Exhibition cancellations (not much to do with that anymore!)

[26power]

5 minutes ago, John M Upton said:

I would expect that the Government will want to cave into the demands of the popular press and ensure (rightly or wrongly) that everything is back up and running with no social distancing etc in time for Christmas (they have already pandered to the tabloids by allowing pointless and totally unncessary things like football and McDonalds) so shows from the start of next year should be all right.

Sorry, just noticed your comment when I looked at recent activity, which I hadn’t done before so rather just diving in.

 

Rather than think football is “pointless and totally unnecessary” why not be a bit more open minded and accept that others have different interests and point of view?  A narrow viewpoint is why some people think an interest in model railways or in real railways etc. is “odd”, a mindset that seems to be changing recently.  
 

Personally I support a football team and am a railway modeller so your view is essentially a criticism of one of my interests.   I don’t “get” the desire for McDonald’s but accept that others obviously have a craving for them and therefore they have a place.

 

Sorry to go off topic but your negative view of football, and therefore of those who are interested in it (more than one or two!), couldn’t pass without comment.  What about a bit of live and let live?!

[Andy Hayter]

3 hours ago, Pete the Elaner said:

 

A vaccine is not the only answer.

A breakthrough was made last week with a drug which inhibited the immune system's dangerous over-reaction.

The NHS are taking plasma donations to extract antibodies. If these can be transfused, they may provide protection.

 

How many have recovered without being tested? Testing was only available to the very ill until recently so there may be millions out there who have recovered.

 

 

A vaccine is indeed not the only answer, but the successes you quote so far are only effective for those who are seriously ill.  These will not change the need for social distancing therefore.  

 

It is also worth remembering that we have had some spectacular failures - Chloroquine and hydroxychloroquine.

 

A break though may come tomorrow.  It may never come.   We should not try to double guess.

 

Until it or a vaccine come along social distancing will need to stay in place - probably 1m and not 2m once the UK level of new cases falls to levels found in most of the rest of Western Europe.

 

France is now gathering information covering your point about how many people have antibodies which we believe and hope will provide immunity.  Typical numbers for individual departements (counties) range from around 10% up to towards 20% and is being heralded as an indication of how far we have come.  Unfortunately it ignores the maths that it means that 80-90% of the population have no immunity.  I doubt that the UK will be overly different.

[NHY 581]

2 hours ago, John M Upton said:

I would expect that the Government will want to cave into the demands of the popular press and ensure (rightly or wrongly) that everything is back up and running with no social distancing etc in time for Christmas (they have already pandered to the tabloids by allowing pointless and totally unncessary things like football and McDonalds) so shows from the start of next year should be all right.

 

McDonald's are an employer of many people. With the resumption of trading they can bring staff back into work. They also have a large supply chain which in turn provides employment, for example, dairy farmers who provide milk.

 

So it's not pandering, it's economics and livelyhood. 

 

Try explaining to those involved that it's totally pointless. 

 

Rob. 

Edited June 19, 2020 by NHY 581

[melmerby]

The latest research from Italy has shown that Covid-19 was already circulating there early December 2019 as sewage samples from Dec 18th had Covid-19 genetic material in them.

That is weeks before the first reports of sickness from it and when it was first thought to have entered the country.

That along with the fact that at the start the UK had at least 1300 identified separately imported cases, mostly from Europe, before anyone realised what was happening suggests it was probably well established in Europe & here earlier than original estimates.

US academic research has suggested it may have been circulating in China as much as three months before officially recognized

 

From that I would hope the number of people affected and recovered and now with antibody immunity is much greater than current estimates.

That will help recovery of all the currently curtailed activities but only if enough are tested to get more accurate information.

 

Edited June 19, 2020 by melmerby

[Barry O]

Model Railway Exhibitions will return at some date i  the future.

 

A lot of smaller trdaers who attend shows but are doing a lot of onternet based business will still attend shows.

Trade does not cover all of the costs at a Railway Exhibition 

Layouts will be needed for shows in the future.

Wether we get a vaccine is open to debate. So best to get some form of test that works.

