THE ISSUE OF 'EXHIBITION ONLY' LAYOUTS IN THE CURRENT SITUATION?

[MarcD]

3 hours ago, bbishop said:

 

Marc, ..... and you are building a British outline layout for the competition.  Mine is German!  So some parts have to be scratchbuilt and I may resort to obtaining roofs from Sabine Bünnig at Telford and hoping that the glue dries overnight.

 

Bill

Hi Bill

Yes this British outline and so is the next one but my 2023 layout will be set in New South Wales Australia.

Marc

[TEAMYAKIMA]

Two months have passed since the last post and so I thought I would update it with my current thinking.

 

Basically, I miss the pressure of an upcoming exhibition deadline. After Warley last year I made a list of upgrades and changes I needed to make to the layout before Aly Paly in March. So I had  4 months to achieve these improvements.

 

In those four months in the run up to Aly Paly I worked every day on the layout including Xmas Day. One day in February I worked 15 hours on the layout starting at 5.30am.

 

For the last 4/5 weeks I've done absolutely nothing on the layout - no point, no exhibitions.

 

I actually plan a new home layout which will be my first home layout ever. It will be approx. 23ft x 9ft 6inches and just have three circuits running through scenery. I will run trains round and round, but again probably only when visitors come over.

[roundhouse]

My last home layout was torn up in 1980 after building my first exhibition layout. Since then I have built many exhibition layouts quite often doing over 20 shows a year but in the last few years we have cut back due to fewer helpers being available / still around with this year just one show and one Freemo meet before the virus.

 

So, back in March I built my first 'home' layout which is really a test track at high level in the shed with a few sidings that are mainly for storage but can be shunted/ switched. Yesterday morning I actually did switch these sidings with my HO USA freight stock. There is a short section now with a backscene and the track will be ballasted etc for using as a photo section. The newest exhibition layout 'Blackmoor' has been built and set up in the shed but it is tight using the shed for much else whilst set up. The shed is the maximum size that I could build under permitted planning regs. However, with the two shows cancelled for this year with the next show in the Autumn of 2021 its been taken down and the only work has been on the buildings whilst there isn't much motivation to continue. Luckily all the wiring is completed tested and scenic well underway so it won't take much time to complete..

 

In the meantime I am now going through all my OO / HO stock giving them a few hours run and any repairs or adjustments required on the test track. The n scale circuit will be laid in the near future to allow my N scale / 009 stock to be given a good run.

[298]

12 hours ago, TEAMYAKIMA said:

Two months have passed since the last post and so I thought I would update it with my current thinking.

 

Basically, I miss the pressure of an upcoming exhibition deadline. After Warley last year I made a list of upgrades and changes I needed to make to the layout before Aly Paly in March. So I had  4 months to achieve these improvements.

 

In those four months in the run up to Aly Paly I worked every day on the layout including Xmas Day. One day in February I worked 15 hours on the layout starting at 5.30am.

 

For the last 4/5 weeks I've done absolutely nothing on the layout - no point, no exhibitions.

 

 

 

I've dusted off a stored project that has been set up bit covered over in the garage and not touched for a couple of years. With a rediscovered mojo for it I've found I can use a limited amount of free time to actually enjoy doing some modelling and the satisfaction of watching it take shape is just as good to motivate me as an exhibition deadline. 

 

I've always believed that any layout built should be exhibitable, as once you've designed in additional reliability and sturdiness and neatly presented it you were half way to an exhibition standard and makes moving it easier should the need arise. But with the technologies available in this day and age I find it more rewarding to present my modelling over the internet to interested parties in the prototypes home country than to the average exhibition punter in a church hall on a rainy day in Birmingham. 

[Mountain Goat]

My past layouts were permanent layouts and I was dissapointed in that one can never predict the future, and twice I had my plans changed. I thought it a shame to have to dismantlw part completed work and the time one has put into it. So I decided to build a small portable layout as we were planning to relocate anyway, and I wanted something quick and easy. As it was a small layout I decided to do things the hard way which takes longer but I assumed that it would not take that long. Uhmmm. Well. It has been a slower process then I had imagined, but I am enjoying the build and I am having fun! Time does not matter.

