It's all Greek to me! - My first (ever) layout which is based on the Greek railways

[manosfromgreece]

I have been a model train fan since a very young age when my parents bought me and my younger brother our first train set.

As usual with this things, there was only a circle of rails, a diesel loco and a few wagons with the train set.

But along came also a big - long silver carriage coach that was taking the passengers and my mind not around the circle but probably around the whole of the world. 

Over the years the desire for making a layout for our train set was always there but not the space, the time, the resources.

Life got in the way as they say and the layout idea never materialised but also never forgotten.

 

Come forward the last couple decades and Greek themed models started becoming available and I slowly started making a collection so that a day would come and the layout would become a reality.

 

Having left the big city and coming to leave to the country suddenly provided the time, the space and the opportunity. 

First steps started happening a couple of years ago when I put my carpentry skills to the test.

A baseboard in pieces that could be moved was the only way forward since we leave in a rented home. 

 

The idea behind the construction of the baseboard is to be portable and easy for moving and storage.

The two scenic pieces (front) are each 120 x 60cm while there is a long third piece 240 x 30 cm on the back side to keep the whole from sagging and also be used as a fiddle yard.

To get to this point obviously the first decisions had to be made.

It was important to me that there was a full circle for trains to travel around the layout.

It was important that there was a fiddle yard.   

After painting the baseboard to keep it somehow protected from my garage's humidity, it sat unused waiting for the next chance for me to get involved which didn't occure before almost a year.

But this will be on the next post.

 

Manos

 

[manosfromgreece]

Now that the baseboard was ready around a basic idea of the layout needs, some more thinking was necessary and a few decisions had to be made. The layout concept itself.

 

What I wanted to present was around my memories of the late eighties and mid nineties when as a teenager I did some extensive travelling by train in Greece. Visiting family in other cities of Greece, summer vacations and excursions, you get the idea.

 

At the time, the mountainous mainline railroad network was still a single line with sidings for trains of the opposite direction to wait for the express trains... The what we called the "posta" as it was carrying the post and stopping to every station was one of these. The preferred one for many people that wanted either to travel cheaply or just have an adventure and live life by meeting people of every kind and place...

 

So a single mainline with a small country station and a siding for a train to wait the express passenger train was set as the centre piece of the layout. The era is late eighties - mid nineties and obviously a setting on or close to mountains... The place is going to be fictional incorparating a mix of scenes inspired by real locations to the extent that there is a memory of mine associated with. 

 

Picture of Platamon station by Kostas Kakavas.

Picture of Rapsani station by John Milias

 

At this moment I must make clear that this is my first ever layout and there is no previous experience. Obviously to acquite experience you have to do things and this is what all this topic is about. Learning all about creating a layout. Sometimes the hard way.

 

So next was the track placing on the baseboard. Typical code 100 over cork. 

So that was the initial track laying which as usual with this thing, had to be removed a couple of times before we get to the final and current version.

But more on that on the next post.

 

Manos

[Allegheny1600]

Hi Manos,

It's great to see you posting and the layout is looking very promising.

I do envy you that you travelled on the Greek railways in that time period when so much fascinating motive power (locomotives) were to be seen and heard, wonderful stuff.

I shall follow with great interest,

John.

[manosfromgreece]

On 19/04/2020 at 13:01, Allegheny1600 said:

Hi Manos,

It's great to see you posting and the layout is looking very promising.

I do envy you that you travelled on the Greek railways in that time period when so much fascinating motive power (locomotives) were to be seen and heard, wonderful stuff.

I shall follow with great interest,

John.

Thanks John,

happy memories indeed with all those endless trips talking with people at an age and era that things were still pure...

This is what I'm trying to achieve with this layout, telling a story.

We'll see if I ever achieve it...

Manos

[manosfromgreece]

Continuing from my last post, I must keep reminding that I have no previous experience in all these, rather that setting a circle of rails on the floor and watching trains going by! So everything is new to me and I try to learn from wherever source I can find info on what every time I need to. Then I try to adapt to my circumstances. Some times it works, others it doesn't!

 

Cutting and gluing cork and then nailing the track down probably would be something probably I would have done differently, especially avoiding to keep the rails parallel to the baseboard. It would be so much interesting if there was a small angle just to break the symmetry. 