 

Suggest you all stop blethering on a out shows and get some modelling done. Buying from your local model shop and/or specialist supplier helps the trade.

 

Have any of you done any modelling in between worrying about shows? Unless you organise a reasonably sized show what have you to worry about? 

[caradoc]

5 hours ago, John M Upton said:

I would expect that the Government will want to cave into the demands of the popular press and ensure (rightly or wrongly) that everything is back up and running with no social distancing etc in time for Christmas (they have already pandered to the tabloids by allowing pointless and totally unncessary things like football and McDonalds) so shows from the start of next year should be all right.

 

Others have already responded regarding football (and I agree with their replies), one further point to make is that McDonalds have only opened for drive-through customers, the sit-in restaurants are still closed. Personally I would not dream of driving out specially and queueing up for a cheeseburger, but as has also been said we do not all have to have the same interests or urges.

 

[Paul.Uni]

Also Mcdonalds (and KFC, Burger King, Greggs etc.) did not have to close for takeaway, home delivery or drive thru, just the dine in area had to close. That was entirely their choice, not the governments, to completely close their branches.

[snitchthebudgie]

57 minutes ago, Barry O said:

Have any of you done any modelling in between worrying about shows? Unless you organise a reasonably sized show what have you to worry about? 

 

I've done more modelling in the past three months than the past five years!  And I'm an exhibition manager, who has valued this thread, red herrings and all, to get a feel of what people think - in all their extremes.

[melmerby]

1 hour ago, Barry O said:

Model Railway Exhibitions will return at some date i  the future.

 

 

 

Suggest you all stop blethering on a out shows and get some modelling done. Buying from your local model shop and/or specialist supplier helps the trade.

 

 

Unfortunately in some areas these are rarer than hen's teeth, so online it has to be.

 

 

Have any of you done any modelling in between worrying about shows? Unless you organise a reasonably sized show what have you to worry about? 

I've been working on Arduino projects for my layout

Have finished the distance sensor for trains approaching a buffer stop

 

Now working on a DCC servo controller using a 16 output shield.

 

 

Edited June 19, 2020 by melmerby

[Oldddudders]

Exhibitions are the public face of our hobby. They are immensely important, even if one feels that most of the visitors already have the modelling virus. The news that Warley Club have cancelled this year is sad but utterly sensible. We simply cannot predict what life will feel like in the 4th quarter of the year, and the scrum that is Warley - so I hear, I've never been, my loss not theirs! - is a very long way from where expert advisers recommend we should behave. 

 

As Barry O says, getting down and dirty with our own layout is where we should be right now, and my aching knees attest to various track remodellings in the fiddle yard, moving controls for 10 sets of points, installing two CCTV systems and generally getting on with it. I hope you have been similarly productive. 

[TheSignalEngineer]

1 hour ago, Barry O said:

Buying from your local model shop

Wish I had one, it's about 7 years since my nearest one closed. Now it's at least 45 minutes drive to the nearest. By public transport it takes 2 hours each way. Fortunately there is a local art shop which stocks some modelling paints, filler, glues, etc.

For most railway stuff ordering online is my only option, have used four members on here in the last month.

[Guest Half-full]

5 hours ago, NHY 581 said:

 

McDonald's are an employer of many people. With the resumption of trading they can bring staff back into work. They also have a large supply chain which in turn provides employment, for example, dairy farmers who provide milk.

 

So it's not pandering, it's economics and livelyhood. 

 

Try explaining to those involved that it's totally pointless. 

 

Rob. 

My next door neighbour is a drummer in a punk band, when her band is not on tour she works in McDonalds to keep the income coming in, with this pandemic she has had no income - she is on a zero hours contract so is not eligible for furlough payments.  She for one is glad to have McDonalds opened back up - she says she's never been busier with all the "fat f******s queuing for over an hour for a mangled monkey burger (her words!)"! 

 

 

[ardbealach]

It has been interesting to read about the various thoughts on where we will be with future exhibitions.  As a regular exhibitor, with cancellations having been received over the summer and into the autumn, I await with interest if the other shows in the diary this side of Christmas will actually go ahead.   