 

I don't really think my efforts will be to exhibition standard as I have seen such fine work out there by others... But if I can get it all working and I am happy with it, then why not! Haha. (But I don't think I could cope with a large busy exhibition these days. However I could exibit it outdoors. I am making it to be a layout which is independent of a mains spply.

Edited June 4, 2020 by Mountain Goat

[newbryford]

11 minutes ago, 298 said:

 

 

 

I've always believed that any layout built should be exhibitable, as once you've designed in additional reliability and sturdiness and neatly presented it you were half way to an exhibition standard and makes moving it easier should the need arise. But with the technologies available in this day and age I find it more rewarding to present my modelling over the internet to interested parties in the prototypes home country than to the average exhibition punter in a church hall on a rainy day in Birmingham. 

 

I'm not too sure that every layout built for exhibitions is suitable for home use and vice-versa.

For example:

If I was building a roundy-roundy at home, it would be designed to be operated and viewed from the inside.

If it is for exhibition purposes, then the operation is from the middle and viewing from the outside.

 

I realise that some roundy types are operated from the front and you could easily do this with a N gauge layout that doesn't have an operating well - but it wouldn't work for layouts with a central operating well.

 

End to ends are a different matter as I would design it to be operated from both sides

[corax67]

My 8x2 exhibition layout is getting loads of playtime at home at the moment, probably more than ever before, set up in the spare room.

 

Our church exhibition layout (16x12) only ever sees the light of day a max of twice a year for shows plus a rare Saturday for fettling if required but does get worked to death on show outings. Periodically we take  Individual boards home to add or amend scenic detailing.

 

If I had the space the biggy would permanently be up too.

 

 

Karl

[298]

16 hours ago, newbryford said:

 

I'm not too sure that every layout built for exhibitions is suitable for home use and vice-versa.

For example:

If I was building a roundy-roundy at home, it would be designed to be operated and viewed from the inside.

If it is for exhibition purposes, then the operation is from the middle and viewing from the outside.

 

I realise that some roundy types are operated from the front and you could easily do this with a N gauge layout that doesn't have an operating well - but it wouldn't work for layouts with a central operating well.

 

End to ends are a different matter as I would design it to be operated from both sides

 

I was thinking in terms of if it was sectional and came apart without resorting to total destruction. Something I don't consider easily is the lifespan that a layout might have, and although i have recycled buildings and bigger bits of scenery, etc, don't think in terms of working on a project for a couple of years and then scrapping it in favour of something else.

[TEAMYAKIMA]

Well, quite a bit of time has passed since I first started this thread and how times have changed - for the worse.

 

We already have two major exhibitions cancelling in 2021 - January an May - both directly or indirectly linked to Covid19 and so I thought I'd look back on this thread and post a personal update.

 

Lockdown came less than a week before the Aly Paly show in March and since then I have also 'lost' Railex in May and so my next show is Peterborough in December.

 

I still work for a living 3 days a week and, whilst still working at my job, in the run-up to Aly Paly I was working every day on the layout (inc Xmas day) and once a full non-stop 15 hours in one day from 5.30am. Since lockdown I haven't worked on the layout at all since early April because without exhibition deadlines I don't see the point. 

 

I have been VERY busy with other hobbies/activities that I have been putting off for the last nine years whilst I obsessed on my layout, but without exhibitions I have better things to do.

 

Maybe an odd perspective, but that's me.

[43110andyb]

Having just refurbished Charwelton into the 80’s (as a team) we were looking forward to doing Wigan exhibition as it’s only outing this year (hours of work has gone into compiling stock that will only really be displayed on the layout at exhibitions).

   We were lucky to have exhibited at Doncaster & Derby last year but it was still really disappointing to realise we wouldn’t be out at all this year! 

