post

Edited February 24, 2020 by Porkscratching

[Bassettblowke]

I hope to see some of your tinkering’s it’s always good to see other people’s endeavours and often they form the basis for my new projects. I used to concentrate on modern tinplate but since retirement I have a lot more time to pursue the renovation side of the hobby and this is increasingly becoming the norm for me. I haven’t bought anything bright and shiny for some time now the last item bought second hand from Paul Lumsdon was a Corgi/ green Bassett Lowke liveried 7plk open which I had long hankered after to complete a set already having the Peckett, the Tank and the flat . Most old tinplate items in less than perfect condition are affordable, post war Hornby and some B/Lowke particularly so. Pre war tinplate in less than collectible condition can also be had quite cheaply if and only if it’s bought in the right place.

The three tankers I recently purchased at what I thought was a fair price bearing in mind there condition,  I am sure they would based on the high price of a pristine example have been touted for considerably more by other dealers. I don’t consider them a bargain just a purchase at a fair price. 

Edited February 24, 2020 by Bassettblowke

[Porkscratching]

I've been playing with assembling a breakdown crane van, all from oddments I have in stock, I know the actual Hornby one has a 'vanfit' body, but I thought it'd look well with a brake type body instead. I've got a pair of bogies coming hopefully with one of my job lots, easy enough to fabricate a freelance pair otherwise.

Obviously serious collectors look away now !

[Bassettblowke]

Love it, wouldn’t life get tedious if everything was the same, it always makes me scratch the old bonce when I see a rake of identical  vans or coaches go past with identical roofs. I am on occasion very tempted to suggest painting at least one a different shade of grey or white to break up the monotony. I don’t think such a suggestion would go down well in the circles that value uniformity. On the flip side I could imagine people casting a caustic eye over my pile of tat and suggesting I smarten it up. 
it’s a great hobby and there is room for all, even a misfit like me at least I hope so.