Steel Works Locos

[Busmansholiday]

I started with the British Steel Corporation at Scunthorpe back in 1978 and worked through British Steel PLC, Corus and Tata reincarnations until I retied in 2016. After four years I'm probably safe to share some of the pics I managed to take in those years. They are not all Scunthorpe, in those 38 years I managed to visit over 30 other sites around the UK as well as sites in France, Holland and Turkey, but you'll not be bothered about the latter ones unless you want to see DB/EWS class 66's in France.

 

Photography on BSC sites was forbidden (and continued throughout, only the advent of camera phones made it almost impossible to police), if caught you would out the door before you had chance to argue, which is why there aren't that many early pictures. If you wanted any pictures as part of your job you had to request the companies official photographers to come and take them for you.  I therefore didn't do too well until this century when I had a company phone and camera thrust into my hands. I did though take the occasional risk so lets start with John Lysaghts'  Normanby Park Works (NPW).

 

61 - One of the Hunslets awaits it's fate.  As I said earlier, you were sacked for taking pics on the works so you'll probably notice I'm tucked in between some wagons so I didn't get caught. The NPW Hunslet locos were renumbered in mid 1979 so they didn't have numbers that clashed with App Frod (AF) locos. Sorry, I don't remember how / what they were but it was between the end of the Janus locos and the start of the Hunslet Bo-Bos. After the announcement of the closure of NPW in 1979, and it's closure in 1980 (the final bits closed in 1982) the management had plans to transfer the Hunslets to the main site and get Hunslet to sort out the problems. This was basically that they and an amazing ability to snap drive axles (the Bo-Bos were also under engineered, they suffered from chassis twisting and cracking). Unfortunately the Unions, still very strong then, refused to allow any of their members to operate any plant or equipment transferred from NPW to the main site stating that if it was needed at AF, it was a reason to keep NPW open.  As a result the Hunslets were dragged to AF, stripped of any parts that were compatible with the Bo-Bos, and scrapped at West Bank (an area that's now the iron plating pits), some were barely three years old. Well, except two I was told, and I believe 61 was one of these, hence why it was alongside the old loco sheds (now AFRPS). Two units were stripped of their superstructure, fitted with a scrap ingot and used as weighbridge test wagons for a few years. At least one was apparently sent to the NCB /BSC joint venture at Immingham. I never managed to find these, but it was over 10 years before I ever got to Immingham.

 

The Sentinels may have been doomed had NPW not closed anyway as a Janus, 51, had been sent there for comparative tests in 1979 (it returned to AF and was still in use when I retired).  They too were scrapped at West Bank as seen here. I knew they were there and sneaked a pocket camera into my overalls and on the way back from the stores in a company van and took these pics from the drivers seat. The rusty bits on the cab are where the names of the locos were. Note the different wording on the sides of the locos.

 

 

 

 

There was one other loco at NPW at the close (to my knowledge), A Rolls Royce built Steelman. That started life at Richard Thomas and Baldwins Redbourn (RTB) Steel Works (Scunthorpe) being transferred to NPW some time in the 70's I believe. I saw it in the workshops in late 1979 awaiting a major rewire,that was not to happen. That too was dragged across to AF for scrapping but Thomas Hill stepped in and bought it for it's scrap value (I remember seeing it leaving the works on a low loader). It was refurbished and was the loco used on the American tour with Varlen. On the return to the UK it was sold to BSC Ravenscraig works along with two new Steelmen. My info came from a (sadly now deceased) friend who worked for Thomas Hill until it closed. After Ravenscraig closed they moved to Shelton (Stoke), numbered 41 - 43, where I caught up with two of them.

 

This is 43 with 42 behind it.

 

 

Another view of 43 with the box covering the donkey engine used to power a separate compressor for use with air braked mainline wagons.

 

When Shelton closed (it was part of Scunthorpe by then) they were transferred to Scunthorpe and renumbered 61 - 63, internet research indicates 61 being the RR example.

