Clapping for Carers

[Enterprisingwestern]

 

Not so many out tonight, I think it's about run its course, we'll just carry on thinking about how wonderful they are.

 

Mike.

[big jim]

21 hours ago, Enterprisingwestern said:

 

Not so many out tonight, I think it's about run its course

 

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-52773032

 

I just happened to be out the front of my house with the youngest lad at 8pm last night doing something else and some of the neighbours came out and clapped and banged pots and pans whilst giving us dirty Looks for not joining in! 
 

let’s hope it has run its course

[Ross34]

On 03/04/2020 at 12:35, big jim said:

 

 

Am I alone in thinking this but is this whole clapping business a bit pointless? 

 

 

No, you're not.

I don't,  but I don't object to those that wish to, far from it...but I do object to those who criticise me for not doing so or assuming automatically I'm not grateful to those carry out vital services. You don't know me...you don't know in what way I support the NHS or any other organisation ...and I don't feel I need to tell anybody how charitable I choose to be.

Using the word shameful - as somebody did in an earlier post - imho is at best assumptive, and at worst ignorant and self righteous. 

There have been a number of reports of people who don't clap being abused verbally and physically...that's just plain wrong.

[jjb1970]

Couldn't have put it better Ross34!

 

I don't think anyone has objected to people showing their appreciation if they want to do it, it is the culture of judging people who don't join in and some of the attitudes that are associated with it that some of us object to. 

 

As with charitable giving, it shouldn't be about signalling virtue or conformity but doing something because you want to do something good or help others. If people are genuinely showing appreciation then good, but it's far from being the only way to express appreciation and if people don't want to get involved then they have every right to just not get involved and shouldn't be subject to coercion or shaming.

[Rugd1022]

13 hours ago, Ross34 said:

 

No, you're not.

I don't,  but I don't object to those that wish to, far from it...but I do object to those who criticise me for not doing so or assuming automatically I'm not grateful to those carry out vital services. You don't know me...you don't know in what way I support the NHS or any other organisation ...and I don't feel I need to tell anybody how charitable I choose to be.

Using the word shameful - as somebody did in an earlier post - imho is at best assumptive, and at worst ignorant and self righteous. 

There have been a number of reports of people who don't clap being abused verbally and physically...that's just plain wrong.

 

Some of the views being posted on social media about those who choose not show their virtue in public are quite shocking - over on Pistonheads there's a thread about local facebook groups where a member of one of them was castigated by a neighbour who said ''I see the gays at no.22 weren't out clapping last night, shame on them''. The 'gay' in question took it on the chin and responded with a well written and very funny wind up showing up the original poster's homophobia in fine style and was promptly banned from the group for his trouble!

Edited May 24, 2020 by Rugd1022

[big jim]

13 hours ago, Ross34 said:

 

No, you're not.

I don't,  but I don't object to those that wish to, far from it...but I do object to those who criticise me for not doing so or assuming automatically I'm not grateful to those carry out vital services. You don't know me...you don't know in what way I support the NHS or any other organisation ...and I don't feel I need to tell anybody how charitable I choose to be.

Using the word shameful - as somebody did in an earlier post - imho is at best assumptive, and at worst ignorant and self righteous. 

There have been a number of reports of people who don't clap being abused verbally and physically...that's just plain wrong.

I know it’s clipped my original quote about it being pointless from your reply above but I glad you quoted it as when I originally posted that comment (And subsequent posts) I had to think long and hard about how I worded the post for worry of being castigated for not joining in because my reasonings behind not joining in may have not be understood or accepted, I’m glad to see I had a few agrees to my post (and again those where i clarified my position) and thankfully here we have on the whole had sensible adult discussion over the matter with no one falling out over it

 

[APOLLO]

On 21/05/2020 at 20:05, Hroth said:

Tonight I applauded with random notes on an old trumpet.

Then I gave up, and clapped instead. 

 

Beans for tea ? - I hope they were Heinz - made in Wigan !!!!

 

I clap not just for the NHS but for all essential workers, wife included. She works 2-10pm in food production (Not Heinz though !!). It's also a time for a quick chat with the neighbours (at a distance) ensure all OK etc.Some get a chair and a drink if the weather allows. Quite social, I hope it carries on until normality returns.

 

Brit15

[big jim]

4 minutes ago, APOLLO said:

 

Beans for tea ? - I hope they were Heinz - made in Wigan !!!!

 

I clap not just for the NHS but for all essential workers, wife included. She works 2-10pm in food production (Not Heinz though !!). It's also a time for a quick chat with the neighbours (at a distance) ensure all OK etc.Some get a chair and a drink if the weather allows. Quite social, I hope it carries on until normality returns.

 

Brit15

you obviously have nicer neighbours than me, all I got was dirty looks and shaking of heads for not joining in

 

 

[Rugd1022]

Here's that reply I mentioned earlier from the guy who was shamed on facebook for not clapping.... 

