KRModels announce N gauge SHARK ballast brake van

[mdvle]

2 hours ago, AY Mod said:

 

Technically so as KR have not lifted any embargo but there's stuff all point me trying to stuff that genie back in the bottle so if anyone wants to create a topic they can do so. I just try to do the honourable thing but I wonder why sometimes.

 

Because the world works in a better way if we all attempt to do the right thing, and thus your efforts are appreciated even if the reality of the publishing world often makes it a thankless task.

[KR Models]

8 hours ago, AY Mod said:

 

Technically so as KR have not lifted any embargo but there's stuff all point me trying to stuff that genie back in the bottle so if anyone wants to create a topic they can do so. I just try to do the honourable thing but I wonder why sometimes.

We do appreciate your work, and we are lifting the embargo on the Shark. Unfortunately, these things happen, and now we just have to make the best of it.

[Steadfast]

Hi guys at KR!

I'm pleased to hear that a ready to run shark has become a realistic prospect once more.

From memory, the DJM first shot had a few detail errors and some chunky detail, especially when compared to the N Gauge Society kit. I know Dave was a fan of separate wire handrails for example, but the ones on his sample were huge!

So, is there scope for tweaks to the CAD, or are we passed the point of no return?

Also, is there any chance of the later life plywood sided vans appearing?

Thanks!

 

Jo

[KR Models]

8 hours ago, Steadfast said:

So, is there scope for tweaks to the CAD, or are we passed the point of no return?

No we can still make tweaks and changes to the CAD, nothing is set in stone right now. If you do see anything wrong that you'd like to correct us on, we are open to suggestions.

 

8 hours ago, Steadfast said:

Also, is there any chance of the later life plywood sided vans appearing?

If you could send me an example of what you are referring to, it would be most appreciated. Email me at research@krmodels.co.uk and I can see what I can do.

[46444]

22 hours ago, Steadfast said:

 

I'm pleased to hear that a ready to run shark has become a realistic prospect once more.

 

 

Totally agree with Jo here. 

 

Looking forwards to seeing this progress. 

 

 Cheers, 

 

Mark

[Steadfast]

 

 

On 24/02/2020 at 23:38, KR Models said:

If you could send me an example of what you are referring to, it would be most appreciated. Email me at research@krmodels.co.uk and I can see what I can do.

Email sent as requested.

 

Now, I know I'm only one voice of a potential customer, and my view maybe counter the general view of the public but I do believe these pictures of where DJM had got to really do highlight the downside of separate handrails.

The real things are very slender, those on the test sample are so chunky your N scale staff couldn't get their hands round it! The early body style Farish 66 (any with the 4 door bodyshell) really does show how with finesse of tooling moulded handrails can look excellent, even down to the retain bolts top and bottom. Also, plastic ones can be removed and replaced with wire should the customer wish, but if the chunky RTR wire handrails are replaced with something more scale then there's still a large diameter hole to fill. I guess I'm saying that to me separate parts used in the right place enhance the model, but using them "just because" doesn't always result in the best looking model.

 

As I said, a preference for finely moulded handrails on most applications is my opinion, and it may be completely different to the majority, but I thought it worth raising the point and seeing what you thought and others in general?

All the best

 

Jo

 

[mdvle]

1 hour ago, Steadfast said:

Now, I know I'm only one voice of a potential customer, and my view maybe counter the general view of the public but I do believe these pictures of where DJM had got to really do highlight the downside of separate handrails.

 

I wouldn't take what DJM showed in the year prior to going out of business as representative of what may be done by KR Models - those images don't look like a factory done model to me with the poorly drilled holes and the damaged paint finish around the holes.

[Steadfast]

Very true, but even with the best tolerances for suitably rugged RTR manufacture, you'll still have rather chunky handrails, especially once painted white, witness Dapol 66, Farish 08, Farish 47 for example.

 

Jo

[KR Models]

Howdy fellas, just a quick heads up. The expression of interest form is now live on our website!

You can sign up today on our website here: https://krmodels.co.uk/collections/n-gauge/products/n-gauge-shark-brake-van

 

Any questions or issues, please do not hesitate to contact us.

 

 

[woodenhead]

5 minutes ago, KR Models said:

Howdy fellas, just a quick heads up. The expression of interest form is now live on our website!

You can sign up today on our website here: https://krmodels.co.uk/collections/n-gauge/products/n-gauge-shark-brake-van

 

Any questions or issues, please do not hesitate to contact us.

 

 

Check your spelling on the front page of your website - BRAKE.

 

Also the Shark EOI mentions the King for which there is no mention elsewhere on the site.

[KR Models]

1 minute ago, woodenhead said:

Check your spelling on the front page of your website - BRAKE.

 

Also the Shark EOI mentions the King for which there is no mention elsewhere on the site.

Fixing the spelling now, thank you.

 

The King hasn't been officially launched yet, so there isnt an EOI yet.

[Littlethorpe]

I just signed up but there was no option to indicate the fact that I would be interested in quantity 2.