   It hasn’t stopped me personally from pressing on with stock projects but it’s a great feeling heading out for an exhibition weekend with the rest of the guys so I’m hoping it’s not too long until we can resume (in whatever form/format we may need to comply with).

 

Andy

[Kendo54]

On 12/07/2020 at 11:16, 43110andyb said:

Having just refurbished Charwelton into the 80’s (as a team) we were looking forward to doing Wigan exhibition as it’s only outing this year (hours of work has gone into compiling stock that will only really be displayed on the layout at exhibitions).

   We were lucky to have exhibited at Doncaster & Derby last year but it was still really disappointing to realise we wouldn’t be out at all this year! 

   It hasn’t stopped me personally from pressing on with stock projects but it’s a great feeling heading out for an exhibition weekend with the rest of the guys so I’m hoping it’s not too long until we can resume (in whatever form/format we may need to comply with).

 

Andy

 

[Kendo54]

As a total technophobe I posted the above!!! What I intended to highlight is that maybe it is no longer possible for the "we can resume (in whatever form/format we may need to comply with) " is achieveable.

 

What if there is never a vacinne developed? What if the desirable/essential exhibition attendance does never materialise and makes them uneconomic? What if the age of prospective exhibitors or attendees  make the venture economically feasible? What if? What if? What if?.

 

Do you believe that the hobby will/can survive without ANY exhibitions? That is what the rest of 2020 indicates as Manchester has now cancelled. What about 2021? Stafford ? York? Home layouts might now be the future!!!!

 

 

[Joseph_Pestell]

2 hours ago, Kendo54 said:

As a total technophobe I posted the above!!! What I intended to highlight is that maybe it is no longer possible for the "we can resume (in whatever form/format we may need to comply with) " is achieveable.

 

What if there is never a vacinne developed? What if the desirable/essential exhibition attendance does never materialise and makes them uneconomic? What if the age of prospective exhibitors or attendees  make the venture economically feasible? What if? What if? What if?.

 

Do you believe that the hobby will/can survive without ANY exhibitions? That is what the rest of 2020 indicates as Manchester has now cancelled. What about 2021? Stafford ? York? Home layouts might now be the future!!!!

 

 

 

I don't think that, in the internet age, exhibitions are essential to the future of the hobby. The hobby was, perhaps, at the zenith of its popularity in the 1970s. There were rather fewer exhibitions then. and smaller than we see now.

 

Don't get me wrong. I hope that exhibitions do return. I often find layouts and products there that I did not know about and would not have found on the internet. Artisan producers will need to be far more proactive in e-marketing if exhibitions disappear from the scene.

[TheQ]

On 04/06/2020 at 22:22, newbryford said:

 

I'm not too sure that every layout built for exhibitions is suitable for home use and vice-versa.

For example:

If I was building a roundy-roundy at home, it would be designed to be operated and viewed from the inside.

If it is for exhibition purposes, then the operation is from the middle and viewing from the outside.

 

I realise that some roundy types are operated from the front and you could easily do this with a N gauge layout that doesn't have an operating well - but it wouldn't work for layouts with a central operating well.

 

End to ends are a different matter as I would design it to be operated from both sides

This was the problem I had with the Home layout, I had originally planned to have the smaller station removeable, then build a reversed circle just for that to show. But when the other layout came up I realised having a separate show layout would be much easier.

 

The last month has had a loss of mojo  on working on the exhibition layout, there are just two small sub boards to build, then it's completion time, as far as scenery, vast amounts of fencing mostly wire and post has to be made. Then wiring the layout. Once that is done the layout can be parked, while buildings and a ferry are constructed.

[PaulRhB]

7 hours ago, Kendo54 said:

What I intended to highlight is that maybe it is no longer possible for the "we can resume (in whatever form/format we may need to comply with) " is achieveable.

We are 6 months into the predicted 12-18 months with 150 odd vaccines under development or trial, bit early to be considering doom!  

 

7 hours ago, Kendo54 said:

What if there is never a vacinne developed?