But then probably there wouldn't be enough space for a full circle to let trains go around! So I had to compromise here. Hours of testing with whatever loco I had available followed to make sure of derailments. But then again, the time of the next decission. Do I go DC or DCC? Having explored the DCC offerings in the past the decission was easy as I was spoiled by the pottential. This fact also ment that the wiring of the rails was quite simple.

A main going around the three pieces of the baseboard with dropers soldered to the sides or underneath the rails. How difficult would that be? Everybody is doing it on you tube! Well I did melt a few rails but finally I did get the hang of it. Quick connectors were used to connect the droppers to the main but I'm not still entirely convinced that I don't need to solder...

For connecting the main between the three boards so as to be able to split them, I used some mains quick connectors I had available but I would thing that sooner or later I must replace them with something more appropriate. And this is how much I had rpogressed with the layout before the Covid-19. There, I used the dreadfull word! 

But more on the next post!

Edited April 21, 2020 by manosfromgreece

[Allegheny1600]

Hi Manos,

This is looking great, you are learning very quickly, I am impressed!

(I still owe you a PM, sorry!).

Like you, I chose DCC for it's wiring simplicity but as time goes on and you learn more, you realise that there are many other benefits too, sound, lights and so on but also better slow speed control and it forces you to adopt a more "robust" wiring method.

I like your mains connectors, I think they will actually be better than a lot used in model railways due to their robustness. Also, the underneath of your boards reminds me of the underneath of mine on Leberecht!

Cheers,

John.

[manosfromgreece]

10 hours ago, Allegheny1600 said:

Hi Manos,

This is looking great, you are learning very quickly, I am impressed!

John.

 

You are too kind John, thanks. Keeping a record here on what I'm doing is also seeking for advice and motivation...

Early days yet.

Manos 

[manosfromgreece]

Over the years thinking that a day I would be building a Greek themed layout, I tried to collect rolling stock and scenery items that would look like Greek. Usually this was for DB, DRG or SNCF rolling stock that I was hoping to transform to Greek and European scenery items mainly German or Austrian and French that were close enough to what is the Greek equivalent.

It seems that lately there are at last on the market a few limited runs from named manufacturers or small local producers both for rolling stock and other scenery items but at a price. Anyway slowly I try to build up a collection by sorting and replacing of my stock what it is not really Greek with others that are closer to the real thing...

Now that the baseboard was ready, it was about time to start putting these things over and try to see what I could come up with.

 In this particular picture you can see the typical country small station, a bangalow and a detached house, a kiosk (periptero), a few era cars and lories and of course a Greek shunting loco with two wagons.

Wait, did I say shunting loco? Then there must be somewhere that this loco must shunt! So this is when I realized that just a circle with a siding would not only be boring but also wrong for by beloved loco. This is the first ever Greek loco I bought a little over 20 years ago and curently the one I have non digital yet! So some more changes in the tracks now became necessary.

But more on that on the next post.

[manosfromgreece]

So there must me something and somewhere for my shunting loco to shunt. Realizing that was an important next step that brought together a little more thinking with regards the scenery set up of the layout.

So here are two sidings with two sidings each. The left one close to the layout edge is going to be a local parking and maintenance for the shunting loco while the other one to the right a siding to a factory represented here with the foam pieces. The single mainline is the center track.

As already said, it is important to me that memories are taking part in the story that the layout represents, Memories, story, these are words immediately associated to me with family of which Greeks are well known to keep close and big! So this is about the time I paid tribute to my great grandfather who was an engineer. In his village on northern Greece, after the war, he single-handedly build a factory that created and distributed electriciy to the village and other two close ones. After years of operation, he sold this factory to the state owned electricity company. He then proceeded to make his next factory of which I have fade memories as a child in the early 70s. Initialy a water operated and then an electric operated floor mill that every farmer in the wider area would bring his corn or wheat to be milled. After that was done, his son - my great uncle, would load it to his big mercedes lorry to return in sacks. It was a big house size factory and there was not any rails nearby, but this is just a minor detail... Probably I will be building something resembling the early years of the factory operating still with water so I can use the pipes to hide the hole that leads to the backside of the scenery part of the layout. 

But more on the next post.  

Edited April 23, 2020 by manosfromgreece

[manosfromgreece]

Continuing to the right side of the layout, there was a problem to solve and an important reality to address. Contrary to the wider public belief because of the popular islands, Greece in general is a mountainous country. So part of the layout must show that while at the same time hide another hole to the scenic part where the trains are going to the backside. The most commonly used method of doing that obviously is with a tunnel!

