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cypherman

Proposed track plan

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Posted (edited)

Hi all,

This is the proposed track plan for my new layout. I just want to know if this is a feasible plan. This is the first time I have used Anyrail so it is a bit basic.

my track plan1.jpg

Edited by cypherman

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Hi cypherman,

 

It will help with responses if you can give a bit more information, such as which area the layout is to be set, which era it is set in, the types of stock you propose to run and that ind of thing.

 

What scale is the plan in? OO, N, O...

 

Best

 

Scott

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I'm sure that you will be inundated with suggestions, so I'll keep this short.

 

The big question (s) are where and what period?

 

I'd suggest that where possible, railways tended to try and avoid lots of reversals for their shunting moves, so a goods yard area would be laid out as a fan of sidings with a long head shunt to allow trains to be shunted and re marshalled into complete trains clear of the main line.

 

If it's a sleepy branch line then they would use both the loop and the platform road to marshal the daily freight train, but judging by the various industry you have around, this is not the case.

 

So start by asking yourself what is the reason for the railway?

How big is the place it serves?

 

It's location, which will ultimately dictate what traffic it has.

 

What are the purpose of the spare sidings in the middle of the goods yard.

 

Would a head shunt at the end of the loop be a help?

 

You might find that your traffic levels are such to warrant a double track!

 

What must you have, and what is expendable?

 

Less is often more in terms of making a model railway and not a toy trainset.

 

 

 

 

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Hi all,

You are both correct. I did forget to give enough information. So ok here is the reason for the layout.

1 It is a small seaside town terminus which has busy summers and quiet winters. Hence the extra sidings for carriage storage.

2 it is set about 1935-39. I would like to be able to use generic style buildings so that I could run any region if possible, I have enough engines and stock that I could give any of the big 4 a run for their money.

3 There is some light  industry, but it is mainly farming and dairy out and holiday makers in during the summer. and local passenger and goods in winter.

4 the scale is 00.

5 Loco's will mainly be tanks and small tender engines. Biggest engines will be 4-6-0's

6 passenger trains will be no longer than 4 coaches in summer dropping to 2 -3 coaches in winter.

7 Goods in summer as said will be all the farming produce out, Including the dairy. and local goods and coal in. There will of course be local goods and coal empties out. Local goods and coal trains will run in both summer and   winter. The coal is for local consumption and for the coaling stage

8 the engine shed is for the early morning goods or passenger train which starts from the town.

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Its got potential, the points look a bit like set track but the basic concept works.

A couple of tweaks would help.  the run round points should be arranged  to be a trailing point. The platform is shown on the bottom of the loop, moving it to the top would change the crossover to trailing or reverse the points to  pair of left hands instead of right hands .

Its always best to have the straightest possible route to the platform, both in full size and in a model, reverse curves are uncomfortable again you can use a right hand point not a left to smooth this out. 

The sidings could be longer.   The Loco shed would have closed in the 20s or 30 with introduction of the 48 hour week.  Hardly any small shed survived in use after this.

I would put the Dairy where you have the loco shed.

The Kick back coal sidings are awkward to shunt I would suggest a tweak to lengthen the head shunt but even then it will be a fiddle,  A steam age goods will bring full coal wagons and take away empties.  A light engine doesn't turn up take away the empties and then return with fulls.  Its really awkward to shunt kick back sidings as there is nowhere to shove the empties out of the way while leaving the fulls.  

 

Screenshot (243).png

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Hi David,

Thanks for the info. I did realise after I had posted the picture that the cross over points were the wrong way round. when it was too late to change it. It happened that way because originally I was going to have the platform on the other side of the tracks and I forgot to swap them over. You are right about the entrance into the station needing smoothing out as you have done here. As I am looking at mid to late 30's I think I can keep the engine shed. The coal yard has 2 lines in it so that one can be used for full wagons and the other for the empties. I do not expect anymore the 3-4 wagons per train to be using the coal yard. The reason for the short sidings was simply that I had run out of track options in the free version of Anyrail.

And you were right the points are set track for this exercise. They will be Peco streamlined code 100 for the build. As I said it was the first time I have used Anyrail so I made it simple for myself.

Again thanks for the info and advice.

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Posted (edited)

What size will the layout be and is the drawing to scale? Which side is the viewing side? Is the rectangle shown above all scenic?

 

As David said, It looks like you’ve used Settrack parts, not Streamline.

