Exhibition cancellations (not much to do with that anymore!)

[woodenhead]

The current measures in Scotland has seen the closure of pubs and hospitality across the Scottish Central belt along with a ludicrous only drinking outside policy elsewhere which means there is a hotel by Loch Lomond that can serve you a meal and a soft drink inside but if you want an alcoholic drink you have to go outside.  Something like this is expected in the North of England from next week, so my son may again be out of work, hopefully furloughed but who can say at the moment.

 

The longer these establishments stay closed the more chance they will not re-open, coming back to exhibitions, the longer exhibition spaces are denied the greater the chance the businesses that run them will collapse.

 

Leisure centres don't yet know if they will be included in any future lockdown but as they are only 1% source of infections they shouldn't be, but as they were the last to reopen again who knows what might happen next week.

 

The immense damage to the fabric of society, the economy and relations will last for years, they may announce a vaccine, it may be 50% or less effective and they may announce the battle over, but the impact of the war will last a decade or more.

[Nearholmer]

47 minutes ago, woodenhead said:

The immense damage to the fabric of society, the economy and relations will last for years, they may announce a vaccine, it may be 50% or less effective and they may announce the battle over, but the impact of the war will last a decade or more.

Yep.  
 

Every so often, sh1t happens, and it’s happening now, everywhere (except New Zealand maybe), and on both economic and fatalities, and probably long-term health impacts, scales it appears to be happening particularly badly in the UK.

 

On this one, we definitely chose to get born in the wrong country. Thankfully, on the basis of numerous other factors, we chose our country of birth wisely.

 

Grit our teeth, and tough-it through. The only other option is to emigrate, ideally to a different planet.

[BoD]

25 minutes ago, Nearholmer said:

The only other option is to emigrate, ideally to a different planet.

 

I don't suppose you know of any that are holding a model rail exhibition soon?

[AY Mod]

6 minutes ago, BoD said:

 

I don't suppose you know of any that are holding a model rail exhibition soon?

 

Wrong topic to ask that in.

[woodenhead]

24 minutes ago, BoD said:

 

I don't suppose you know of any that are holding a model rail exhibition soon?

There's likely to be one on Mars one day but no-one will go as it lacks atmosphere.

[AY Mod]

15 minutes ago, woodenhead said:

There's likely to be one on Mars one day

 

Can't see many exhibition managers liking the expenses bill for transport.

[Roger Sunderland]

3 hours ago, woodenhead said:

They expect everyone to change, but do so in ways that actually drives people in the opposite direction and for 99% of people it not an illness that will kill them - that's the awful truth.  Most people will therefore believe, especially under 40, that they have nothing to worry about and it's not their generation that is being impacted.

 

Perhaps the answer is, and HMG are now talking about this, is helping people in the actual vulnerable groups to be safer.  I'm over 50, I have in laws to keep safe, my own father died last November Covid would have really spoilt his quality of life as he only ever ate out.  I am in that more vulnerable group and I know to keep away from people, it not the best thing in life but it has worked for me so far, though having a wife working in schools and an adult child working in the supermarket/commuting on a tram means I know I am not completely safe.  I have a mother in law, shielding since March, only seen her young grandchildren once since then, she's not seen my offspring once.  She is awaiting now a serious operation for an illness unrelated to Covid - she's at risk not having the operation but it may yet get cancelled when in the next two weeks the hospitals switch back to being Covid battlegrounds and all the other things like cancer and other serious illnesses that kill as many or more than Covid get ignored.

 

And yes I am angry, angry that an illness that kills a small number of people is affecting the whole world in such draconian ways, that it is setting up a new normal where no-one will feel safe, that our lives will be monitored ever more, our travel rights curtailed and unemployment will soon be rife because the economy is in tatters and our children will be paying the cost through lost education and taxes when they are earning to pay for all the bailouts.   The elderly and vulnerable will have even less support going forwards as the care sector will face even more cuts in the future as councils and central government are forced to make more savings to help pay off the debts that extremely rich around the work will reap benefit from.