 

It would be an interesting feedback for us all if we knew how the modeller oldies, and the younger modellers, feel about attending

exhibitions.  Leaving aside for a moment those who have been instructed to stay isolated, or those who are in the vulnerable group,  do the oldies hold the view that we have had our three score years and ten and we just want to get on with attending, or do they have some reticence?  How do the younger modellers, who are in the lower risk  group as I understand it, feel about attending?

 

Personally as someone in his mid seventies I would be quite happy to attend exhibitions if the government were to allow large groups to assemble such as in football stadia, pubs and restaurants.  (AM)

[Guest Half-full]

18 minutes ago, ardbealach said:

It has been interesting to read about the various thoughts on where we will be with future exhibitions.  As a regular exhibitor, with cancellations having been received over the summer and into the autumn, I await with interest if the other shows in the diary this side of Christmas will actually go ahead.   

 

It would be an interesting feedback for us all if we knew how the modeller oldies, and the younger modellers, feel about attending

exhibitions.  Leaving aside for a moment those who have been instructed to stay isolated, or those who are in the vulnerable group,  do the oldies hold the view that we have had our three score years and ten and we just want to get on with attending, or do they have some reticence?  How do the younger modellers, who are in the lower risk  group as I understand it, feel about attending?

 

Personally as someone in his mid seventies I would be quite happy to attend exhibitions if the government were to allow large groups to assemble such as in football stadia, pubs and restaurants.  (AM)

I know modellers in both camps, the older ones are climbing the walls to get back out to both visit and exhibit at shows, the youngers ones seem to be more drama-queen about it (a couple in particular are preppers as it is - strange folk in this hobby!)

 

Personally, Im dying to get back out there.  Im 50, have had pneumonia a few months back, but cannot wait to get back out and see my modelling friends, good layouts, talk to and buy from traders and meet new people

[andyman7]

53 minutes ago, ardbealach said:

It has been interesting to read about the various thoughts on where we will be with future exhibitions.  As a regular exhibitor, with cancellations having been received over the summer and into the autumn, I await with interest if the other shows in the diary this side of Christmas will actually go ahead.   

 

It would be an interesting feedback for us all if we knew how the modeller oldies, and the younger modellers, feel about attending

exhibitions.  Leaving aside for a moment those who have been instructed to stay isolated, or those who are in the vulnerable group,  do the oldies hold the view that we have had our three score years and ten and we just want to get on with attending, or do they have some reticence?  How do the younger modellers, who are in the lower risk  group as I understand it, feel about attending?

 

Personally as someone in his mid seventies I would be quite happy to attend exhibitions if the government were to allow large groups to assemble such as in football stadia, pubs and restaurants.  (AM)

I'll be there like a shot. 

[john new]

2 hours ago, ardbealach said:

... cut

.  Leaving aside for a moment those who have been instructed to stay isolated, or those who are in the vulnerable group,  do the oldies hold the view that we have had our three score years and ten and we just want to get on with attending, or do they have some reticence?  How do the younger modellers, who are in the lower risk  group as I understand it, feel about attending?

 

As a late middle ager nearing my 68th birthday my wife (66) and I are currently keeping a very low, and safe, profile as much as possible. That will continue for a long while after things are officially eased so as to see how the land lies re any second wave. The problem for the non-gung-ho will be that when things are eased distancing will become nigh on impossible for those wishing to continue it. I say that as it  can be hard even now when 2m is supposed to be observed, when those around you are ignoring the guidance.

 

My next scheduled shows in the diary out with the SLS Promo stand are currently Ally Pally 2021, then obviously York (for the reason you can see from my sig'). I won't be in a rush to go to any public gatherings except small family groups earlier than those until we see how the situation has evolved after the autumn school resumption dates (As announced today) and then the Christmas/New Year season.