 And the above picture is a random placement of different ideas to represent different but common Greek scenery items.

 

Idea one: A hill with a small chappel on the top, a woods wildfire warning oservation platform, a tunnel with some scenery aspects around it and the usual human intervention as a taverna or a small country house.

 

Idea two: Putting a radar antenna military installation on the top of the hill secluded by an army camp where additional cameo ideas might be offered to make the layout more interesting. 

 

To be truthful I'm inclined towards the second idea, as my father used to be an Air Force officer working always on tops of mountains all over Greece where radar bases were built. I have spent many a Xmas, Easter and other public holidays in such bases so our family could be together at those important moments. Growing up in a military family obvioysly offered me quite early appreciation to important ethics and values of which I'm grateful.

 

It is not easy for most of my non-Greek friends to understand what it is to have real agrressive neighbours. Real fighting planes flying armed every single day over your house, naval ships coming around your islands to offend the fishermen and freighten the tourists and damage the economy.

You may be aware of the latest weapon on their long list: pushing thousands of immigrants (and dozens of disguised secret agents along with them so as to control them) over the borders in sea and land. But enough with politics. (Rant over and please let me know if this is too much out of topic, so as to remove it.)

 

The central part of the layout will have the typical Greek country station surounded by tall trees along with the small toilet building and other station paraphernalia.  A major difference between the Greek station platforms and the ones in UK is in height. In Greece the height of the balast to the platform is something around a foot or so and you have to climb to enter the carriage. Please see picture of Platamon station on post #2 above. I believe now slowly as the stations are rebuild due to elictrification of the mainline, they make the platforms to carriage height.

Behind the station there will be the main road of the village / city with a few old (= therefore traditional stone houses), possibly a grocery store or similar, a bus stop and a kiosk (periptero) that they are so common everywhere in Greece. I have yet to decide whether it will be an asphalt road or a cobblestone, or both in parts of the layout. 

Gradually the layout will start raising towards the right side offering locations to build a taverna or a left over from the 2nd world war pillbox overlooking the rails before the tunel. Still many of those surviving in Greece especiially close to areas considered strategic to trafic back at the time.

So that's the general view of the layout at the moment and your comments and ideas with regards the above would be greatly appreciated.

But more on the next post.

Edited April 24, 2020 by manosfromgreece

[Allegheny1600]

Hi Manos,

I do like the little chapel but you are right, military outposts (or radio masts?) are a common theme on the tops of mountains. I guess whatever you feel is better to portray your country!

It does not bother me if you talk realistically about how things are in Greece - so much the better, I say. If that offends anyone, they don't have to read.

On my first visit to Greece in 1977, aged 12 with my parents, I clearly remember signs advising whether road bridges were safe for tanks - with the outline of a Sherman tank on them! (crossed though if unsafe, I guess).

I will be very interested to learn more about what types of road vehicles were to be seen on the road in your time frame. I have one police vehicle, a post van and a couple of trucks but no civilian vehicles (yet!).

Cheers,

John.

[Neils WRX]

What a really interesting subject to model.

 

I went to Greece several times in the mid 1990’s to ride behind the Alco’s etc.

 

I actually have one piece of Greek rolling stock in my collection a Refrigerated van.

 

Thanks,

 

Neil

[manosfromgreece]

Being under the lock down obviously offered me time that was not available in the past. Various seasonal chores are taken care but somehow I find myself able to steal some time and drag myself to the garage. This slowly is been transformer to my manhole instead of the storage area it used to be! Among the things I do there of course some are not exactly modelling but surely close related enough!  

This is my airbrush spraybooth which I constructed from a banch of plastic advertising sheets collected over the years from my job. It is not that I could not buy one of the ready made sold everywhere, it is just the pure satisfaction of the making.

Heroes to the rescue would be a good line here! This is how a constructed the enclosure that contains the fan that sacks air from the spraybooth. The fan itself is recycled from an old fan air heater. 

I'm a total novice on painting and although as a child I was modelling airfix and the like, I was never experienced or properly introduced on model painting techniques. You tube is your friend and now I'm into the phase that I'm experimenting and getting to know the perks of an airbrush.

On the left the model is under Hallfords primer. In the center sprayed with Vallejo white and in the right weathered with a very dark apparently wash of black cheap acryllic paint. I'm trying to get accustomed to mixing paints so as to get as possible close to the real thing but it is still very early for me.

The red of the tile roof is not yet the proper redish colour of the Greek style tiles as in the below picture of a real.