 

Here's 42 and 43 with 41 already renumbered, painted and with the donkey engine removed.

 

 

And all three painted and ready to go.

Notice the differences between them all. The chevrons are different on each, the location of the running numbers is different and 61has a yellow panel over the exhaust and the running cat symbol is at the opposite end.

 

 

They saw little service but even then, 61 and 63 developed serious mechanical faults leaving only 62 serviceable. All three were sold (Harry Needle rings a bell) who collected 62 which I believe is at a quarry now. 61 and 63 were parked up at the back of Appleby Coke Ovens, rather poignantly as the embankment they were by was the old boundary between the AF and RTB works.

 

As a final note, an engineer once told me of a party trick you could do with a Steelman (when the management were not around). Find a bit of straight track, select neutral, open the throttle fully and let her get to full power. Release the brakes then slam the selector into forward. At this point one of two things happens.

1 = there's a big bang and the transmission lets go, or hopefully,

2 = the back end squats down , lifting the front wheels off the track and she 'wheelies' for a a fair few yards.

 

Please don't try this trick at home.

 

I'll leave this for now. Need to find some pics out from the other sites.

 

 

 

 

Edited May 15, 2023 by Busmansholiday
Replaced lossed pictures

[Ruston]

Thanks for posting those. More, please!

[Busmansholiday]

Whilst making steel is a pretty well known process, different companies specialised in different types of steel.  As such, if you could offer that particular type of steel cheaper then your competitor you stood a chance of stealing their business. The photography bit was partly to ensure that any specialised equipment you used in the process (some was oftern designed and developed "in house" by your R&D department) didn't get copied by the competition. There's also the fact that when coming to sell the product, if you can show pictures of your competitors premises that makes it look bad (dirty, disorganised etc) you can gain "brownie" points in the long term battle to win over customers.

[Gordon A]

More please.

[gpplumy]

Please tell us more.ive also contacted you directly.

[Busmansholiday]

I think there'll be four parts to this story. Looking at Immingham to Scotland via the Teesside plants next, then to South Yorkshire via Cumbria and the West Midlands and finishing off at Scunie.

Need to sort the pics out, takes a bit of time, even in a lockdown.

 

[Michael Edge]

more please!

[PeteBrid]

As a former Thomas Hill employee I can add something to Busmansholiday's story. First off, not all the NPW Sentinels were scrapped, we had several back for rework for Tinsley Park, 10111 being one of them, I'd have to dig up my notes to identify the others. (For that matter we had several Janus back and reworked for ICI.)

On Steelman, Hills didn't "step in" to save 10277 from scrap - it was part of a longer negotiation, which included the steelworks recovering the fuel tank which they had taken off for another purpose. The trouble was, it was an 'odd-ball' loco in a works that was entirely diesel-electric otherwise. Apart from my general duties at Hills, I oversaw the loco leave for the States (via Southampton) and its return through Immingham after the Varlen deal collapsed. It came back for the simple reason that we had already sold the prototype Steelman (10265) to Ravenscraig and they wanted more. After supplying 10277. and with no s/h example available, we ended up building two new ones. (I remember taking Ravenscraig engineers down to Bardon where 10273 was employed to show them what a working Steelman looked like and get first hand opinion from the quarry personnel.)

 

You said in your photo caption that all the chevrons on the three Scunthorpe locos were different. Not entirely true. The R-R Steelman locos had chevrons made by Metalastik to their design, and the centre axle chevrons are different to leading and trailing in order to give the centre axle easier ability to offset when going through curves. When it came to building new Steelmen, (the first two for ICI) Metalastik had moved on, and the included angle had changed. Metalastik would only produce the original angle as 'specials' at a price and lead time that were not encouraging. So we had to accept the later Metalastik design, even though this meant different patterns for axleboxes and the mating frame parts. The centre axle again had a different chevron and this proved to be a major headache as it did not allow the middle axle to move transversely as the older ones did. In the end, we found an FAG bearing that incorporated a 19mm end float, i.e. the axlebox stayed put but the axle could float on the bearing within. The Ravenscraig pair had these from the outset.