Edited June 19, 2020 by john new

[adb968008]

6 hours ago, snitchthebudgie said:

 

I've done more modelling in the past three months than the past five years!  And I'm an exhibition manager, who has valued this thread, red herrings and all, to get a feel of what people think - in all their extremes.

i’m the opposite, my career tends to be busy when times are in crisis. In 20 years, only Sept 2008 and Sept 2001 have I previously been this busy.

Any spare time is spent doing the weekly shop, which takes hours now and whats left is with family.

Modelling gone out of the window for me at the moment, though today for the first time since March, Ive seen a locomotive...
 

i took my daughter out for a spin to see 37254, and she took this image, in the nice freshly trimmed cuttings west of Coulsdon.

Tomorrow promises to be even better, there might be a 66 working an engineers train to my local station (we survive on a diet of EMUs on my line)... so if I cant get to the show, let the show come to me.

 

Edited June 19, 2020 by adb968008

[Dunsignalling]

12 hours ago, ardbealach said:

It has been interesting to read about the various thoughts on where we will be with future exhibitions.  As a regular exhibitor, with cancellations having been received over the summer and into the autumn, I await with interest if the other shows in the diary this side of Christmas will actually go ahead.   

 

It would be an interesting feedback for us all if we knew how the modeller oldies, and the younger modellers, feel about attending

exhibitions.  Leaving aside for a moment those who have been instructed to stay isolated, or those who are in the vulnerable group,  do the oldies hold the view that we have had our three score years and ten and we just want to get on with attending, or do they have some reticence?  How do the younger modellers, who are in the lower risk  group as I understand it, feel about attending?

 

Personally as someone in his mid seventies I would be quite happy to attend exhibitions if the government were to allow large groups to assemble such as in football stadia, pubs and restaurants.  (AM)

Personally, as someone in his late sixties (and in what I consider to be better-than-average health for my age), I'll be quite happy to do any of those; with the exception of the football, of which I've strived to remain oblivious since joyfully cremating my boots upon leaving school.

 

But only after the "eager beavers" have had three months or so to test the safety thereof on my behalf.

 

The government is presently (IMHO) being forced (perhaps understandably) to loosen things off at a rate heavily influenced by economic and political pressure. The respective definitions of what is allowed and what is safe are likely to diverge as a result. 

 

Unless and until events or medical advances prove my caution to be excessive, I'm planning to lie relatively low for the rest of 2020.

 

John

Edited June 20, 2020 by Dunsignalling

[Roger Sunderland]

16 hours ago, Barry O said:

Model Railway Exhibitions will return at some date i  the future.

 

A lot of smaller trdaers who attend shows but are doing a lot of onternet based business will still attend shows.

Trade does not cover all of the costs at a Railway Exhibition 

Layouts will be needed for shows in the future.

Wether we get a vaccine is open to debate. So best to get some form of test that works.

 

Suggest you all stop blethering on a out shows and get some modelling done. Buying from your local model shop and/or specialist supplier helps the trade.

 

Have any of you done any modelling in between worrying about shows? Unless you organise a reasonably sized show what have you to worry about? 

well said Barry. Get on and do some modelling. You never know, when it’s finished, and if it’s good enough you may want to exhibit it in a few years time!.

Ive also done more modelling in the last 3 months than I’ve ever done before - everything I’ve needed has been available on line.

[TEAMYAKIMA]

4 hours ago, Roger Sunderland said:

Well said Barry. Get on and do some modelling. You never know, when it’s finished, and if it’s good enough you may want to exhibit it in a few years time!.

I've also done more modelling in the last 3 months than I’ve ever done before - everything I’ve needed has been available on line.

 

Whilst I have absolutely no wish to dispute those sentiments, I have to say that for me personally it's the complete opposite.

 

I still work 3 days a week and from the day I returned from Warley I worked on my layout EVERY day (including Xmas day) and one one occasion from as early as 05.30 and on one occasion for 17 hours straight without a lunch break in order to make a load of improvements for my next exhibition which was to be Aly Paly. But now that I furloughed from work I haven't done any work at all on the layout for weeks.