 

Deep breath time and back to work..

 

But they are and encouraging things like snitching on your neighbour, that's out of a 1984 novel or worse from the GDR.

Why is it always the government’s fault? People have forgotten what personal responsibility is. You shouldn’t need to be told to respect what are common sense restrictions. Can’t people forget their selfish lifestyles for a while to protect the vulnerable? Sadly no, it seems the vulnerable will have to pay the highest price in today’s Britain.

[MarcD]

It s sad reflection on British society. It is however nothing new as an imperial power goes into decline its social fabric also goes in to decline too. Egypt, Rome, Byzantium, Ottoman, China (before the revolution) before us and now its Britain and the US's turn.

You can look on the positive side at least we aren't in the US were armed thugs are allowed to walk the streets in the face of law and order and they get away with it with the backing of the one who should never be talked about!  

Marc

[RANGERS]

5 hours ago, AY Mod said:

 

Can't see many exhibition managers liking the expenses bill for transport.

I’d consider exhibiting myself.....but only if there was a return ticket..

[Nearholmer]

You know there’s a law against that? Although perhaps not on Mars.

[BoD]

6 hours ago, AY Mod said:

 

Can't see many exhibition managers liking the expenses bill for transport.

The van hire alone would be astronomical.

[Ravenser]

Will there be a Battlespace layout?

 

And catering will be provided by Mars Bars 

[andyman7]

Noting the amendment to the title. maybe it should be renamed 'Cancellation of normality'.....

[charliepetty]

8 hours ago, AY Mod said:

 

Can't see many exhibition managers liking the expenses bill for transport.

Not far to Mars in Slough.

[Neil]

19 hours ago, PenrithBeacon said:

I don't think they're telling us it's all our fault, but I do think there is a limit to what governments can do and then it's up to the individual citizen.

 

This isn't to say that errors have been made and are still being made, but there is a lot of shear stupidity out there

 

15 hours ago, Roger Sunderland said:

Why is it always the government’s fault? People have forgotten what personal responsibility is. You shouldn’t need to be told to respect what are common sense restrictions. Can’t people forget their selfish lifestyles for a while to protect the vulnerable? Sadly no, it seems the vulnerable will have to pay the highest price in today’s Britain.

 

While we all have our part to play I think it's fair to apportion a good deal of the blame for the mess we're in at the governments door. Rather than trying to catalogue all the many errors I'd point to other countries which share similar cultural values but have done so much better in combatting the virus. First amongst these has to be New Zealand, the stand out performer in managing the impact of CV19. Of course it has a significant natural advantage being an island state, ....... 

[BoD]

12 minutes ago, Neil said:

 

First amongst these has to be New Zealand, the stand out performer in managing the impact of CV19. Of course it has a significant natural advantage being an island state, ....... 

I believe the I.O.M has been successful too...

.... until some workers from the U.K. (surprise, surprise) decided that the rules weren’t for them.  

Edited October 10, 2020 by BoD

[burgundy]

16 hours ago, Roger Sunderland said:

Why is it always the government’s fault? People have forgotten what personal responsibility is. You shouldn’t need to be told to respect what are common sense restrictions. Can’t people forget their selfish lifestyles for a while to protect the vulnerable? Sadly no, it seems the vulnerable will have to pay the highest price in today’s Britain.

The Government might usefully have spent the last 6 months putting in place a Track and Trace system that works effectively; information is key to managing hot spots with least damage. It might have made clear that the rules apply to everyone equally. It might have worked co-operatively with our neighbours to buy supplies and equipment. It might have worked together with local authorities and trade associations to develop responses, rather than issuing top down instructions without notice. I could go on. Sadly, the effect has been to lose credibility with many people at a very critical point in the "unlocking" process. 

I am sorry if this sounds like a political statement, but, having worked in the civil service under every Prime Minister from Heath to Cameron, this Government has not served us well.

This is not to excuse those who do not take personal and social responsibility for their actions; merely to point out that confused messaging and poor leadership compound the problem.