 

When Ravenscraig closed I was running my own company and went up to assess the locos for re-use: it was a toss up then whether they went to Port Talbot or Shelton. If memory serves PT paid my bill for the subsequent report. The locos were parked up in a building, with as much valuable kit around them as they could squeeze in to avoid theft. Security guards patroled by day, dogs were left loose at night, feral cats wandered everywhere and pigeons lived in the roof space. You had to look wherever you were about to put your feet, it was filthy. Despite my overalls, I wrote a shirt off climbing over and under them. I put a quote in to do the neccessary work but the Engineers at Lackenby insisted to BSC that they were the loco experts and the work should be performed in-house: I was a given a sop in the shape of a contract to move them from Ravenscraig to Lackenby, though I did get one from Shelton for attention later.

 

As for your 'party trick': it ought not to have been possible, one of the primary safety features of a decent control system is that you cannot engage drive with the engine revs above idle. But a weakness in the R-R system (which I fear we perpetuated) was that we detected throttle lever position, not actual engine rpm. So assuming that nobody had tampered with the control systems, I would expect that the trick was to rev up, then smartly pull the throttle lever back to release the interlock, put the clutch in and rev up again before the engine had time to decelerate. Do that on a Sentinel and it would throw you across the cab (if it didn't seriously trash the clutch), but the converter charge pump on Steelman was driven after the clutch, so on engagement you would have no base pressure for 2 or 3 seconds, giving a softer take up. It is though, a stupid pactice with potential for loco damage and personal injury.

 

Pete Briddon

(At Thomas Hills 1978 to 1988)

[martyn11post]

14 hours ago, Busmansholiday said:

Whilst making steel is a pretty well known process, different companies specialised in different types of steel.  As such, if you could offer that particular type of steel cheaper then your competitor you stood a chance of stealing their business. The photography bit was partly to ensure that any specialised equipment you used in the process (some was oftern designed and developed "in house" by your R&D department) didn't get copied by the competition. There's also the fact that when coming to sell the product, if you can show pictures of your competitors premises that makes it look bad (dirty, disorganised etc) you can gain "brownie" points in the long term battle to win over customers.

 

Worth noting also, the reasons include safety, integrated steelworks are very dangerous places. You don't want trespassers as they may come into harms way by accessing these areas (and ultimately the liability lies with the company). Hence security is tight. Photo's could encourage others to break the law to gain access. Whether for interest, or for more malicious reasons. Also one of the downsides with smartphones, is when an incident occurs it is all too easy for images/information to be in the hands of the media before official channels are used. Which then leads to damaged reputation/misrepresentation of an 'event'. Hence taking photos (without permission) remains a sack-able offence.

 

That said, without these photo's we would lose a wealth of history and I look forward to further instalments!

 

My personal archive (obtained in the same way) will have to remain under lock and key for a few years to come (2050+!)

Although I have built up an archive on Steel Company of Wales which is probably out of any copyright issues.

 

Corus/Tata 2008-

[Busmansholiday]

Peter, thank you for the update on the NPW Sentinels and the Steelman information. When I mentioned chevrons I was actually referring to the yellow and black stripes on the ends of the locos, the layout appearing to depend on the mood of the painter.

[Busmansholiday]

8 hours ago, martyn11post said:

Worth noting also, the reasons include safety, integrated steelworks are very dangerous places. You don't want trespassers as they may come into harms way by accessing these areas (and ultimately the liability lies with the company). Hence security is tight.

Very true, although running a public bus service through the middle of the works like happened at Scunthorpe didn't do much for security.