Edited by Harlequin

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5 hours ago, DavidCBroad said:

 

Screenshot (243).png

 

I was going to suggest the same modification to the loco release at the platform, with a platform arrangement something like this.

 

1977439710_Screenshot(243).png.c3b8d29ecd4a2b6b251848c449739a06.png.5798faf9548b3d6231600bc01b696db6.png

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Hi all,

Harlequin the length is 15 feet plus fiddle yard and width of 3 feet. As I said in my reply to David I used the set track points just for guidance. The viewing side is from the coal yard side.

DavidB I like that plat form idea and think I will pinch it off you.

Thank you both for the help.

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18 minutes ago, cypherman said:

Harlequin the length is 15 feet plus fiddle yard and width of 3 feet

 

This is pretty generous and it should be easily possible to rework the plan using streamline points and flexitrack for much smoother curves.  Harlequin is probably doing that right now...

 

I would add my voice to the chorus regarding the coal kickback coal sidings - IMO you would be better of leaving them out and using what you've drawn as the headshunt as the coal siding.  Don't worry if you have to shunt to extract the empties from the partly-empties as I don't think the operation of most coal sidings in your period was particularly scientific.

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1 hour ago, Flying Pig said:

 

This is pretty generous and it should be easily possible to rework the plan using streamline points and flexitrack for much smoother curves.  Harlequin is probably doing that right now...

 

I would add my voice to the chorus regarding the coal kickback coal sidings - IMO you would be better of leaving them out and using what you've drawn as the headshunt as the coal siding.  Don't worry if you have to shunt to extract the empties from the partly-empties as I don't think the operation of most coal sidings in your period was particularly scientific.

Hah hah! No I'm not drawing anything but I agree it's good to know that the OP has such a generous area.

 

@cypherman It should be possible to do something wonderful along the lines you have proposed in the space. The next step is to draw it to scale using the actual Streamline parts you will use and I suggest that you try to avoid Small radius points completely - you probably won't need them.

 

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Posted (edited)

It's nice to see a layout where the goods facilities are more comprehensive than those for passengers. It's usually the other way round.

 

Just a thought; as a seaside destination, there might well be an excursion platform, longer than the rest, to accommodate the holiday trains.

Plus the goods yard definitely needs some form of headshunt.

Edited by Peter Kazmierczak
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I have running through my mind the number of small branch termini which retained a small sub-shed, or bigger (the latter is not appropriate here) right through to closure or dieselisation in the 1950s and sometimes a little later.  AHaving carried out a quick count and even as late as 1961 there were still a dozen such sheds still open in the West Country most of them at seaside termini no larger, and in some cases much smaller, than that proposed for this layout.

 

And someone suggesting a parcels platform at a town of this size - downright strange (although it might have managed a fish dock).

 

BTW - although somewhat OT - the 48 hour week on Britain's railways was introduced in 1919 and in many respects made little difference except in ending a lot of 12 hour turns. for non-footplate staff.  The real change came Post WWII with the 44 hour week which introduced a requirement for a Rest Day every other week for wages staff and it became a weekly Rest Day in the early - mid 1960s when the 40 hour week was introduced.   As  most  small or sub-sheds had no more than a single Shedman or a Fireman (and possibly a Cleaner) on duty overnight shortening the working week made little difference to the economics until the need for Rest Days was introduced.  But for operational reasons even that did not lead to the closure of sub-sheds - that change came with branchline closures and the end of steam traction.

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Posted (edited)

If I'm reading all the suggestions right, I think this is what has been suggested. This would certainly be a lot easier to operate.

 

revised.png.1ba954d202f5ea34408bf81b0a6db0c5.png

 

A seaside location could have a wharf to add a lot more variety of traffic from fishing boats and small cargo ships. This is also slightly narrower overall and reduces the distance you need to reach. Given the geometry, the wharf is one place where a kickback siding would actually add operational interest rather than making it more difficult.

 

 

revised2.png.e27ec187fab895d38cc6cd7e15766114.png

 

As an afterthought, you could put a carriage siding next to the bay platform and move the goods shed/cattle dock down a bit to consolidate the goods yard.

 

Cheers

David

Edited by DavidB-AU

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This would be better as it provides the trap point necessary at the exit of the goods sidings by making it into the headshunt.

 

revised.png.1ba954d202f5ea34408bf81b0a6db0c5.png.ab2f9ea467f89f67da8ae907843cfb57.png

 

Andi

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7 minutes ago, Dagworth said:

This would be better as it provides the trap point necessary at the exit of the goods sidings by making it into the headshunt.

