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I'm sure I'm not alone on this ……………..

 

I genuinely "get" the whole delivery services are overloaded scenario we are living through so as an example I am not ordering a new barbeque BUT am I being responsible ordering modelling items to keep my hobby, and therefore my sanity, going??

 

I really do feel conflicted with this and would value others opinions - for example are you ordering glue and landscaping materials??

 

The other thing to me is - if our model shops are staying open on the internet shouldn't we be supporting them??

Edited by halsey

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Royal mail seems to be business as usual so I wouldn't worry unduly, the worst that can happen is 2 day delivery stretches to 4 days (or similar) which isn't really a hardship.

 

You have to balance any concerns against mental well being, for those selling, those awaiting receipt of goods and those delivering who have sustained employment in these uncertain times.

 

I'd go gas rather than charcoal....it's such a faff...

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9 minutes ago, halsey said:

I really do feel conflicted with this and would value others opinions

 

If you break it down into the constituent parts of the equation you can make a personal choice.

 

Many of the businesses in the hobby are small, family-owned operations who need to survive. We've just sent out a newsletter to our subscribers featuring some who are pushing on - http://email.world-of-railways.co.uk/g8etls4wBe6eOMwWjujml3gTD9uXOUIhc~gqpRqXqVn/WebView.aspx The choices for them if they have to cease operations altogether are stark and it's better for everyone if they can operate safely rather than joining the online queue for benefits.

 

The Royal Mail and other couriers are near enough fully operational and practising responsible working, they don't want it and they don't want to pass it to you. Again it's jobs and livelihoods for those giving a service.

 

The government hasn't shut mail order trading down, just asked for the shop doors to remain closed to save people from themselves.

 

If you need something to keep going then why not? No-one's telling you can't or even shouldn't*.

 

*Turning up at Argos to collect a new barbecue, bouncy castle and a DVD box set may be a different matter.

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9 minutes ago, AY Mod said:

 

If you break it down into the constituent parts of the equation you can make a personal choice.

 

Many of the businesses in the hobby are small, family-owned operations who need to survive. We've just sent out a newsletter to our subscribers featuring some who are pushing on - http://email.world-of-railways.co.uk/g8etls4wBe6eOMwWjujml3gTD9uXOUIhc~gqpRqXqVn/WebView.aspx The choices for them if they have to cease operations altogether are stark and it's better for everyone if they can operate safely rather than joining the online queue for benefits.

 

The Royal Mail and other couriers are near enough fully operational and practising responsible working, they don't want it and they don't want to pass it to you. Again it's jobs and livelihoods for those giving a service.

 

The government hasn't shut mail order trading down, just asked for the shop doors to remain closed to save people from themselves.

 

If you need something to keep going then why not? No-one's telling you can't or even shouldn't*.

 

*Turning up at Argos to collect a new barbecue, bouncy castle and a DVD box set may be a different matter.

 

In terms of the 'contact-ability' of this virus, Click & Collect takes on a whole new meaning....

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From the confines of my bubble I have just ordered some heatshrink tubing, it will arrive when it does and I am sure the supplier will be glad of the sale however small.

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If we decide to shut all mail order down then there are lot of businesses that are going to close too. The plan, as far as I can tell it, is that there is some semblance of a functioning economy at the end of it. By allowing firms to trade they can also adapt to what I expect to be the new normal. If you look at a supermarket, you'll see how those have quickly adapted with queuing systems, screens and extra markings. They can now carry on as normal for many months or years.

 

A lot of those in our industry are adapting already and so will hopefully stay in business. We need this. If you don't think we do, imagine what percentage of your pension the government will be able to pay if they are paying furlough wages for 70% of the country for a few years...

 

12 minutes ago, AY Mod said:

If you need something to keep going then why not? No-one's telling you can't or even shouldn't*.

 

*Turning up at Argos to collect a new barbecue, bouncy castle and a DVD box set may be a different matter.

 

You will (thanks BBC and it's reliance on Twitter) and you should be told to shut up. Anyone with kids at home all day for months on end will need something to entertain them with. If someone spends a few hours watching a box set instead of roaming around outside, overall, that's a win for protecting everyone else.

 

2 minutes ago, tomparryharry said:

In terms of the 'contact-ability' of this virus, Click & Collect takes on a whole new meaning....

 

Only if you don't follow the sensible and easy processes for hygiene. We're going to have to get used to them, so now's a good time.