On one occassion some slightly inebriated locals decided to take a short cut into Scunthorpe through the works. The leading one fell down the quarry, we had to get air-sea rescue out to winch him out. Steelworks are dangerous places.

[PeteBrid]

Sorry, being involved in the sharp end I automatically think of suspension rather than mere  paintwork!  Then when people start expressing a preference for 'happy chevrons' as opposed to 'sad chevrons' and I wonder what b... difference it makes!

[PeteBrid]

I've dug out some old  slides and put them through the scanner, so here, from the dim and distant past (well, July 1965 to be exact) are some from Normanby Park during the transition from steam to diesel.

Here's Lionel, Sentinel 10109  of 1963. Generally Sentinel 0-6-0s were 48tons, but the NPW ones were 50tonners, with additional weights including two just below and behind the bottom edge of the buffer beams. Code and headlights vary quite a bit on Sentinels - NPW specified the configuration shown here with codelights as 'ears' on the cab roof and headlights on the exhaust cowl in front.

Here's another - might be NIM from the very short nameplate (S 10108) with a I think an HC 0-6-0ST alongside. Oh and for those who are still wondering, the buffer beams  have had 'sad' chevrons applied. 'Happy ' chevrons go thus "v".

An interior view of the steam loco shed. And finally, by way of contrast, a publicity shot we did of Steelman 10277 in the yard at Kilnhurst before it went to Ravenscraig. There were so many lights the photographer blew 3 fuses in extension cables doing the shoot.

Busman refered to the 'cat' logo: actually it was supposed to be a Cheetah, and was a profile based on the logo Thomas Hill's then parent company used which was then tacked on to the sideskirts. We didn't like it much at Kilnhurst - seemed to show its bum off most of all.

 

Pete Briddon

 

 

 

[Rivercider]

Although I have been interested in railways all my life (and had a 30 year railway career) I always find industrial railways to be somewhat foreign or exotic. Consequently I always enjoy reading threads like this, many thanks to all who contribute.

 

cheers

[Ruston]

50 minutes ago, PeteBrid said:

I

 

Here's another - might be NIM from the very short nameplate (S 10108) with a I think an HC 0-6-0ST alongside. Oh and for those who are still wondering, the buffer beams  have had 'sad' chevrons applied. 'Happy ' chevrons go thus "v".

 

 

 

Pete Briddon

 

 

 

I think the saddle tank is a Yorkshire, rather than a Hudswell. It could be an RSH even. Yorkshire and RSH produced the same design but with detail differences. You can tell the two apart by the buffer beams and something to do with the cab but I forget what exactly.

Edited March 31, 2020 by Ruston

[Michael Edge]

On 31/03/2020 at 17:06, PeteBrid said:

I've dug out some old  slides and put them through the scanner, so here, from the dim and distant past (well, July 1965 to be exact) are some from Normanby Park during the transition from steam to diesel.

Here's Lionel, Sentinel 10109  of 1963. Generally Sentinel 0-6-0s were 48tons, but the NPW ones were 50tonners, with additional weights including two just below and behind the bottom edge of the buffer beams. Code and headlights vary quite a bit on Sentinels - NPW specified the configuration shown here with codelights as 'ears' on the cab roof and headlights on the exhaust cowl in front.

Here's another - might be NIM from the very short nameplate (S 10108) with a I think an HC 0-6-0ST alongside. Oh and for those who are still wondering, the buffer beams  have had 'sad' chevrons applied. 'Happy ' chevrons go thus "v".

An interior view of the steam loco shed. And finally, by way of contrast, a publicity shot we did of Steelman 10277 in the yard at Kilnhurst before it went to Ravenscraig. There were so many lights the photographer blew 3 fuses in extension cables doing the shoot.

Busman refered to the 'cat' logo: actually it was supposed to be a Cheetah, and was a profile based on the logo Thomas Hill's then parent company used which was then tacked on to the sideskirts. We didn't like it much at Kilnhurst - seemed to show its bum off most of all.