[bluedepot]

i have signed up

 

i'll take 3! (2 dutch and 1 loadhaul)

 

tim

[Shropshire Lad]

I'm in for a couple. As Littlethorpe says above the page indicates that they'll only be produced if enough EOIs are made. 

This doesn't seem likely if people who want to buy more than one can't communicate that.

Cheers Colin

[mokjumbo]

I would want at least 2,so I`m in agreement with this.

39 minutes ago, Shropshire Lad said:

I'm in for a couple. As Littlethorpe says above the page indicates that they'll only be produced if enough EOIs are made. 

This doesn't seem likely if people who want to buy more than one can't communicate that.

Cheers Colin

 

Edited February 27, 2020 by mokjumbo

[Colin_McLeod]

If KR Models read this thread they may pick up the quantity issue. It might be better to e mail them to let them know for sure.

[John M Upton]

Registered!  I'll probably be in the market for two as well depending on liveries offered.

Edited February 27, 2020 by John M Upton

[KR Models]

We are aware people would want more than one, this is just to gauge how many customers we will have for this specific product. Its to figure out how much demand is there, not to see how many models we will have to make, that comes later from actual orders.

[mdvle]

33 minutes ago, KR Models said:

We are aware people would want more than one, this is just to gauge how many customers we will have for this specific product. Its to figure out how much demand is there, not to see how many models we will have to make, that comes later from actual orders.

 

As long as you are taking into consideration the discrepancy in the numbers that is fine, albeit I think a bit different than how other crowd funders have done their expressions of interest.

 

The concern of those who have posted is the (from the customer point of view) is that you treat each expression of interest as only 1 model sold.  That may be a fair assumption when dealing with a unique loco like the GT3 or Fell, but isn't necessarily true for something like a goods wagon.

[KR Models]

2 minutes ago, mdvle said:

 

As long as you are taking into consideration the discrepancy in the numbers that is fine, albeit I think a bit different than how other crowd funders have done their expressions of interest.

 

The concern of those who have posted is the (from the customer point of view) is that you treat each expression of interest as only 1 model sold.  That may be a fair assumption when dealing with a unique loco like the GT3 or Fell, but isn't necessarily true for something like a goods wagon.

We don't. We see each expression as one customer, not one model that they want to order. It is simply to see how much interest is there and if we do want to continue, how viable would it be.

 

It isnt meant to be a 1:1 concrete idea of how many models we are going to sell.

[mdvle]

14 minutes ago, KR Models said:

We don't. We see each expression as one customer, not one model that they want to order. It is simply to see how much interest is there and if we do want to continue, how viable would it be.

 

It isnt meant to be a 1:1 concrete idea of how many models we are going to sell.

 

Good to know, as it appears to be different to how other crowd funders work where they seem look at the number of models people want to judge demand.

[Colin_McLeod]

I'l try to explain using made up numbers to illustrate a point.

 

Breakeven point to make the wagon viable is (say) 1,000 models sold.

 

800 customers express their interest.

 

Unknown to  KR Models, 200 of these customers want 2 wagons and a further 100 customers want 3 wagons. Total number of wagons 1,200 well above the break even point, but remember KR Models dont know this as they are only counting customers.

 

KR Models make a decision not to proceed as they did not get the 'necessary' 1,000 expressions of interest.

 

Result; Model not made, 800 disappointed people;  profit from a run of 1,200 wagons missed.

 

 

Keith, you have explained the reasoning behind your expression of interest format but I urge you to instead reconsider the format.

 

 

 

 

 

 

Edited February 28, 2020 by Colin_McLeod
typo

[Calnefoxile]

 

All,

 

If you want to ask KRModels directly then you will have the opportunity at Trainwest http://www.trainwest.org.uk/#Trade , where they have a stand.

 

I'll certainly be talking to them about the Shark.

 

Cheers

 

Neal.

[chris p bacon]

6 hours ago, Colin_McLeod said:

I'l try to explain using made up numbers to illustrate a point.

 

Breakeven point to make the wagon viable is (say) 1,000 models sold.

 

800 customers express their interest.

 

Unknown to  KR Models, 200 of these customers want 2 wagons and a further 100 customers want 3 wagons. Total number of wagons 1,200 well above the break even point, but remember KR Models dont know this as they are only counting customers.

 

KR Models make a decision not to proceed as they did not get the 'necessary' 1,000 expressions of interest.

 

I think I can see both sides of this.  

 

Looking at past crowdfunding threads there were quite a few who would post that they were going to order multiple numbers but never actually put their money down as a firm order.  

If KR count the number of potential customers and they get near to the number required then they might think the risk is worthwhile as a percentage of those will order multiple models taking it over the model number threshold.

 

If they just look at the potential model numbers ordered then just 18% of those EOI not following through with a firm order drops the figure below your 1000.  I would think that 18% dropout is on the low side.

  

[Colin_McLeod]

My figures were made up so not necessarily representative.  

 

To make an informed decision the numbers of possible customers and the numbers of wagons they might order would be information that would be available if the EoI form asked the question.

 

As you say, there are two sides to this.  How can a decision to manufacture be based on only having information from one side only?