Oliver Rails Posted March 21, 2020 Share Posted March 21, 2020 (edited) SE&CR 16’ COVERED GOODS WAGON Rails of Sheffield in partnership with Dapol are pleased to announce that they are producing an OO gauge model of the SE&CR 16’ Covered Goods Wagon. Following on from the success of the late condition Diagram 1424 box van, we are excited to be able to offer the much requested earlier SECR version. In 1904 the South Eastern & Chatham Railway introduced covered wagons to an increased length of 16 feet, though in appearance they resembled earlier South Eastern Railway designs. 110 wagons to this design were built up to 1908. Most were fitted with Hill's brake gear, which differed from the RCH or "freighter brakes" fitted to the wagons much later in their lives. The Hill's gear, featured in our new model, is of distinctive and asymmetrical appearance; brakes were fitted to one side of the wagon only, with levers to apply them from either side. Later batches were fitted with Mansell coach-type wheels, which we feature in this model. Also featured are roof vents. The prototypes were fitted with both Laycock, or torpedo, vents, and with "Eros" vents. The latter are quite distinctive in style, and we have chosen to represent this type. The new models will be released in three liveries: SE&CR light grey, as built; the darker late SE&CR grey livery, introduced circa 1917, and SR brown livery, as applied between 1923 and 1936. Just two of the wagons were fitted, in 1909, with experimental pressed steel doors. These doors were the product of The Leeds Forge Company, and had been supplied for wagons built for export. The General Manager of the Leeds firm, Francis L. Lane, persuaded Wainwright to try them. It is not known how long these doors remained fitted, so this variant is offered only in early SE&CR livery. Once again these models have been researched, designed and produced solely in the UK. The price for a single wagon is £32.99 Initially three liveries will be produced, with two running numbers in each livery. The following models are now available for pre-order; SE&CR 16’ Covered Goods Wagon Wainwright ‘SE&CR’ Light Grey No.1922 SE&CR 16’ Covered Goods Wagon Wainwright ‘SE&CR’ Light Grey No.10001 SE&CR 16’ Covered Goods Wagon Maunsell SE&CR Dark Grey No.1923 SE&CR 16’ Covered Goods Wagon Maunsell SE&CR Dark Grey No.10022 SR (ex-SE&CR) Diagram 1424 Box Van, early SR Brown No. 45362 SR (ex-SE&CR) Diagram 1424 Box Van, early SR Brown No. 45360 SE&CR 16’ Covered Goods Wagon with Experimental Doors, Wainwright ‘SE&CR’ Light Grey No.9944 CLICK HERE TO PRE-ORDER A tremendous amount of research and development has been put into this project to ensure accuracy and true replication has been achieved. Production is in the final stages with these models expected in stock in soon. More information and updates on the projects progress will appear on Rails of Sheffield website. Due to the small production run these models are expected to sell out quickly and pre-ordering is highly recommended to avoid disappointment. For further details please see www.railsofsheffield.com Edited March 21, 2020 by Oliver Rails 12 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Premium phil-b259 Posted March 21, 2020 RMweb Premium Share Posted March 21, 2020 Yey! Order placed... Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
friscopete Posted March 21, 2020 Share Posted March 21, 2020 mee too Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guy Rixon Posted March 21, 2020 Share Posted March 21, 2020 Concerning the modelling of Hill's brakes, thanks go to John Arkell for a facsimile of the contemporary article showing how they work and to John Lewis for photographs showing how the SECR adapted Hill's patent. 1 2 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold greatcoleswoodhalt Posted March 21, 2020 RMweb Gold Share Posted March 21, 2020 (edited) With so much negativity at the moment it's great to have a new announcement today! Duly pre-ordered a SE&CR example, but it's worth noting the jump in price from £27.99 for Diagram 1424... Edited March 21, 2020 by jafcreasey Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
No Decorum Posted March 21, 2020 Share Posted March 21, 2020 Yes, three plus postage takes it to over £100. Never mind, order in. A question for Oliver which may be of general interest. Is it safe to use plastic compatible oil in the bearings of these? Being 3D printed, the material may not be what we are used to dealing with. 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guy Rixon Posted March 21, 2020 Share Posted March 21, 2020 The material is polyurethane resin. A wholly unofficial answer based on a little googling is that it's probably resistant to most oils, but not properly resistant to propanol or butanol. See https://www.engineeringtoolbox.com/polyurethane-chemical-resistance-d_1878.html. 