 

''I would like to inform you all (especially Karen at number ##) that 'the gays at number ##' will not be clapping tonight, because like every Thursday at 8 me and my partner will be taking part in our mass satanic and goat slaughter, if anyone should wish to join us please bring your own goat, gimp suit and sanitiser'' 

Edited May 24, 2020 by Rugd1022

[Hroth]

2 hours ago, APOLLO said:

Beans for tea ? - I hope they were Heinz - made in Wigan !!!!

 

Heinz are too mild, for really fruity effects Aldi own brand have an unmatchable force!  (Insert "and you can pebbledash x" joke here.)

 

I applaud because I'm glad that the NHS exists and that we don't have an effed-up system thats completely in the hands of Big Pharma as in the USA, yet. 

 

Public demonstrations will eventually run their course, but I hope that the Government will recognise the efforts of at least SOME* essential workers in a more tangible form in the near future.

 

*And not just BEMs all round and K's for some bigwigs.

 

 

[The White Rabbit]

17 minutes ago, Rugd1022 said:

Here's that reply I mentioned earlier from the guy who was shamed on facebook for not clapping.... 

 

''I would like to inform you all (especially Karen at number ##) that 'the gays at number ##' will not be clapping tonight, because like every Thursday at 8 me and my partner will be taking part in our mass satanic and goat slaughter, if anyone should wish to join us please bring your own goat, gimp suit and sanitiser'' 

 

That's disgraceful, it's 'my partner and I'... 

 

I (and my non goat-slaughtering Chief Acolyte) have also been criticised locally for not joining in. However, this criticism has been made by those who do not know what my professional role is, that I have lost colleagues to the virus, that I have a close relative in a critical condition or what my opinion of either the medical staff on 'the front-line' or other carers or key workers actually is. 

 

One thing I have noted over the last few weeks, is that from my observation the most vocal 'clappers' are those who disregard lockdown and social distancing rules, those are quickest with an excuse as to why the rules don't apply to themselves and behave as if the virus will respect this and their behaviour will not endanger them or their families (or, far more worryingly, any medical staff needing to treat them). A great shame, as these hypocritical, ostentatious virtue signallers devalue the gesture of those who are unable to give practical support and wish to show their appreciation as best they can. To the latter, my sincere thanks; to the former, a well-known gesture (with bells on). 

 

 

 

[The White Rabbit]

58 minutes ago, Hroth said:

 

Heinz are too mild, for really fruity effects Aldi's own brand have an unmatchable force!  (Insert "and you can pebbledash x" joke here.)

 

If I might voice a note of caution in the scientific pursuit of knowledge? 

https://youtu.be/1pajy-gES1o

 

[jjb1970]

In fairness it's not particularly unusual for those who make the biggest effort to signal their virtue to be far from virtuous. My job is dominated by emissions and response to climate change and it's the same story. People brandishing their Tesla and vegan organic tofu telling the rest of humanity to live a life of abstinence while jetting around the world living the high life.

[alastairq]

No-one has really bothered in the village where I live.....

Given the mix of wealthy [millionaires] and those on housing benefit..not forgetting us pensioners who rent their homes.........well, the wealthy wouldn't stoop so low as to be seen clapping & banging in public, would they?

 

Personally I don't go for such ostentatious behaviour in public, or private.

 

Like religion, I don't feel the need to get on my knees,   in order to pray.......................Or be seen going to churches.

But since, in our village, the population amounts to the odd hundred or so, spread out round the countryside, I doubt anybody else would know if I went outside to bang a pot.   

 

I went out  one night early on, but the kitchen clock had stopped at quarter to eight, that morning.....so my attempts at wearing my heart on my sleeve went unnoticed by my neighbours.

 

The farmer over the road from me admitted to turning out one night about 3 weeks ago to clap.....but the noise so frightened the big flock of sheep in the field next to us, they all shot off down the field bottom......

If any of my neighbours disapprove of my attitude, then they can go fiddle next time they want me to turn out with my jump leads! [They're 2 metres long...]

 

There's far too much of this holier-than-thou attitude going on......and they don't like it one bit when one mentions it, either. 

 

 

 

 

[Bernard Lamb]

In my road there are only 15 houses.

At least 1 representative from each house puts in an appearance on a Thursday.

It is the only time we ever all get together and discuss the state of things.

SWMBO 35 years in the NHS, woman next door, Receptionist at a Surgery, next door to that, a Nurse since they moved in 20 odd years ago. Four other houses with people who have had cancer plus two people with long term health problems.

Have I missed any one? Yes a chap who is 88 and now at home after a spell in hospital recovering from a fall.

The NHS does seem to be rather important to just about all of us and showing our appreciation for a couple of minutes does seem to be an appropriate gesture.