But then again, to an extent this is a local thing and in some areas the tiles are more yellowish than red.

Some more research is now in order and certainly more practice for me and the airbrush!

But more on that on the next post.

Edited April 25, 2020 by manosfromgreece

[manosfromgreece]

So trying ballasting was my next task. Obviously no previous experience as this is my first layout.

Things to consider: ballast in Greece is quite more white-ish due to sun than what we have in UK.

Photo by Nikos Papaletsos.

On the other hand, tracks in the station proximity are quite dirty from the diesel locos that still are in operation in Greece although gradually now more and more electric ones are in use.

Photo by Chris Mavropoulos.

 

So this was my first try and I think I'm happy with. This is the Peco PS-305 Grey Weathered ballast applied with the usual 50-50 mix of PVA glue with water and a drop of Fairy. I had sprayed before with a 50% isopropyl alcohol - water mix to break surface tension. I had put between the rails those polysterene pieces to the width of what I'll make the platform so as to keep ballast from going everywhere and then having to remove it.

After a day or two, I tried also ballasting the siding but this time I used the medium light ballast from Woodland scenics that was mo re white-ish as I wanted to point the difference of the traffic between the two tracks.

I must have done something wrong here since there are many lumps on the ballast. Either the fairy was not enough or I didn't wet the ballast enough with isopropyl alcohol before I applied the PVA. 

I'm considering my options now and looking on how to apply ballast over the turnpoints that I have not tried yet.

But more on the next post.

 

Edited April 26, 2020 by manosfromgreece

[Allegheny1600]

Hi Manos,

Very interesting! I cannot believe I've never noticed how different Greek ballast is, thanks for pointing that out.

I would say that ballasting (followed by wiring?) is one of the most tedious tasks faced by railway modellers, I do hope you have kept all the point blades clear? I have used vaseline in the past to make sure of this as well as thin strips of masking tape.

Painting the rail sides is another difficult task but the final effect is worth it. Just keep clearing the inside of the rail heads as well as the tops, free of paint, that is. However, quite a few people don't bother painting the rails and that's fine.

Despite all my precautions on Leberecht, I still had to do a LOT of rail cleaning after I had painted the rails.

Cheers,

John.

[manosfromgreece]

18 minutes ago, Allegheny1600 said:

I do hope you have kept all the point blades clear? I have used vaseline in the past to make sure of this as well as thin strips of masking tape.

Painting the rail sides is another difficult task but the final effect is worth it. Just keep clearing the inside of the rail heads as well as the tops, free of paint, that is.

John.

Hi John, I have not gone yet close to the points. I need to see whether I have to remove all applied ballasting and redo, or if I can just somehow rectify. I have tried in a few places, some with results better than others. I'm still looking on how to do the points and then finish with all ballasting on the scenic part of the layout. I have not yet made up my mind on what I'll do on the factory area. Whether it will be rails under asphalt or something different. I'm doing some research now. What I did try was to run a few locos over the ballasted track and see if there were any issues. After a pass of the inside side of the rails with a knife, everything is running smooth now...

As always your comments very much appreciated.

Manos

[Bochi]

Iasou Manos! I remember the Greek railways from around 1979-1982 when I was a student and then an English language teacher in Athens and Thebes. There are some really spectacular routes. I've often thought about a Greek layout but been put off by the lack of RTR stock available, especially for earlier periods.

 

My favourite was the metre gauge Pelopponesian railway which I think is a fantastic subject with dramatic scenery. Has anybody ever modelled the ex-Us Army Baldwin MacArthur locomotives that ran on it?

[manosfromgreece]

6 hours ago, Bochi said:

Iasou Manos! I remember the Greek railways from around 1979-1982 when I was a student and then an English language teacher in Athens and Thebes. There are some really spectacular routes. I've often thought about a Greek layout but been put off by the lack of RTR stock available, especially for earlier periods.

 

My favourite was the metre gauge Pelopponesian railway which I think is a fantastic subject with dramatic scenery. Has anybody ever modelled the ex-Us Army Baldwin MacArthur locomotives that ran on it?

Hi Bochi and thanks for your message. I know what you meen about the RTR which you can now find but in price and not too big a variety. Good progress is made though...

The Peloponnesian metric railway has indeed some wonderfull routes especially if you go to the rack railway "odontotos" (derived from odontas = tooth - tootded railway) between Diakopto and Kalavrita. More info here: http://www.trainose.gr/en/tourism-culture/train-and-recreation/the-rack-railway/ and here https://www.odontotos.com/index-en.htm. There is now a gent that offers RTR the rack railway trains.