 

Pete Briddon

 

 

 

Any photos of the 0-8-0 Sentinels Pete?

I've got the test etch for these now, trying to do both wheelbases but there's not as much in common as I'd hoped.

[gpplumy]

6 hours ago, Michael Edge said:

Any photos of the 0-8-0 Sentinels Pete?

I've got the test etch for these now, trying to do both wheelbases but there's not as much in common as I'd hoped.

 

Hi Michael, did you build the test etch from the drawings I'd sent to you? You collected them from pete briddons shed a couple of years ago now I think it was. 

 

Look forward to seeing it.

 

Andrew

[Michael Edge]

I started from that and my own measurements of the surviving swb loco at Avon Valley, Pete has since found a few more diagrams for me. I've got enough to build one of each to start with but we will end up either with two kits or one with a lot of redundant components - it probably won't sell very well anyway, not many of the steelworks locos do.

[Narrow Gauge Jordan]

4 hours ago, Michael Edge said:

I started from that and my own measurements of the surviving swb loco at Avon Valley, Pete has since found a few more diagrams for me. I've got enough to build one of each to start with but we will end up either with two kits or one with a lot of redundant components - it probably won't sell very well anyway, not many of the steelworks locos do.

I will definitely be having a couple of them for my layout! Just a shame they won’t run on the current one, also some of the Hunslet shunters.

[Busmansholiday]

So leaving Scunthorpe for the time being, we'll head east to Immingham Bulk Terminal, or IBT as it's known locally. Built as a joint venture between BSC and the NCB, and manned by NCB employees, it was built to export UK mined coal and import iron ore for use at Scunthorpe. The miners strike of 1984/5 and the subsequent colliery closures resulted in it importing coal as well for use at Scunie and total control was eventually transferred to BSC.  You get an impressive view from the cabs of the ship unloaders above the river, trust me.

 

There's no shunters at IBT, coal and iron ore trains are reversed in empty then loaded. Iron ore via a bunker system, coal via mechanical shovels.  When originally opened, the iron ore trains were hauled by a pair of 37's and this continued until the 60's became available. The introduction of these had a benefit for both BR and BSC. For BR it reduced fuel and maintenance cost as they only used one loco, for BSC, the removal of that extra loco meant that an addition ore wagon could be inserted into the rake as the limiting factor in these trains is the length of the head shunt at the FOT (Foreign Ore Terminal) on the works.

 

So a shot of 66075 being loaded with coal whilst a 60 is loaded under the ore bunkers.

 

 

The device above the 66 isn't a loading gauge, its where the water / chemical mix that crusts the top of the coal to stop it 'lifting off' on it's journey to Scunie is applied. A lot of work between BSC and BR took place with the old HAA wagons to reduce lift off, somewhere in the BSC archives is a video taken from the back cab of a 47 on it's journey showing the lift off.

Edited May 15, 2023 by Busmansholiday
Replaced missing picture

[Busmansholiday]

Continuing north up the east coast and we eventually get to the little village of Carlin How. Carlin where?. Carlin How, which is where the Special Profiles works better known as Skinningrove is actually situated. Here they do what it says on the can, make special shapes and profiles in steel. Things life crane tracks, steel railway sleepers and track shoes. The latter isn't a railway thing, it's what are used on earth movers and tanks. If you want to know more about this works there is an excellent book produced by the IRS that gives it's history and the locos it has had over the years. First thing I used to grab in reception as I waited for a colleague.

 

Steel is transported from Scunnie here, so lets start with a class 60. Yes, I know I should have been the other side for the sun to illuminate it better, but I was unloading the van when the sirens went and diving across the track with them going would have got me shot.

 

 

Internal shunters there were leased from Hartlepool based Ed Murray, and have almost always been Sentinels. Quite why two YEC 0-6-0s were transferred here from Moss Bay when it closed in 2006 is an interesting question. They appear to have done little serious work.