Then there are other more painful ‘herd’ solutions but the modern world hasn’t had to deal with that yet as medicine has so far found an answer, as above patience to the widely quoted experts timescale?  

 

7 hours ago, Kendo54 said:

 What if? What if? What if?.

what if we all had a bit more patience?

 

7 hours ago, Kendo54 said:

Do you believe that the hobby will/can survive without ANY exhibitions?

Yes, it grew without them and now we have the internet to share them. I prefer to see them physically but with 3D photo stitching tech already available I’m sure software will catch up to produce cheaper personal versions if there’s a market developed by more isolation because people will want it to see products from many others too. 

[bodmin16]

I have found the points of view expressed here on this topic quite interesting, and thought that I would share my own feelings on the exhibition scene.  Note these are purely my personal thoughts and I fully appreciate that we are all in this hobby for different reasons and fully respect that and would hope that this is reciprocal.

 

My main impetus in railway modelling is being able to build and play trains at home, although like most others I don't have room to build large permanent layouts.  I have not had a large layout at home for years however I am lucky enough to be able to erect smaller layouts on a semi permanent basis is my workshop/former garage and whilst these layouts are not designed for exhibitions they have all been easily transportable and showable in one way shape or form.  I have assisted with clubs and other individuals to exhibit layouts and enjoy doing so, I also enjoy attending exhibitions although I tend to only go to 2 or 3 a year either as a visitor or exhibiting.  I can't imagine building a layout purely for exhibition, that is just not my thing!

 

There are very few large exhibition layouts that excite me other than the more permanent layouts such as Pendon etc, so if I go to shows I enjoy the smaller shows and those with more modest efforts, including skill levels.  I enjoy the social side of shows and will spend all day looking, chatting and of course learning from others.

 

I am not one for going to shows and seeing the same layouts week after week as I would rather spend some time playing at home, that said I am obviously disappointed in the current situation we find our selves, and there are a couple of shows/layouts that I was particularly looking forward to but they will wait as I'd rather we all stayed healthy.

 

Perhaps there will be fewer shows, personally I don't think that is a bad thing, but hopefully the quality of both the shows and exhibits will be higher than ever.

 

As I said these are only my personal feelings and thoughts so please don't shoot me, I know I have the choice as to whether I attend shows or not (and indeed exercise that choice), however fewer shows would make my decision process simpler in deciding which shows to select.  I fully understand that some guys and girls want to attend shows every weekend and we all attend shows for different reasons, so I fully appreciate and respect that.

 

Looking forward to seeing you all and some amazing new layouts out and about soon.

 

Alan

[woodenhead]

On 12/07/2020 at 14:35, TEAMYAKIMA said:

Well, quite a bit of time has passed since I first started this thread and how times have changed - for the worse.

 

I wouldn't say for the worse.

 

Back in March we could only leave our houses to shop unless we were classed as key workers.

 

Now we can do quite a lot, visitor attractions have reopened albeit as you've described with limitations and people are able generally to go about their daily business.

 

So we cannot go to an exhibition currently and given the planning that goes into it then it is understandable that a lot of people are being cautious when it comes to 2021, though I suspect most including myself expect 2022 to be a return to something akin to what we had in the past.  Next year is going to be transitory and probably based on what happens between now and January 2021, but Covid will cease to be such a disruptive matter at some point.

[TEAMYAKIMA]

 

32 minutes ago, woodenhead said:

I wouldn't say for the worse.

 

Back in March we could only leave our houses to shop unless we were classed as key workers.

 

 

Yes, I agree with you in that sense.

 

What I meant was that back at the beginning of April many people thought that exhibitions would be back up and running by September - so it that sense things have got worse. It's what someone else described as the WW1 'It'll be over by Christmas!' syndrome. We now know it won't be.

[woodenhead]

19 minutes ago, TEAMYAKIMA said:

What I meant was that back at the beginning of April many people thought that exhibitions would be back up and running by September - so it that sense things have got worse. It's what someone else described as the WW1 'It'll be over by Christmas!' syndrome. We now know it won't be.