There is a strong community of Greek railroad modellers with some scratch building locomotives and others modifiyng similar RTR that run in other countries. I'm not aware in particular for the Baldwins but I'll keep an eye for. 

Manos

[manosfromgreece]

Now that I'm slowly getting into the scenery phase of the layout the back scene options came up.

To my understanding there are four different routes one could go. First, do nothing. Leave a sky colour as is and forget. Not really my thing. I have been looking that blueish back scene for the last two years totally hating it! Second option: paint a scenic, resembling the area or the sky of the place you modelling. Out of the question for me. Totally untalented in painting! Option three: take a picture of what you like of the real thing that would suit and have it printed. I have been taking picture after picture over the years but still not found what I'm looking for. Option four: buy one of the available on the market back scene and be happy. Well this is what I did and generally speaking, I'm happy. I have been looking for that option for some time but I was always undecided. Last week I thought I give it a try anyway and spontaneously ordered one from Ebay to what I thought would look like enough to a Greek scene...

This is the one I bought and since it came with a white frame all around, some surgery was necessary.

Some trial fitting to see what it looked like

The net reasult is as follows and after some trimming I'm happy with.

The colours ressemble a hot Greek day and the mountaineus scene is very similar to a Greek one. Even the stone walls between different land pieces look very similar to what there is in Greece. I used spray adhesive and a paint foam roller to apply the paper on the wood pieces of the backscene. The only thing I didn't thought before was what I would do with the two back corners. 

I have rounded the paper similarly both sides so as to full the eye not to notice the corner. I plat to cut and glue two polysterene foam triangles each corner to make the curve less prone to tearing up in an accident.

Of course both sides are about 20cm short. But I'm not worried about as It wil be filled with "activities" and I have kept the blue sky pieces I trimmed off so as to extend at least the sky to the upper part of the enclosure if that makes sense!

But more on my next post.

[ColinK]

Backscene looks good.  I wonder why your ballast went like it did?

[manosfromgreece]

3 hours ago, ColinK said:

Backscene looks good.  I wonder why your ballast went like it did?

Hi ColinK, I plan to give it another try in the next few days and see what's going to happen. SInce it was my first time ballasting I suppose that I did something wrong, probably surface tension related. Thanks for your comment.

Manos

[Neils WRX]

This thread brought back a few memories and I scanned a couple of prints from a trip back in 1996.

 

 

 

 

Layout is looking good by the way!!!

 

Thanks

 

Neil

[manosfromgreece]

1 hour ago, Neils WRX said:

This thread brought back a few memories and I scanned a couple of prints from a trip back in 1996.

Layout is looking good by the way!!!

 

Thanks

 

Neil

Hi Neil, these pictures are a treasure, many thanks for posting. I have traveled with all of them! I love photography but back then unfortunately I didn't picture them with only a few exceptions. Next time I visit my parents' home back in Greece I have to dig out what prints I can find. That might be interesting.

Manos

[Neils WRX]

One observation from the pictures is the ballast isn’t always light in colour, some has a slight red’ish tint to it.

 

On my Balkan now Czech layout I used a medium size light grey ballast, and then just weathered the track to get a similar effect to what you are after.

 

 Thanks 

 

Neil

[manosfromgreece]

Today I did try again on ballasting.I used again the Medium light grey from woodland scenics which is brighter than the weathered grey from Peco used to the first rail in front the station. I also had the opportunity to use again the yellow ballast  spreader that I downloaded from https://www.thingiverse.com/thing:167093 and printed myself in a Prussa clone 3d printer. I'm very fond of the idea of trying to make up yourself what you can rather than buing ready, but obviously there are limits to each one of us, up to where you can reach...

As still I'm not sure on what went wrong with my first trial, this time I did try on a smaller part. Initially I masked around it, 

But as soon as I applied first a generous spray of water / isopropolyn alcohol and then the PVA glue / water mix, the masking tape started slipping and letting the ballast spread.

You can see the cork just visible in the picture above.

I suppose that probably I did apply more than necessary of the PVA mix. I removed all the masking tape trying to keep the ballast and as soon as it started drying, I did put it back in place with some finger tapping.

So far is looks good but obviously I need to wait until it dries to make sure. Hopefully in a day or two.

But more in my next post.