57XX Pannier Tank models

[alexl102]

Hi,

Has anyone other than Bachmann produced an oo gauge RTR 57xx pannier tank such as 7714, 5775, L92? Hornby's models seem to be either the half-cab or the triang 87xx. I'd like to get one but there don't seem to be all that many models out there, which suprises me given that it's a pretty iconic class.

Thanks

[Miss Prism]

9 minutes ago, alexl102 said:

Has anyone other than Bachmann produced an oo gauge RTR 57xx pannier tank

 

No.

 

[The Stationmaster]

55 minutes ago, Miss Prism said:

 

No.

 

Not strictly correct Miss P as you have overlooked the Gaiety 57XX.  Not exactly puissant for the 21st century of course having been introduced back in 1950 but as a direct answer to the OP's question it does fit the bill.

 

http://www.binnsroad.co.uk/railways/gaiety/index.html

[melmerby]

Hornby R051

EDIT

Ignore me

The Hornby was the old Triang 8750

Edited March 2, 2020 by melmerby

[Miss Prism]

Fair enough. I hadn't realised that the Gaiety was available in motorised form.

 

[Harlequin]

Interestingly, I recently mentioned the possibility of a modern 57xx model in another thread:

 

https://www.rmweb.co.uk/community/index.php?/topic/123937-Bachmann-94xx/&do=findComment&comment=3851101

 

 

[Tim V]

There was a Japanese brass model - sometime in the 70s.

[mdvle]

2 hours ago, alexl102 said:

Has anyone other than Bachmann produced an oo gauge RTR 57xx pannier tank such as 7714, 5775, L92? Hornby's models seem to be either the half-cab or the triang 87xx. I'd like to get one but there don't seem to be all that many models out there, which suprises me given that it's a pretty iconic class.

 

As they make clear, there are limitations to it and the manufacturers don't rely on it, but the big poll done by volunteers and the gracious contribution of Andy Y seems to indicate that either the Bachmann model is good enough (I am not familiar with it so can't comment), or it isn't viewed as iconic and necessary by others.

 

The 2019 poll had the 57xx/8750 come in as middle polling and 16th spot amongst GWR locos wanted.

https://www.rmweb.co.uk/community/index.php?/topic/148993-results-the-00-wishlist-poll-2019/

 

Of course that doesn't mean somebody won't announce a new model next week/this year/next year, because middle polling items do get announced, and similarly high polling items like a Manor seem to never get chosen.

 

[Gordon A]

Perhaps the question is why are you not happy with Bachman's 57xx pannier?

I would say that it is the best 00 rtr 57xx pannier produced.

 

Gordon A

[The Stationmaster]

3 hours ago, Tim V said:

There was a Japanese brass model - sometime in the 70s.

In fact there were three brass models - a 57XX, an 8750, and a 97XX when they were new they were horribly expensive, I could never afford one.  I haven't seen any for a few years but they used to come up regularly in auctions not so mnay years ago and usually at reasonable prices perhaps because nobody seemed to know what they were - although they might have because everyone I saw was a 97XX

[Steamport Southport]

Korean rather than Japanese. Made by someone called Samhongsa,

 

They also did a Small Prairie. I think most of their products was aimed at the American market.

 

 

 

Jason

[melmerby]

3 hours ago, Gordon A said:

Perhaps the question is why are you not happy with Bachman's 57xx pannier?

I would say that it is the best 00 rtr 57xx pannier produced.

 

Gordon A

Only major drawback is that it is only available with top feed, which precludes early condition.

 

[Welchester]

42 minutes ago, melmerby said:

Only major drawback is that it is only available with top feed, which precludes early condition.

 

 

Also, the cab handrails are wrong for early 5700s.

[The Johnster]

I’d say the Baccy 57xx is about as good as any reasonable person should expect from a volume produced RTR model given that 00 involves necessary compromises with regard to the positioning of splashers and so forth.  I have 2 of them, and have removed the top feed and associated plumbing from one, a faffy job that needs care, but not particularly difficult.  Running is pretty good as a on all my Blue Box locos. 
 

It is simplistic to say that the top feed indicates a later build, but it does preclude early locos in as-built state.  It was introduced on new build locos from about 1932, by which time the 8750 series was in production, but because it takes less time to overhaul a loco than to rebuild and test the boiler before it is certified by the DoT’s inspector, boilers were replaced from stock in order to return the loco to traffic and free the workshop bay.  
 

In practice, this means that boilers with and without top feeds migrated freely between 57xx, 8750s, and 2721 half cabs, and it is difficult to pin down which type of boiler was fitted to any member of these classes except when they were built new.  By the time delivery of the last 8750s was complete in 1950, the majority were top feeds, but as always it is best to work from authenticated and dated photographs of proven provenance when this is possible.  
 

The Baccy 57xx in their various running numbers are correctly carrying top feed fitted boilers for the liveries they are produced in.  The Mainline/Replica GW liveried predecessor is based on 5764 as preserved on the SVR at the time, and this loco had a top feed boiler when it was withdrawn by BR; it may not be correct for the livery it is produced in. 
 