 

I was just about to post this! And it avoids shunting movements blocking the main line.

 

Cheers

David

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Just now, Dagworth said:

This would be better as it provides the trap point necessary at the exit of the goods sidings by making it into the headshunt.

 

It also allows shunting clear of the running lines, which is the point of having a separate headshunt.  It might be better to have the crossover to the yard face the station as at Sidmouth, though of course there the yard and runround are on the same side of the station. 

 

Studio_20200326_232835.png.93b78f0362aba8bb6135e7e0ad4c1c92.png

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Combining a few more of the above ideas.

 

revised3.png.b50d1f871cf5879ceb111c9116346398.png

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Wouldn't the CS also need a trap point? Also the sidings at the top of the drawing are also missing their trap point.

 

Andi

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Not necessarily. 

 

F9775C7F-E023-4902-8AB2-6BE5CD29AAA6.png

 

At smaller places like St Ives and Sidmouth, almost everything was directly onto the main line. Of course there may have been catch points.

 

Cheers

David

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12 minutes ago, DavidB-AU said:

Not necessarily. 

 

F9775C7F-E023-4902-8AB2-6BE5CD29AAA6.png

 

At smaller places like St Ives and Sidmouth, almost everything was directly onto the main line. Of course there may have been catch points.

 

Cheers

David

The road that leads to the loco shed acts as the trap to protect the three sidings, Middle, Cattle and Carriage.

 

Andi

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Posted (edited)

With 3ft baseboard width and 15ft length it’s probably a good idea not to push track right out to the edges and leave room for surrounding scenery. That would help place the station in a landscape.

 

Bear in mind that you want to be able to see interesting parts of the station, and interesting operations, easily from the viewing side. That might require the track plan to be rejigged for modelling reasons rather than prototype reasons. It still has to work prototypically correctly, of course.

 

The kickback sidings of the original designs above can help to make better use of the rectangular baseboard space and balance the visual composition. They also allow you to separate your small industry from the station a bit. (BTW: In another thread someone wisely pointed out that a dairy is unlikely in a coastal location because half the surrounding collection area is in the sea!)

 

The fiddle yard roads need to be at least 5ft long. If using fixed track you also need to allow room for the points fan. I hope there’s room for this.

 

 

Edited by Harlequin
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 The FY point Harlequin made is important.  You need a decent length and when you have a decent length FY you can use the FY as a headshunt.

Headshunts were pretty rare in the west of england   unless the approach is on a steep incline and the headshunt was level.  The short headshunt does not bring anything to the party,It makes shunting very tedious and just about halves the yards capacity. You need room in the yard for both incoming and outgoing wagons at the same time if you are to avoid using the main line as a shunting neck.   I know headshunts are common on layouts  as it lets two operators play at a  small station at the same time but on the real thing they are there to reduce line occupancy when a frequent service is run.    It is more normal to have a very long run round loop the end of which beyond the sidings  can be used for shunting clear of the main line, in theory if not in practice as the goods usually had an hour or two to itself at the terminus between trains,  trouble is the long loop and the headshunt  both look very "Main Line" where you are trying to portray a quiet branch.   

 

 Now most of you wont do this but on the original plan I would use the whole length of the FY as a shunting neck.  Run round the goods pull the incoming wagons back towards the FY and pull the outgoing ones out on the end of the incoming, 20 wagons on a 45XX or Pannier, backwards and forwards until the yard is sorted and the outgoing train of around 10 wagons departs leaving the incoming and the ones which were in the yard which aren't unloaded yet and the ones that aren't loaded yet.   Its my idea of fun.  Having to plan every move 6 moves in advance is my idea of hard work.

 

There were not many 4-6-0s, or even 2-6-0s  on single track branch lines except the long cross country lines to Barnstaple, Padstow, Ilfracomb and Newquay and of course to Kingswear where GWR Kings roamed.    Mainly tanks 0-4-2T, 2-6-2T and 0-6-0 T on the GWR, and 0-4-4T Tanks and  4-4-0s, 0-6-0s and post war 4-6-2s on the Southern. Southern used 0-4-4Ts as branch mixed traffic and shunting locos and 4-4-0 and 0-6-0 tender locos as pick up freight locos as they had very very few 0-6-0 Tanks.   Conversely the GWR had very few 0-6-0s in the west country, by 1950 I believe Exeter's singe 2251 was the only GW 0-6-0 tender loco in Devon or Cornwall.

 

 

 

 

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