LNER Gresley BG Diagram D45 in 4mm scale

[macgeordie]

Last year, when I was demonstrating at Scalefour North I discussed the possibility of doing a Gresley BG to diagram D45 with a couple of the visitors who are also members of this forum. After a couple of months I had a bit of spare time so I drew up the sides as the original idea was that the other parts would all come from Dart castings. Jonathan Wealleans did a test build from these and the build was part of his thread on the forum. Later I decided to produce the van as a complete vehicle so I could add the detail I wanted and the results of this are below as my own test build. I have since ordered another set of test etches but of course the Virus has put paid to any possibility of getting those in the near future. 

 

 

 

 

I based the livery on a photo on Steve Banks's website, I was just going to put up the link, but the forum software automatically uploaded the photo for me which was clever. 

 

The diagram D45 vans were built by Cammell-Laird during 1927 and 1928. There were 8 vans built in 1927 originally numbered 163 to 170, the 1928 built vans numbered 35, 37, 6700 and then 171 to 193 giving a total of 25. The vans were all renumbered in 1943, the 1927 vans were numbered 70039 to 70045 and the 1928 vans became 70036 to 70038 and 70047 to 70069. The van originally numbered 170 was written off in an accident in 1947.

 

The D45 diagram vans were unusual in that they have no trussing to the underframe. I'm not sure when they were withdrawn, but they seem to have been around well into the 1960's

 

Once I get the next set of test etches I'll post a few pictures of the build sequence.

 

Ian

Edited April 13, 2020 by macgeordie
Rectified stupid mistake !!

[Jub45565]

Interesting looking vehicles - what bogies are they on?

 

May I ask what Thompson had to do with them if they were late 20s?

 

I'll be interested once the world, or at least etchers, return to normal.

[jwealleans]

These were a Gresley design, I'm not aware of Thompson having any involvement.  This is my test build posed on Shap last October:

 

 

 

My test build starts here although the etches have evolved considerably since then (ends are now included, for example).  Bogies are 8' Fox from MJT.

[macgeordie]

Hi Pete

 

you are perfectly correct, Thompson didn't have anything to do with these, it should of course have been Gresley. Too many things on the go at the same time!!  must be getting old. 

 

The bogies are Fox. I don't do a lot of NE stuff and it was the guys at S4 North who told me that these were the correct ones for this vehicle which is borne out by the photo on Steve Banks's website.

 

Ian

 

 

[Jub45565]

Thanks Ian.  I thought they looked like Fox, but likewise am not a expert in NE stuff so didn't want to presume! 

 

For those so inclined there are also sprung Fox bogies available, though by the sounds of it sourcing castings could be problematic:

 

https://miscellanymodels.com/future-plans-and-dreams/fully-sprung-fox-bogies/

[micklner]

Isinglass Models also do 3d printed Fox Bogies, very good value.

Edited April 13, 2020 by micklner

[Bucoops]

Still interested in one set of etches - when normal service resumes whenever that may be!

[Tim Lewis]

I'd be interested in one of these too.

[Mark Hamlin]

Yes please Ian, another great choice

[macgeordie]

Hi Gents

I have put the three of you on the list, if anybody else wants to go on the list, please pm me as it is easier for me to keep track of who wants what that way.

 

I've added the roof vents, the spacing at the centre looks a bit odd but that's the correct dimensions according to the Isinglass drawing. It's hard to tell from the prototype photos if it should be anything else so I decided to stick with the dimensions on the drawing.

 

 

 

 

 

The Guards van lettering is from the HMRS sheet, the lettering isn't as crisp as it usually is, so I'm wondering if I have used an old sheet as I have quite a few of this in my Transfers box.

 

Ian

Edited April 14, 2020 by macgeordie
Photos added

[macgeordie]

The new set of etches arrived today, I'll try to make a start on it in a couple of days.

 

 

 

Both sheets are roughly A4 size in 12 thou (0.3mm) material, one in Nickel Silver and the other in brass.

 

Ian

[sgt_bilco_2000]

Hi, id be interested in one of these etches too... this isolation period has got me back into modelling again. ive only ever modified locos from mr King's resin kits but looking to venture into modifying coaches and building complete kits... i know it wont be easy but ill try anything once! hehe

Cheers, Lee

[jwealleans]

If you're going to pitch straight into etched kits, Ian's aren't a bad place to start.   Best of luck.

 

[macgeordie]

1 hour ago, sgt_bilco_2000 said:

Hi, id be interested in one of these etches too... this isolation period has got me back into modelling again. ive only ever modified locos from mr King's resin kits but looking to venture into modifying coaches and building complete kits... i know it wont be easy but ill try anything once! hehe

Cheers, Lee

Hi Lee, welcome to the forum. You're a brave man wanting to try this model as your first attempt at an etched kit, it's fairly complex to assemble because of the overlays on the van side. I'm happy to put you on the list but you would be better off trying a kit aimed at the less experienced modeller first. Have a look at the Palbrick B by clicking the link in my signature below, this kit was specifically designed for the less experienced modeller but makes up into a nice model.

 

Ian

[sgt_bilco_2000]

4 hours ago, macgeordie said:

Hi Lee, welcome to the forum. You're a brave man wanting to try this model as your first attempt at an etched kit, it's fairly complex to assemble because of the overlays on the van side. I'm happy to put you on the list but you would be better off trying a kit aimed at the less experienced modeller first. Have a look at the Palbrick B by clicking the link in my signature below, this kit was specifically designed for the less experienced modeller but makes up into a nice model.