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Edwardian Posted March 21, 2020 Share Posted March 21, 2020 30 minutes ago, jafcreasey said: With so much negativity at the moment it's great to have a new announcement today! Duly pre-ordered a SE&CR example, but it's worth noting the jump in price from £27.99 for Diagram 1424... I'm afraid price is a constraint with this technology. For instance, the cost of this run is increased simply by the need to repeat wagon numbers on the end, which requires an additional paint jig. I am finding that there are many factors that add more cost than one might have imagined! Hello from the other side .... 8 5 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guy Rixon Posted March 21, 2020 Share Posted March 21, 2020 To be clear about this, in case anybody is wondering, all the models in this announcement have the same brake gear, but it's very different on the two sides of each vehicle, being an either-side, right-hand-lever arrangement with the blocks on one side only. 1 2 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold PaulRhB Posted March 21, 2020 RMweb Gold Share Posted March 21, 2020 Thank you, a couple ordered initially rather than two of each SECR just to let others get a chance If they don’t sell out in a week ‘I’ll be back’ Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold PaulRhB Posted March 21, 2020 RMweb Gold Share Posted March 21, 2020 28 minutes ago, Edwardian said: I am finding that there are many factors that add more cost than one might have imagined! Hello from the other side .... Good to share exactly why for those that think it costs pennies to do it though 1 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Oliver Rails Posted March 21, 2020 Author Share Posted March 21, 2020 Hi, Just to clarify the price increase, The first van was always an experiment to prove the process, during which time additional work and costings did become apparent. The new van features significant modifications to areas such as the roof vents, chassis and brake gear. Additional end number printing and new authentic wheels are also a feature. The batch size is also smaller than the original van. It would also be nice to make a small profit on this batch, so that we can keep producing! 12 2 5 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Edwardian Posted March 21, 2020 Share Posted March 21, 2020 16 minutes ago, PaulRhB said: Thank you, a couple ordered initially rather than two of each SECR just to let others get a chance If they don’t sell out in a week ‘I’ll be back’ That's a very responsible attitude; I only hope I'm behind you in the queue for loo roll. 8 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold greatcoleswoodhalt Posted March 21, 2020 RMweb Gold Share Posted March 21, 2020 9 minutes ago, PaulRhB said: Good to share exactly why for those that think it costs pennies to do it though Just to clarify, I was only highlighting the difference in price, but it is beneficial to know the reasoning behind the increase! ...had I not thought it value I wouldn't have pre-ordered! 2 2 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold PaulRhB Posted March 21, 2020 RMweb Gold Share Posted March 21, 2020 1 minute ago, jafcreasey said: Just to clarify, I was only highlighting the difference in price, but it is beneficial to know the reasoning behind the increase! Sorry, that wasn’t meant to be aimed at your post it wasn’t meant to infer a reference to it either, just a general comment it’s nice to see a bit of info like that as to why it costs what it does. It was more a reference to posts ranting about profiteering we’ve seen in the past As Oliver says, they need to make a profit to produce more and to reward the risks taken in pushing forward the possibilities 1 1 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
phil gollin Posted March 21, 2020 Share Posted March 21, 2020 . The obvious question (!) Why is this a "covered goods van" when the previous model was a "box van" ? (Sorry, I am at home and bored,) . P.S. Could this technology reproduce an Open Goods wagon with a tarpaulin cover indented downwards in the middle ? Thanks. . 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guy Rixon Posted March 21, 2020 Share Posted March 21, 2020 19 minutes ago, phil gollin said: .P.S. Could this technology reproduce an Open Goods wagon with a tarpaulin cover indented downwards in the middle ? The 3D printing could do it easily enough. Printing the markings on the sheet, when the sheet is not flat, would be interesting. 1 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Edwardian Posted March 21, 2020 Share Posted March 21, 2020 37 minutes ago, phil gollin said: . The obvious question (!) Why is this a "covered goods van" when the previous model was a "box van" ? (Sorry, I am at home and bored,) . P.S. Could this technology reproduce an Open Goods wagon with a tarpaulin cover indented downwards in the middle ? Thanks. . "covered goods wagon" as this is simply a more pre-Groupy way to describe it than "box van". Also dropped from the description is the diagram number, as this was a SR designation. 