Bernard

 

 

 

 

[rob D2]

It’s enough now....even the lady that suggested it said it’s become politicised and should now end.

 

Don’ t forget we are living in a version of “ 1984”, where the liberal thought police will enforce “ group think “ at every turn to ensure we all signal our virtue .

 

On our local FB page , someone started “ I hope I’m not the only person putting out treats for the binmen...”.

 

turned out she pretty much was .

[Enterprisingwestern]

2 hours ago, alastairq said:

.........well, the wealthy wouldn't stoop so low as to be seen clapping & banging in public, would they?

 

Perhaps they should follow John Lennon's famous advice and just rattle their jewellery!

 

Mike.

[MR Chuffer]

1 hour ago, Bernard Lamb said:

The NHS does seem to be rather important to just about all of us and showing our appreciation for a couple of minutes does seem to be an appropriate gesture.

Pay them the rate for the job? And care home and social care workers.

 

My daughter is a doctor with the all the A*s at GCSE and A-level you could wish for but earns much much less and works longer hours and shifts than her friends who went into banking, finance, architects, etc.

 

She doesn't give a stuff about a few sentimental people clapping at their doors every Thursday when she's at the coalface saving lives.

 

Quit the group think and get back to reality.

 

#justsaying

[Bernard Lamb]

9 hours ago, MR Chuffer said:

Pay them the rate for the job? And care home and social care workers.

 

My daughter is a doctor with the all the A*s at GCSE and A-level you could wish for but earns much much less and works longer hours and shifts than her friends who went into banking, finance, architects, etc.

 

She doesn't give a stuff about a few sentimental people clapping at their doors every Thursday when she's at the coalface saving lives.

 

Quit the group think and get back to reality.

 

#justsaying

She has a job for life. they take the risk of being kicked out when things get bad.

Just because your daughter made a bad career choice is not my problem.

The meet up on a Thursday does seem to be the only "reality" that we are allowed at the moment and unlike the reaction of your daughter it does seem to be appreciated by our local health care professionals.

Bernard

[jjb1970]

I wouldn't call being a doctor a poor career choice. Interesting work, the satisfaction of helping people, good job security and it is well paid. None of the doctors I know seem to be short of a few quid and some of them appear to be extremely comfortable. Yes, it entails long hours and less than great pay initially but so do many careers with good long term potential. 

[rob D2]

Jobs “ for the government “ have always paid rather poorly . I was amazed during my recent job search what civil service jobs there were and the poor pay.

 

But also , there are some gold plated salaries in the NHS when they really shouldn’t be - director of supply supposedly on £200k....those at the coal face missing out .

[jjb1970]

I don't know what a director of supply is paid but it may be germane to consider that most of the complaints I have seen from NHS workers concern poor supplies of equipment,  indicating that non-medical roles are actually rather important.  

Pay is one of those things where many like to feel underpaid and complain. My advice has always been if it is just about the money then get a better paid job. If you can't get a better paid job then you are not being underpaid. And comparisons tend to ignore looking at the total package including pensions, and earnings potential. 

 

[Phil Parker]

19 minutes ago, jjb1970 said:

I don't know what a director of supply is paid but it may be germane to consider that most of the complaints I have seen from NHS workers concern poor supplies of equipment,  indicating that non-medical roles are actually rather important.  

Pay is one of those things where many like to feel underpaid and complain. My advice has always been if it is just about the money then get a better paid job. If you can't get a better paid job then you are not being underpaid. And comparisons tend to ignore looking at the total package including pensions, and earnings potential. 

 

 

There is likely to be only 1 Director of Supply, but hundred of much lower paid people who are largely ignored in discussions about money.

 

As for the pension thing - I worked for MAFF for 5 years. When they closed our office, all our pension records seemed to vanish in the mist. I know I wouldn't have built up much, but it would have been something. Still, I was one of the rubbish little people...

[jjb1970]

7 minutes ago, Phil Parker said:

 

There is likely to be only 1 Director of Supply, but hundred of much lower paid people who are largely ignored in discussions about money.

 

As for the pension thing - I worked for MAFF for 5 years. When they closed our office, all our pension records seemed to vanish in the mist. I know I wouldn't have built up much, but it would have been something. Still, I was one of the rubbish little people...

 

That sounds like something for a union to pick up or for you to seek legal advice. Five years pension benefit will be a significant figure.

 

Your pay slips will provide a record of your contributions, together with your employment contract and any records of AVCs you should be able to reconstruct what you are owed.

Edited May 25, 2020 by jjb1970

[Erichill16]

I clap because some of these people are putting up with less than adequate PPE and therefore putting themselves at risk for the benefit of others. Some people would say no proper PPE, I’m going home till it’s sorted end of. If one career appreciates my clapping, then I will clap.