 

One was parked just down from the entrance, on a section of track that was cut off from the rest of the works system as shown here. The last time I was there I was told it had been earmarked for scrapping.

 

 

The second one does serve a useful purpose, it's the end stop on the internal sidings.

 

 

And a more general view of it with the North Sea behind it.

 

 

So, the leased locos, which obviously changed every so often so these are the ones I manged to photograph.

 

William.

 

 

Lady Potter (older readers will remember the British Steel logo that Ed Murrays is based on).

 

 

Harry Potter.

 

 

and the train with no name.

 

 

Off up the road for the next installment.

 

 

 

 

[Busmansholiday]

So, just a bit further north and we get to Teesside, and what was once a a series of different plants, Redcar, Lackenby, South Bank, Cargo Fleet to name a few on the south bank of the Tees. I always wondered where the steel industry today (and in particular Scunthorpe) would be if they had actually built Redcar as originally planned. That was with two furnaces, two sinter plants and two coke oven plants, 10 million ton per year capacity. Well they did build the second furnace, they just didn't assemble it, the parts lay on the ground for years before being used in a major rebuild of the furnace.

 

Teesside Works bought a large number of GEC 6 wheel diesel electrics new in the late 70's, and topped the number up with some second hand ex NCB examples, so they were the usual internal transport. It was only after the sale of the plant to Sahaviriya Steel Industries (SSI) that it changed. SSI decided to contract out the loco operations and GBRf took up the challenge, purchasing the ex Norwegian Di8 locos for this work. 

 

But lets start with some GECs (somebody really could do with making a model of these, given they weren't just used in steelworks) and some parked up outside the sheds following the collapse of SSI including spare / scrap engines.

 

 

Remember 260, you'll see her elsewhere later.

 

 

261, Redcar Works in the distance,

 

 

277,

 

 

and a bit of the permanent way kit.

 

 

 

Arh, yes, you'll be wanting a couple of pics of the Di8s won't you.

 

 

and the same location from the other side.

.

 

Lets leave that here and head over the Tees for today's final bit.

[Busmansholiday]

So at the other side of the River Tees is Hartlepool Works. Another plant that once had it's own steelmaking ability.  When this was closed there was a plan (I kid you not) to build a tunnel under the Tees to feed slabs directly from Redcar to the plate mill on the works. Obviously that would have been very, very expensive so eventually a cheaper option was chosen, they closed the plate mill. 

There's three mills on the site, the 20", 42" and 84", all sizes referring to the maximum diameter of the pipes they can produce.

 

The 20" mill got its' steel in coils from Port Talbot, the loco delivering it generally did the shunting into the mill on delivery and removed the empty wagons for the trip back to Wales. The internal locos, again leased from Ed Murry, whose base is next door, were generally stabled by the 42 and 84" mills.

 

Well unless still on a low loader.

 

 

Being part of Teesside, the GECs were originally the locos allocated there and there were two there. Neither were used but the one at the back in this photo did move. Know what it is ?

 

 

Give yourself a pat on the back if you recognised it as a Locotracteurs Gaston Moyse (apparently!).

 

Here's it's sister.

 

 

 

 

 

So finally for today, a quick visit north of the border to Motherwell, and Dalzell Works. This again doesn't have any internal shunters, the delivering loco did the internal movement of the full and empty wagons. This rubbish photo (the only one I managed) shows a 66 awaiting to rejoin the main line with a rake of empties (in the distance) .

 

 

 

Back soon.

Edited April 3, 2020 by Busmansholiday

[Michael Edge]

I've got drawings for the GECT 6wh shunters but they do present some difficulties in model form. I would need to drive all axles and the compensation gear is rather strange and very visible, it would have to move with the wheels.

[Ruston]

Are the Moyse locos the same ones that were at Stockton Haulage? I think they had three of them.