 

WHY? Because there are no exhibitions - all my bookings until Peterborough are cancelled and so without the incentive of an exhibition deadline I've done nothing for about 8 weeks. My layout can only operate at exhibitions, it is 100% exhibition only and if I could operate it home I wouldn't because without an audience what is the point of operation?

 

Now I fully realise that I may be the ONLY person in the country with that outlook and I don't want to take this further off topic by discussing/debating that outlook in this thread - all I'm saying is that for me personally NO EXHIBITIONS = NO HOBBY.

 

 

Edited June 20, 2020 by TEAMYAKIMA

[Barry O]

TeamYakima.. I am sorry that you miss exhibitions so much but perhaps you could have been doing repair/rework of stock and perhaps thinking about building a small test plank to keep you going. Having a layout which can only be set up for exhibitions has major drawbacks ..you could try  to ensure you and the layout are as ready as possible to go to the next show,

 

I like exhibitions but without using my time to prepare stock  the layouts would be very samey". I like to have new locos and stock for the layouts I help with as well as my half finished one at home.

 

Baz

[PaulRhB]

24 minutes ago, TEAMYAKIMA said:

and so without the incentive of an exhibition deadline I've done nothing for about 8 weeks. My layout can only operate at exhibitions, it is 100% exhibition only

I’m using the incentive of deadlines next year to drive on some projects so rather than rushing around madly near the show it’s less frenetic and there’s time to stand back and assess over a few days and just keep attending to the details. One of the things you’ve brought up in your thread is the difference in your perception to the ‘punters’ so maybe giving yourself the time to stand in front of the board and look at it a day later might help spot those things that can be tweaked before the show?

 

24 minutes ago, TEAMYAKIMA said:

 

and if I could operate it home I wouldn't because without an audience what is the point of operation?

Like you say that’s your particular view of the hobby. To me operation is part of the fun which is why I like the Freemo style where operation takes precedence over finer detail because it can operate as a miniature railway as soon as the track is complete. I prefer a finished scene and would want it for public display but shows are probably only 10% of the fun of the hobby for me. 

 

24 minutes ago, TEAMYAKIMA said:

 

24 minutes ago, TEAMYAKIMA said:

all I'm saying is that for me personally NO EXHIBITIONS = NO HOBBY.

I guess that’s the showman in you but it sounds like the later furlough has hit hard and it’s maybe time to sit back and look at what you enjoy. 

It makes it sound a lot like work if the final result is all that pleases you. I see the same in finishing the weathering on each piece of stock and details so I get a constant ‘buzz’ from the building. At home I don’t operate intensively like at a show but dip in as the mood takes me and it gives lots of opportunity to mull over scenes from the punters viewpoint and keep looking with fresh eyes. I know you can’t set up the whole lot but posing a train or two on a board and sitting back to contemplate it can really help. 

[Roger Sunderland]

Absolutely agree Paul. In my view the hobby is not really about showing something off, it’s about creating things that give YOU satisfaction. There are many facets to this wonderful hobby that you can have a go at. Our exhibition layout is 35’ long - I can’t set it up at home which is why I’ve spent the last 3 months building a small layout just for me at home, weathering and renumbering stock, making some buildings and generally playing trains. I personally can’t understand why you’d stop doing anything because you can’t exhibit it.

[TEAMYAKIMA]

4 hours ago, Barry O said:

TeamYakima.. I am sorry that you miss exhibitions so much but perhaps you could have been doing repair/rework of stock and perhaps thinking about building a small test plank to keep you going. Having a layout which can only be set up for exhibitions has major drawbacks ..you could try  to ensure you and the layout are as ready as possible to go to the next show,

 

Barry : Once we are a month or so before the next confirmed show (maybe earlier) I will work tirelessly on the layout - and so the layout will have all the upgrades I deem necessary before it is put before the paying public again, but I am just as busy now working on other aspects of my hobby/hobbies which I have put off for years because working on the layout has totally dominated my life for the last nine years.

 

 

[snitchthebudgie]

Perhaps the positive thing from the previous comments is the diversity of approaches to our hobby.  We all do it differently, and that can only be a good thing!