I would avoid the Gaiety model unless the ‘retro’ aspect appeals to you; it is very crude, badly proportioned, and has 8750 type cab windows which are completely incorrect.  I am not qualified to comment on the subject of iconography, but the class was bery large even if you do not include 8750s and other variants (67xx, 6750, 97xx) and widespread across the GW or WR, appearing on the Southern in BR days.  All but the smallest of BLTs from the mid 20s onward need at least one. 

Edited March 2, 2020 by The Johnster

[mdvle]

3 hours ago, Steamport Southport said:

Korean rather than Japanese. Made by someone called Samhongsa,

 

They also did a Small Prairie. I think most of their products was aimed at the American market.

 

Samhongsa was a big maker of brass models for the American market, imported by a variety of different importers, though Samhongsa apparently went out of business about 20 years ago.

[Aire Head]

23 hours ago, mdvle said:

 

Of course that doesn't mean somebody won't announce a new model next week/this year/next year, because middle polling items do get announced, and similarly high polling items like a Manor seem to never get chosen.

 

 

You were saying? 

 

 

[Killybegs]

Mainline back in the day. You used to be able to pick up the bodies for a song.

[melmerby]

7 minutes ago, Killybegs said:

Mainline back in the day. You used to be able to pick up the bodies for a song.

Bachmann going for a song?

https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/Bachmann-OO-Gauge-57xx-Pannier-Tank-No-7752-GWR-Green-Spares-or-Repair/164107431387?hash=item263590addb:g:6dAAAOSwvAReSpyy

 

Mainline body: (Buy It Now £9.99)

https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/170120-03-Mainline-GWR-Green-57xx-Body-Only-No-5764/143504637802?hash=item21698aff6a:g:7bAAAOSwePReIiZj

 

There's even a couple of Gaeity ones if you don't mind the crudity of them

[Norton961]

The Samhongsa Pannier tank is very nice and easy to convert to P4 as it has seperate axleboxes.

I have one converted to P4, I was lucky also being an American modeller i knew  Samhongsa as a maker of fine brass models. I found mine in a box of bits at an exhibition a few years ago covered in a tar brush finish, the result mine for £30.00. If you find one expect to pay closer to £200. They are fitted with a large can motor and seperate gearbox. Mine now converted and repainted as one of Wellington (Salop) allocation 9630. The loco behind is a Bachmann loco repainted and renumbered.

[Norton961]

Some photos of my Bachmann Panniers all renumbered as some of Wellington (Salop) allocation, with both types of cabs. Because they worked services to Crewe, some had overhead warning flashes (as seen on 9630 in the previous post) . The only issue I have with the Bachmann body is that if you fit a scale chassis such as Comet you need to make a boiler bottom.

4693 is a full Bachmann loco with an Ultrascale P4 conversion and runs really well. I have just recently repainted and weathered it. 9774 has a Comet chassis and a boiler bottom and is fitted with a Portescap and needs weathering. 5712 is still a work in progress (hence no number plates and a boiler bottom is required). 

Edited March 4, 2020 by Norton961
Spelling mistakes!

[DCB]

The Bachmann 57XX evolved from a good solid reliable(ish) wagon shifter to a highly detailed flyweight bit of scenery through several iterations.   We retired the old split chassis beast but last session the later 8750 cab Bachmann made such a meal of trying to shift 15 wagons that out came the old one again.  Bit of paint on the wheel rims, thin down the brake gear and she looked quite presentable,  Shame the wheels fall off and wont stay to gauge. The non split chassis early cab with added weight is almost as good as the basic split chassis for pulling and that 8750is going to need weight.    The Gaiety 57XX which looks as much like a 57XX as a red mini looks like a routemaster bus will probably pull two Bachmann backwards.     Oddly enough my Triang 8750 with Hornby Dublo wheels again withdrawn, ran very nicely and very sure footedly when I tried it. Shame its much too wide and has the wrong wheelbase etc

[melmerby]

10 minutes ago, DavidCBroad said:

 the later 8750 cab Bachmann made such a meal of trying to shift 15 wagons that out came the old one again. 

Something wrong with it.

 

I've got 5 (or is it 6 or 7?) solid chassis Bachmanns and they all pull way more than that.

[tomparryharry]

No problems here, either. 25-30 wagons at the last time of running.

[melmerby]

2 hours ago, tomparryharry said:

No problems here, either. 25-30 wagons at the last time of running.

Just tried 4612 with 18 wagons + Brake and it doesn't even slow down on a 1:60/1:100 gradient.

30+2 brake vans (including two bogie wagons) on the gradient, it does slow down a bit.

I'll post a short video later.

Edited March 4, 2020 by melmerby

[89A]

When 8 pin sockets were fitted to Bachmann 57xx and 8750 panniers from about 2005 a fairly large chunk of ballast weight was removed from the left hand pannier in order to accommodate the 36-553 decoder with harness which was then the Bachmann offering. In fact the Hornby R8249 was a better fit.

Since then direct 8 pin decoders such as Hattons 8 pin DCR fit without any need of the void  A good chunk of ballast may then be re-fitted to give better haulage capacity.