Best wishes

Eric

 

[Nearholmer]

48 minutes ago, burgundy said:

merely to point out that confused messaging

And, hasn’t that been ‘Front and Centre’ as a failing?

 

Quite how it is that next week, when it was literally needed yesterday, we are to have a clearly graded set of ‘alert levels’ with associated precautions/restrictions and (hopefully) support measures, when many countries have had exactly that in place since March, or even earlier, I find really, really, really hard to comprehend.

 

Months and months ago, at the start of the first lock-down HMG launched the bones of such a thing, which was clear and easy to communicate (my kids found out about it themselves and instantly understood it), and then proceeded to completely mess-up the use of it, then junk it altogether, when it would have been so simple to develop it and use it as the core of clear communication.

 

0/10

 

It’s not about politics; it’s about competence.

 

 

[woodenhead]

My son was messaging me last night after work (pub management), furlough will mean a precarious living from November despite there being 5 of them sharing a flat for a not substantial rent.

 

I thought I was angry and dismayed at recent events, he was livid, he said they've put all sorts of things in place to be able to open - I remember he's had to turf people out when they refused to follow rules and he knows his pub is 'covid secure' but the messaging just want's to blame his sector.

 

He's angry because of the mess being made, he doesn't believe he will ever afford to buy, worries about his future savings and life in general.  At least he's been able to make the break from home, my other child is stuck with us on 16 hours per week and no obvious signs of being able to get away.

 

If the young believe they have no future then why on earth will they respect requests from people so remote from their lives, so much so that the Government has had to impose and then increase sanctions on people who mix - whilst potentially allowing rich businessmen to cream money in non existent schemes related to eat out to help out through weak processes.

 

People already believed the future was bleak, but destroyed hospitality, holiday and retail sectors will create unemployment on such a scale we may never escape a minimum wage benefits Britain.  Don't forget Christmas is just around the corner and we have another present to come on 31st December which may compound our problems unless there is a Christmas miracle.

 

I really am down about all this aren't I 

[gr.king]

This pretty clearly IS about politics, and it doesn't require a genius to spot all the posts on here that have come from those who are looking for every possible excuse to have a go at the government because of its political colour. The "class war" theme woven into a number of posts moaning about the government's approach illustrates the political bias of those posts very clearly. The sore losers of 2015, 2016 and 2019 are still sore losers. They whine about the alleged inconsistencies and complications in the rules, yet at the same time Northern metropolitan councils run by a party of their preferred political colour are seeking powers to set their own local rules and procedures, leading to yet more inconsistencies and complications across the country. The Chinese plague isn't the fault of the government. If the government were to go all-out to eradicate the virus, it would totally destroy the economy and everybody would lose. If the virus is ignored as far as possible to preserve the economy, lots of people die or get ill, possibly with lasting effects. a fair number of those who might die of Covid-19 can legitimately be said to be not far from death's door anyway. If the government introduces the simplest possible rules, nationwide, they have too much effect in some areas and not enough effect in others, so harm is done, inconsistent effects of the rules are alleged, and the government is blamed. If more complex, case-specific, area specific rules are introduced, those who quite clearly don't like the government for political reasons and who don't want to follow the rules claim that they can't understand the rules and take that as an excuse to ignore them. 

The government can't do everything for you. The people of this country have to take responsibility for their own actions. If we didn't have ridiculous, de-luxe, human rights laws and rules relating to criminal evidence that give the criminals all the aces, if we hadn't buried the police in a mountain of regulations and paperwork, and if successive governments of various kinds hadn't cut down police numbers to wholly inadequate levels, cut funding to the bone, and re-briefed the police to be a limp "service" instead of a force, then the government might be in a much better position to force the irresponsible virus-spreaders to comply with rules - but we are now paying the price of a chronic lack of discipline.

[AY Mod]

19 minutes ago, woodenhead said:

I really am down about all this aren't I.