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I have ordered glue and some other modelling  items online, the items can be safely left in our porch or outside. I personally think that if a shop is offering a mail order service then I am doing my 'bit' by buying something to keep them going. I know I'll have to wait a bit longer for it to arrive- I can live with that. We haven't had any post here since the 24th March, but I know my glue  is out there somewhere, along with Boris' letter etc, and will eventually arrive. (As will the hose I ordered to unblock a drain which has meant we can't use the kitchen sink / washing machine etc!)

If we can, and I believe we are being encouraged to, I think we should support model shops using mail order. (And any other 'reasonable' purchases).

Les

 

 

 

 

 

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Just now, AY Mod said:

 

The Royal Mail and other couriers are near enough fully operational and practising responsible working, they don't want it and they don't want to pass it to you. Again it's jobs and livelihoods for those giving a service.

I've seen other comments like this so am replying as a recently retired postie who is still in regular contact with ex colleagues.

Even when I left 2 years ago RM wasn't near enough fully operational. In my office job cuts meant there were more walks than posties and the only way all addresses received their mail daily was via overtime. Staff sickness could mean some walks could go undelivered for 2/3 days. The situation is now far worse at my old office.

Staff cannot possibly get everything delivered and practicing responsible working makes me chuckle. They have zero PPE whilst working in a busy, cramped office, sorting mail shoulder to shoulder. They are being asked to deliver more mail, especially parcels covering more distance in the same timescale whilst standing away from front doors which is often impracticable.

The union is pushing for a temporary 3 day delivery but staff aren't impressed as it will mean having to deliver double when they are in as well as standing shoulder to shoulder for even longer sorting 2 days mail.

Sorry but comments like this from those not in the business aren't helpful and are misleading. RM could seriously do without people ordering their essential tube of glue so they can build that kit that's been in their to do pile for the last decade unless you think your glue is more important than their safety!

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I have switched to getting as much as I need through mail order. It seems to work well. I was hoping to get tins of emulsion paint, but am not sure if that is allowed at anytime; but there were no deliveries available recently. However, some DIY superstores are operating a kind of remote 'click and collect' where you drive to their front door, text them with your name and order number, and they fetch the order from inside then leave it near the entrance, give you a wave and you load it in the car. 

 

Back to mail order; I sent for a palm sander, and other small decorating items from an Ebay shop. They came via DPD, some bottles of wood stain appeared courtesy of Royal Mail, and I had decided no one would deliver white spirit, until as a bit of a joke I entered it into the Ocado search - and they had it in stock. Lo and behold, two 750ml bottles (they had nothing bigger) turned up with my last grocery order, and I'm quite amazed. 

 

I wash my hands after taking each delivery, and have no complaints so far. 

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16 minutes ago, Gareth Collier said:

I've seen other comments like this so am replying as a recently retired postie who is still in regular contact with ex colleagues.

Even when I left 2 years ago RM wasn't near enough fully operational. In my office job cuts meant there were more walks than posties and the only way all addresses received their mail daily was via overtime. Staff sickness could mean some walks could go undelivered for 2/3 days. The situation is now far worse at my old office.

Staff cannot possibly get everything delivered and practicing responsible working makes me chuckle. They have zero PPE whilst working in a busy, cramped office, sorting mail shoulder to shoulder. They are being asked to deliver more mail, especially parcels covering more distance in the same timescale whilst standing away from front doors which is often impracticable.

The union is pushing for a temporary 3 day delivery but staff aren't impressed as it will mean having to deliver double when they are in as well as standing shoulder to shoulder for even longer sorting 2 days mail.

Sorry but comments like this from those not in the business aren't helpful and are misleading. RM could seriously do without people ordering their essential tube of glue so they can build that kit that's been in their to do pile for the last decade unless you think your glue is more important than their safety!

I have spoke with my postie who has delivered a few things to me the past week. He is glad that goods are still being sent, as he gets the change to see people, gets him out and keeps him fit.

 

I order stuff to help with my modelmaking, to help my mental health, as I live alone and haven't seen anyone I know for 2 weeks now.

 

I for one am very grateful for the postal service.

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Deliveries here are much the same as usual. I have just had some bike bits arrive by courier. He leaves the parcel on the doorstep, rings the bell and drives off. It has been unpacked and hands have been washed.