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Edwardian Posted March 21, 2020 Share Posted March 21, 2020 47 minutes ago, phil gollin said: P.S. Could this technology reproduce an Open Goods wagon with a tarpaulin cover indented downwards in the middle ? 25 minutes ago, Guy Rixon said: The 3D printing could do it easily enough. Printing the markings on the sheet, when the sheet is not flat, would be interesting. When printing detail on so many surfaces, we'd have to be careful to ensure that an acceptable finish was maintained throughout, but I agree with Guy that it can be done. The key limiting factor is weight, An empty Open in this medium probably would not weigh enough to hold the track in a train of wagons. The box van has a weight printed integrally to the top of the chassis unit. The equivalent in an Open would require a fixed load to be printed. I have considered printing with tarpaulins in place over a load. That is certainly a way to ensure sufficient weight. The problem there is twofold. As Guy says, markings on it would be hard to reproduce, but also, masking the tarpaulin from the body sides for painting would probably not be practical. We are not keen to add to component or assembly cost by gluing weights underneath, and would prefer a more elegant solution. It would, I think, be useful to know what people think about this issue of weighting an Open wagon. 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold PaulRhB Posted March 21, 2020 RMweb Gold Share Posted March 21, 2020 If it was clearly defined that this would need a weighted load or your own weight, liquid lead being the easy solution, I’d not see it as an issue. If they are told up front then moan it’s them that look a bit daft. They will always moan anyway but if there’s a good reason the majority will buy and be happy. I guess the only alternative would be printing a metal chassis with a huge hike in price so specifying it will need a load or liquid lead adding seems a reasonable compromise, if not impetus to get on and load the wagon 2 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
truffy Posted March 21, 2020 Share Posted March 21, 2020 2 hours ago, Guy Rixon said: Printing the markings on the sheet, when the sheet is not flat, would be interesting. 2 hours ago, Edwardian said: As Guy says, markings on it would be hard to reproduce, I'm probably suffering from a deficit of understanding, but what markings would have to be printed? In my own muddle-headed fashion, I thought that a cover could be added by the purchaser using, e.g., PVA/water-soaked tissue and painted 'tarp colour'. So all that would be needed would be a prototypical wagon and a suitable weight. Have I missed something obvious, other than this possibly being tantamount to modelling? 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold PaulRhB Posted March 21, 2020 RMweb Gold Share Posted March 21, 2020 I think they were talking about a printed tarp as part of the wagon 3 hours ago, phil gollin said: an Open Goods wagon with a tarpaulin cover indented downwards in the middle ? 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Georgeconna Posted March 21, 2020 Share Posted March 21, 2020 Nice. But £32.99 plus post across the pond for a single Van, Bout €40. I'm out. Got the Contstaints and all that so no lectures needed and no doubt they will sell out as before. Enjoy lads. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
truffy Posted March 21, 2020 Share Posted March 21, 2020 14 minutes ago, Georgeconna said: But £32.99 plus post across the pond £32.99 minus tax? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Premium Compound2632 Posted March 21, 2020 RMweb Premium Share Posted March 21, 2020 (edited) I listened very closely to the interviews with Oliver and James on Jenny Emily's Youtube video. Now, I'm always pushing earlier - for the early Edwardian period, most of my stock should be from the 80s and 90s. So, I'm wondering, can the research work and CAD development for this 16 ft wagon be put to work to produce the earlier and more numerous 15 ft 5 in wagons, that became SR diagrams 1420 and 1422 (278 and 330 built, respectively, compared to 110 of the SR diagram 1424 wagon). This would also permit a further livery variation, SER red - which would probably have persisted well into the SECR period. Mention was made of Huntley & Palmers biscuit traffic; a couple of the SR diagram 1420 wagons appear in one of a series of photos taken at Huntley & Palmers' factory c. 1900: [Crop from a photo in the Huntley & Palmers Collection, Reading Museum.] Note that these both have timber rather than metal angle end pillars. In the background is one of the even earlier wagons from the 60s and 70s that became SR diagram 1419 or 1421, with a different arrangement of six timber end pillars. One of these survived in departmental use at least into the 1930s. Ref. G. Bixley et al., Southern Wagons Vol. 3 (OPC, 2000). Edited March 21, 2020 by Compound2632 Correction to the quantity of SR diagram 1420 built. 3 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
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