I would say that was more a sense of euphoria as lockdown came to an end before a good dose of realism surfaced.

 

Not a lot has changed except perhaps we've had the chance to digest where we are with things, a recognition we're not out of the woods and clubs/associations taking a very cautious approach lest they be financially ruined by planning an event that may not be able to take place or not get enough numbers to cover costs.

[Nearholmer]

3 hours ago, PaulRhB said:

 

Quote

Do you believe that the hobby will/can survive without ANY exhibitions?

Yes, it grew without them and now we have the internet to share them. I prefer to see them physically but with 3D photo stitching tech already available I’m sure software will catch up to produce cheaper personal versions if there’s a market developed by more isolation because people will want it to see products from many others too. 

Exhibitions were a feature of the hobby from very early in its history, ditto clubs. Model engineering exhibitions, which are older, provided a shelter until railway modelling got established, but I’m 99% sure the first ‘pure railway modelling’ hobby exhibition was c1910, and model railways had been exhibited by the railway companies as publicity tools before that.

 

But, I think the thing that many of us miss isn’t the ‘looking at layouts’, for which software might provide a substitute, but the social side of exhibitions and other toy-train related gatherings, which software doesn’t even purport to rival.

 

I think the hobby would really struggle (as would all is hobbyists) without any face-to-face social interaction.

[PaulRhB]

34 minutes ago, TEAMYAKIMA said:

It's what someone else described as the WW1 'It'll be over by Christmas!' syndrome. We now know it won't be.

And in both cases if they’d listened to those in the know they’d not have expected it to be! The over optimistic view was set up and fuelled by the media while simultaneously reporting what the experts were actually saying. 
 

I’m not surprised people are feeling it, even those of us who believed the experts quoted are finding it hard, but we are very quick to associate ourselves with ‘blitz spirit’ when in reality that was more a story created afterwards from propaganda headlines to bolster the recovery. People suffered from not knowing how long it would be then with similar anxieties to now but that’s where the similarities end. 
 

 

[PaulRhB]

3 minutes ago, Nearholmer said:

think the hobby would really struggle (as would all is hobbyists) without any face-to-face social interaction.

I agree totally and we are allowed interaction already and if done sensibly outside as a several small groups have done in recent weeks we can adapt while there are restrictions. 
It’ll be harder in the winter where indoors is more necessary but at least we have the distancing option that will probably allow some small open day events if not normal bigger shows. 
20 years ago with basic internet we would be far more isolated from the modelling community and relying on basic message boards and magazines for hobby info. Now I’m talking in real time with a huge variety of people I may never meet and putting up with a bit of inconvenience in physical movement. I think we are being served rather well by the internet on one hand but our impatience is being fuelled by the desire to say something in the media and on social media on the other  

[2mm Andy]

11 hours ago, Kendo54 said:

That is what the rest of 2020 indicates as Manchester has now cancelled. 

 

Where has this been stated please? The MMRS website still says that a decision on the exhibition will be made on 8th September.

 

Andy

[AY Mod]

12 hours ago, Kendo54 said:

That is what the rest of 2020 indicates as Manchester has now cancelled.

 

Please afford other members and readers a bit more respect and do your research before stating anything as fact. See 

 

[Chris M]

I’m in the process of fitting front and rear control panels on my new N gauge project. Yes it’s more wiring work but it only has to be done once. The layout will mostly be run at home controlled from the front. I hope to take it to just a few exhibitions when the rear control panel will come into its own. I will just put a plain panel over the front control panel. The rear control panel is also useful when working on and loading up the storage sidings.  This gives me the best of both worlds.

 

Designing a layout that is good for home use and also good for exhibitions is not easy as there are some rather fundamental  conflicting requirements. I think I have achieved a reasonable compromise. I enjoy operating my new layout at home (even though it is still under construction) and I expect it to go down well with paying visitors at exhibitions.