 

I understand that (and I certainly get upset/depressed with the whole thing) but we're now in an unsolvable* place where people get upset that a demographic is blamed or that an industry is blamed. The truth is in between with some people and some businesses unwilling or incapable of sticking to the spirit (and letter) of any regulations. Over the summer as any restriction is relaxed or tightened there seems to be many stories of people trying to get around any rules or why it shouldn't apply to them. The majority have complied and applied themselves to the hands dealt but the danger has always been in the minority and now the genie's out of the bottle again the repercussions impact many. Where countries have had more rigid rules and compliance they are in a better position but 'enough' people here didn't want that. Was a summer of 'freedom' worth it?

 

Some may say it's been hard for a government to tackle an unprecedented issue but we all started from the same place at the beginning of the year, some are just better at it than us others.

 

*It seems to be beyond the reach of our present leadership.

 

We will get to a better place but that's reliant on enough people doing the right thing, making the right choices and remembering why we're all going through this and stop being selfish.

[fezza]

It is interesting that according to a well known website a small number of toyfairs are planning to go ahead. One is admittedly outdoors, but is this a chink of light? Could we see hybrid trade events next year with a small number of operational model railways? 

 

I guess much depends on what is said on Monday but I am trying to look for some hope... 

[woodenhead]

I think I have found the source of my anger and it wasn't Covid, it was work related.

 

I've been doing some system migration work over the past week and it was going swimmingly well until Thursday, then I hit some difficulties owing to very old code and it sparked off an imposter syndrome episode that I don't know what I am doing.

 

So my deep rooted imposter syndrome issues surfaced as frustration at the current mess we're in.

 

Now I have figured out where it is coming from I can do something about it, in fact, I am doing something about it, first web page rebuild nearly complete.

[Joseph_Pestell]

17 minutes ago, gr.king said:

This pretty clearly IS about politics, and it doesn't require a genius to spot all the posts on here that have come from those who are looking for every possible excuse to have a go at the government because of its political colour. The "class war" theme woven into a number of posts moaning about the government's approach illustrates the political bias of those posts very clearly. The sore losers of 2015, 2016 and 2019 are still sore losers. They whine about the alleged inconsistencies and complications in the rules, yet at the same time Northern metropolitan councils run by a party of their preferred political colour are seeking powers to set their own local rules and procedures, leading to yet more inconsistencies and complications across the country. The Chinese plague isn't the fault of the government. If the government were to go all-out to eradicate the virus, it would totally destroy the economy and everybody would lose. If the virus is ignored as far as possible to preserve the economy, lots of people die or get ill, possibly with lasting effects. a fair number of those who might die of Covid-19 can legitimately be said to be not far from death's door anyway. If the government introduces the simplest possible rules, nationwide, they have too much effect in some areas and not enough effect in others, so harm is done, inconsistent effects of the rules are alleged, and the government is blamed. If more complex, case-specific, area specific rules are introduced, those who quite clearly don't like the government for political reasons and who don't want to follow the rules claim that they can't understand the rules and take that as an excuse to ignore them. 

The government can't do everything for you. The people of this country have to take responsibility for their own actions. If we didn't have ridiculous, de-luxe, human rights laws and rules relating to criminal evidence that give the criminals all the aces, if we hadn't buried the police in a mountain of regulations and paperwork, and if successive governments of various kinds hadn't cut down police numbers to wholly inadequate levels, cut funding to the bone, and re-briefed the police to be a limp "service" instead of a force, then the government might be in a much better position to force the irresponsible virus-spreaders to comply with rules - but we are now paying the price of a chronic lack of discipline.

 

Everything in life is about Politics or vice versa.

 

Just because people, here or elsewhere, are critical of the Government does not say much about their own party allegiances. Some of the most vocal critics of the UK Government with regard to Covid-19 actions are on the Conservative benches of the House of Commons.

[AY Mod]

10 minutes ago, woodenhead said:

So my deep rooted imposter syndrome issues surfaced as frustration at the current mess we're in.

 

It's understandable that something unrelated sparks the "life's just ****" fire.