I ordered some bits on line the other day which I thought were coming from here in Ireland. The invoice and dispatch information emailed to me showed that they were coming from Bratislava! It will be interesting to see how long it takes them to arrive!

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16 minutes ago, Gareth Collier said:

I've seen other comments like this so am replying as a recently retired postie who is still in regular contact with ex colleagues.

Even when I left 2 years ago RM wasn't near enough fully operational. In my office job cuts meant there were more walks than posties and the only way all addresses received their mail daily was via overtime. Staff sickness could mean some walks could go undelivered for 2/3 days. The situation is now far worse at my old office.

Staff cannot possibly get everything delivered and practicing responsible working makes me chuckle. They have zero PPE whilst working in a busy, cramped office, sorting mail shoulder to shoulder. They are being asked to deliver more mail, especially parcels covering more distance in the same timescale whilst standing away from front doors which is often impracticable.

The union is pushing for a temporary 3 day delivery but staff aren't impressed as it will mean having to deliver double when they are in as well as standing shoulder to shoulder for even longer sorting 2 days mail.

Sorry but comments like this from those not in the business aren't helpful and are misleading. RM could seriously do without people ordering their essential tube of glue so they can build that kit that's been in their to do pile for the last decade unless you think your glue is more important than their safety!

 

...............and this is exactly why I don't know what to do and what is deemed responsible because I do think you have a very valid point - other contributors have focused on the we must keep small businesses going which is equally valid - perhaps in this case there is no right answer - not much doubt that people are more important than businesses - not sure I got my answer but its good to have shared...………...

For my part (I am self-isolating) I will concentrate on what I need to keep going for an assumed next 3 months and try to order as much as I can from one place 

 

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5 minutes ago, halsey said:

 

.... I will concentrate on what I need to keep going for an assumed next 3 months and try to order as much as I can from one place 

 

 

I'm not in the habit of throwing money away - I live in Yorkshire after all :jester: - but over the past week or so I've spread several of my orders for model railway bits and pieces over a handful of suppliers.

 

I could have ordered it all from my one regular supplier, but I've done this this time in the hope that it helps a greater number of smaller businesses with their cashflow.

 

I know it cost me a bit more in postage.  

 

I know it probably cost me a bit more for each item, as I didn't automatically go for the lowest price for similar items.

 

I know I'm fortunate that my income, while not generous, doesn't put me on the breadline either.

 

I appreciate that not everyone has the means to be able to do this, but if you can, it might help some of the smaller suppliers. 

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54 minutes ago, Gareth Collier said:

Sorry but comments like this from those not in the business aren't helpful and are misleading. RM could seriously do without people ordering their essential tube of glue so they can build that kit that's been in their to do pile for the last decade unless you think your glue is more important than their safety!

 

So we are all supposed to be responsible for managing Royal Mail? I'm pretty certain the amount of mail put through from our hobby is small compared to the rest of the market. Even if we don't order a pot of glue, there's a lot of other stuff going through the system. 1.5 million letters from Boris for a start.

 

Looking at your bigger point though, the solution is to shut Royal Mail down entirely, as you seem to be saying there is no way they can adapt for safe ways of working. For good. Do you work for DPD now?

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I'm the same; orders have been placed with suppliers that I have used before. I could have done one big order, but I'd like all the companies to still be here in 6 months time. The other bonus is that if one has to stop, bits will still arrive from the others. This means I keep occupied. Looking at some other forums, preserving sanity is becoming a hot topic. BT are doing their best to wreck mine; emails I need re getting online with Citizens Advice to help answer calls from the publis are disappearing into the ether or not being delivered. If my shopping helps to keep individuals from the current nightmare of trying to claim UC, then I think it is worthwhile.

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Just now, Phil Parker said:

 

So we are all supposed to be responsible for managing Royal Mail? I'm pretty certain the amount of mail put through from our hobby is small compared to the rest of the market. Even if we don't order a pot of glue, there's a lot of other stuff going through the system. 1.5 million letters from Boris for a start.

 

Looking at your bigger point though, the solution is to shut Royal Mail down entirely, as you seem to be saying there is no way they can adapt for safe ways of working. For good. Do you work for DPD now?

So you are putting words in my mouth and twisting what I have said, very professional of you in your administrator position, the sort of thing moderators frown upon. 

I was merely correcting assumptions and saying how it actually is rather than how uninformed people believe it is. Sure, our hobby is only contributing a small amount of mail but multiply this conversation over multiple hobby forums as well as all those out there ordering that dress that they just have to have and it soon adds up!  