 

Ian

Thanks Ian. Im probably coming over a bit overconfident, but hopefully i'll get a kit and/or some coach sides for my birthday soon that i can gain some experience with first... no harm in sitting on the BG till im confident enough though. i mostly play with classic cars during the week, so i hope some of those skills will transfer over to some degree... im expecting to have to make myself some tooling and jigs for the more complex builds too.

Cheers, Lee

[macgeordie]

O.K. Lee, I have put you on the list, I'll pm you when things get further down the line.

 

Ian

[Headstock]

2 hours ago, macgeordie said:

O.K. Lee, I have put you on the list, I'll pm you when things get further down the line.

 

Ian

 

Good morning Ian,

 

I have a couple of queries on the BG, is it better to PM?

[macgeordie]

Hi Lee

 

A pm would be fine.

 

Cheers

Ian

Edited April 27, 2020 by macgeordie

[macgeordie]

I made a start on the bodywork yesterday and the basic body shell is now assembled. I fitted the overlays with the RSU as this is the easiest way to do it. Fitting the overlays is the most difficult part of this model, so once that is done the rest is very straightforward. The dimples in the middle of the double doors are the bump stops which were pressed out with the rivet punch. There are matching bump stops on the n.s. overlay alongside each door produced in the same way.

 

 

The partitions with the hinges attached look O.K. and make assembling the body easier

 

 

 

I'll make a start on the 'Bow Ends' today as once they are fitted the main bodyshell is complete and I can start on the chassis then.

 

Ian

[macgeordie]

I got the rest of the main body structure assembled today, here are the Bow Ends

 

 

I made a start on the chassis and folded up the floor but I'm not happy with the fit, it goes into place but it is too tight for my liking so I think I will modify the drawing to rectify that.

 

 

I was in conversation with 'Headstock' of this forum by pm yesterday and discovered that these vans don't have a lower lip to the solebar, they have a bulbous shaped profile instead, here are a couple of pictures he has sent me showing the shape.

 

 

 

In order to accommodate this I have modified the solebars for this model by removing the lip.

 

 

Once I get it assembled I'll solder a length of wire, probably 0.45mm along the bottom of the solebar overlay to replicate it.

 

As I am going to modify the brass etch anyway to rectify the floor issue it isn't a problem to alter the solebars.

This will mean it will take a bit longer before I can supply everybody who has asked for one of these vans as I'll have to have a new tool made and check it is correct.

 

I'll do a bit more tomorrow on the floor and post more pictures. 

 

Ian

Edited April 29, 2020 by macgeordie
Typo rectified

[macgeordie]

I added the solebars and the overlays today, I had hoped to get a lot more done, but the 'trouble and strife' had other ideas !!

 

 

 

I then fitted the 0.45mm wire along the bottom edge of the solebar to replicate the bulbous edge shown in the photos earlier in the thread. It is easy enough to fit and fix by soldering along the underside of the solebar but frankly on this model I think it is probably a waste of time as it is barely visible and once the full length footsteps are in place you can hardly see it anyway. No doubt the perfectionists will want to fit it so I will add it to the instructions I have been writing.

 

 

 

I think I will try to get the bogies assembled tomorrow.

 

Ian

[macgeordie]

Bogies, battery boxes and guards footsteps now done. Next job is the Vac cylinders and brake parts.

 

 

 

 

 

I need to finish the bufferbeams next then I can get on with the mass of handrails on the van sides.

 

Ian

[jwealleans]

On 29/04/2020 at 11:07, macgeordie said:

I made a start on the bodywork yesterday and the basic body shell is now assembled. I fitted the overlays with the RSU as this is the easiest way to do it.

 

 

 

Quote

 

 

For those of us who don't have an RSU, I found the best way to fit the overlays was to add the handrails at the same time.  Using card to space them off the body and plenty of flux, I flooded them with solder from the back and this then wicked along behind the overlay and secured it.  You have to be careful with the sides after that so the handrails don't get distorted, but it worked for me.

 

 

 

 

Edited May 2, 2020 by jwealleans

[macgeordie]

Brake gear, buffer beam overlay, handrails and door handles now in place.

 

 

 

 

 

The handrails are a bit timetaking to fit but not difficult. I have put a handrail jig on the corner of the fret which makes it easy to mass produce (you only need four of each type at most) the main ones. The little support pieces fit through from the back of the side and you need a delicate touch with the iron to fix them in place but the alternative is handrail knobs and they would be far too big for this job.

 

This is how they are fixed on the inside face. I find this method of fixing much easier than trying to fit a short straight piece of wire. It's a good way of using up the little scrap bits that usually get thrown away as well.

 

 

I'll probably fit the roof tomorrow.

 

Ian

[macgeordie]

I got the roof fitted and did a bit more on the underframe.

 

The castings for the ends which come from MJT need modification as the various protrusions on the castings are not required for the D45 version.

 

 

The next problem is that the MJT castings don't match the profile of the MJT roof.

 

 

A bit of Hornby filler and some emery paper soon rectifies the issue.

 

 

Since I took this photo I've added more filler as I wasn't happy with the profile.

 

I have also now added the Dynamo and a representation of the drive belt as well as a piece of 0.45mm wire to represent the brake rodding.

 

 

I've also fitted the MJT buffers. Note the fact that the shank is offset to the fixing bolts and they are therefore 'handed'. I've never seen this before, I wonder if it is peculiar to the LNER.

 

 

I'll try to finish the filler on the roof ends and the roof torpedo vents tomorrow.

 

Ian

Edited May 5, 2020 by macgeordie
Typo rectified