As for you last paragraph  I never said that either, just pointed out that RM staff cannot work within the recommended safe ways of working. Many deliveries are covered by 2 posties in a van but they are no longer supposed to share a van and must work alone so twice as many vans are required, vans which don't exist!

As for your "do you work for DPD now" comment it just goes to show you didn't bother reading my post, I stated I had retired and I find it, frankly, crass. If you had actually read my post and understood it you may not have posted your ill informed rant.

No doubt the mods will now take action against me for calling out a staff member but you were out of order.

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25 minutes ago, Gareth Collier said:

how uninformed people believe it is

 

Yes, you do seem to be talking down to people from an 'I know better' point-of-view which doesn't actually help anyone.

 

I shall stop ordering paint and stuff then as I don't want to upset someone who doesn't work there now. The issue is for workers/management/unions to sort out - us stopping buying things (bigger picture) won't lead to a change in working practices but it will lead to lay-offs.

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It is up to individual company' management, whether it's Royal Mail or any other, to provide safe systems of work. It really isn't for individual customers to police this except perhaps in the most blatant cases- slavery perhaps..  So until RM is officially restricted in what it can deliver, I will continue to order essentials. 

 

What is 'essential' will depend upon the individual's judgement, until such time as officially defined, which as yet it hasn't been.

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16 minutes ago, AY Mod said:

 

Yes, you do seem to be talking down to people from an 'I know better' point-of-view which doesn't actually help anyone.

 

I shall stop ordering paint and stuff then as I don't want to upset someone who doesn't work there now. The issue is for workers/management/unions to sort out - us stopping buying things (bigger picture) won't lead to a change in working practices but it will lead to lay-offs.

Sarcasm from a moderator, and you misinforming and Phil twisting what people say does help?  What do I know, you're staff can do and act how you want, it's your sand pit. I'll go now to save you the trouble of banning me for daring to have a different opinion, bye.

 

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1 hour ago, Gareth Collier said:

just pointed out that RM staff cannot work within the recommended safe ways of working. Many deliveries are covered by 2 posties in a van but they are no longer supposed to share a van and must work alone so twice as many vans are required, vans which don't exist!

 

and to save me the bother of writing a reply, exactly what I was saying:

 

31 minutes ago, Sotto said:

It is up to individual company' management, whether it's Royal Mail or any other, to provide safe systems of work. It really isn't for individual customers to police this except perhaps in the most blatant cases- slavery perhaps.. 

 

Will cancelling a paint or glue order fix Royal Mail or any other delivery service? No. Will the lack of an order hurt a small business? Maybe. So, I'll follow the rules, not make any new ones up and order what I need.

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2 hours ago, Half-full said:

I have spoke with my postie who has delivered a few things to me the past week. He is glad that goods are still being sent, as he gets the change to see people, gets him out and keeps him fit.

 

I order stuff to help with my modelmaking, to help my mental health, as I live alone and haven't seen anyone I know for 2 weeks now.

 

I for one am very grateful for the postal service.

Oddly enough we are good friends with our postie and a few weeks ago I did ask her how the deliveries were going and how she felt about handling the mail etc, the answer was they were all happy for the overtime, basically raking it in......unfortunately now as she is a single parent with a small child and the nurseries have closed (apparently she is NOT an essential service) she is stuck at home not earning......well not the overtime anyway, although apparently the PO have been very good about her situation.

 

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28 minutes ago, Gareth Collier said:

for daring to have a different opinion

 

Oh, I don't think I've heard that one before. :rolleyesclear:

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There is a far far bigger picture here, we all need to be aware of all of it, there isn't a perfect answer, if there was we wouldn't be in this predicament.

 

Mike

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One thing that's become obvious lately is the number of opposing opinions that abound since the coronavirus outbreak. Even the 'experts' can't agree on every aspect of the problems that face us daily. The one thing that is clear is that there are no simple answers.

 

It's a pity that people can't have a sensible discussion without going off in a huff.

 

David

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Surely if we don't keep ordering lots of stuff online or by telephone (not just model railway stuff) then thousands of companies (and not just small ones) will go out of business. As a result the unemployment figures will surpass anything we've seen before. The government simply won't be able to afford the benefits and we could see social unrest that this country has never had before.

 

Robert

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