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Burchill Edge Sidings - BR Blue Carriage/NPCCS Sidings, with a nod to Manchester Red Bank & Bristol Malago Vale


9C85
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2 hours ago, Sandhole said:

The red and grey came to certain brakevans on the end of the Fiddler's Ferry MGR trains in Warrington.
These trains had a brace od 20's on the front and were reversed through Arpley yard before heading under the WCM at Bank Quay Station.
I think they were dedicated to these trains.
Chris.

Now there’s some useful information! Possibly not for 9C85, but definitely for someone about to procure 2x20s and some MGRs for a Point of Ayr to Fiddler’s Ferry diagram..

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On 17/10/2021 at 15:48, 9C85 said:

I have seen a nice weathered example on ebay but underneath the grime, it's in grey livery. IIRC grey denotes 'unfitted' stock? ...although I never quite got my head around how an unfitted brake van worked? ..unless it simply added resistance at the rear of the train to stop wagons bunching up?

 

Unfitted = no automatic train brake. All brake vans have a handbrake controlled from within the cabin.

The main reason for using a brake van was to allow the rear half of a train to be safely stopped in the event of a train splitting. They were used to keep the couplings of a loose coupled, unbraked train tight (reducing the chances of the train splitting in the first place. On slight gradients with short trains the van's brake alone would be enough, but on longer trains the train would stop at the top of the gradient, several wagons brakes applied (pinned down) meaning the locos would have to pull the train down-hill under full control rather than risk it running away under its own weight.

 

By the period of Burchill Sidings there were very few unbraked trains left running. Brake vans were by then mostly used with dangerous goods (chemicals, nuclear flasks etc), propelling moves (as per the Warrington HAA trains) and possibly the Bristol one shown above. Historically class 03 & 04 often needed assistance of an extra couple of axles to reliably trigger the track detection circuits, but I'm not sure if the heavier class 08s needed this. I don't recall the one used at Manchester Piccadilly using one

 

Steven B.

 

 

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I remember seeing the 08's at Temple Meads with a brake van with yellow stripe in the early 1980's for shunting GUV's etc.

 

I think it was mainly used by the shunters to travel in rather than the loco cab, not sure if the 08's were double manned in those days? 

 

I did even manage a ride a couple of times just down the platforms.

 

Layout looks great by the way.

 

Neil

 

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On 19/10/2021 at 19:28, 61656 said:

Now there’s some useful information! Possibly not for 9C85, but definitely for someone about to procure 2x20s and some MGRs for a Point of Ayr to Fiddler’s Ferry diagram..

p536994089-3.jpg.3b791f7521080868a87cac514d19cbbc.jpg

 

Courtesy of the excellent Paul Bartlett's website

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2 hours ago, Neils WRX said:

I remember seeing the 08's at Temple Meads with a brake van with yellow stripe in the early 1980's for shunting GUV's etc.

 

I think it was mainly used by the shunters to travel in rather than the loco cab, not sure if the 08's were double manned in those days? 

 

I did even manage a ride a couple of times just down the platforms.

 

Layout looks great by the way.

 

Neil

 

 

6 hours ago, Steven B said:

 Historically class 03 & 04 often needed assistance of an extra couple of axles to reliably trigger the track detection circuits, but I'm not sure if the heavier class 08s needed this. I don't recall the one used at Manchester Piccadilly using one.

 

I was under the impression it was more to do with the length of the ensemble rather than the weight of it? I read somewhere ages ago that the brake van was tagged on to stop the 08s getting 'lost amongst the track circuits around Bristol TM'.

Whatever the reason,  it adds interest to the playability. 

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08’s could certainly be too short for reliable track circuit operation, so that’s a plausible reason.
 

It appears brakevans were regularly added to fully fitted MGR trains serving Denby, to allow staff to travel on the train to work some crossing gates on the line. Presumably the back cab of the loco was a long walk from the rear of the train. You can find lots of pictures by searching Flickr for “mgr brakevan”. 

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On 17/10/2021 at 17:48, 9C85 said:

Thanks.  I do like the yellow-patched air brake variant

I have just found and ordered a bargain brake van off ebay.  It's the air braked version with yellow patches. Obviously it will need a heavy dose of weathering. 

Can anyone tell me where I can get some 4mm scale shunting staff, suitable for early 80s period? I would like a guard to stand on the van's veranda (easier to type than to say) and a shunter to ride on the steps of either the van or the 08 (don't tell H&S).

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18 hours ago, 9C85 said:

I have just found and ordered a bargain brake van off ebay.  It's the air braked version with yellow patches. Obviously it will need a heavy dose of weathering. 

Can anyone tell me where I can get some 4mm scale shunting staff, suitable for early 80s period? I would like a guard to stand on the van's veranda (easier to type than to say) and a shunter to ride on the steps of either the van or the 08 (don't tell H&S).

Modelu have what your looking for.

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20211028_165407.jpg.7edc85727c0e2c5d5567d8d1370c6ed3.jpg

 

20211028_165347.jpg.218a57e56476942064ae928741d8b52e.jpg

 

Latest addition. Straight out of the box. I am really pleased with it. Bargain too.

 

I have run out of Kadees to fit to it so I took some off the care-worn looking Mk1 and put that at the end of the cripple siding ( I had to reintroduce the two CCTs back into traffic to make space).

 

I have push-tested the van over the magnets and turnouts and it seems to be OK, if a little bit low clearance. 

 

I will try and do a bit of shunting with it on my next session. Bob, the fictional shunter, is already looking forward to stretching the 08s legs on station pilot duties.

 

Obviously it needs weathering. IIRC I need to Dulcote it before applying the weathering powders? I might fire up the airbrush if I am feeling brave enough. 

 

I was only in the garage 10 minutes or so testing it out and I am already pleased with the splash of 'mundane variety ' the van will give.

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I have just visited Paul Bartlett's excellent website to get inspiration for weathering the brake van when, lo and behold....

574070318_Screenshot_20211028-184657_SamsungInternet.jpg.d2abbd861a45d0f95c86a5c5adfd3514.jpg

The very same van, in the same condition.  My work is done :-)

 

Copyright Paul Bartlett

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2 hours ago, 9C85 said:

 

But of course there's an app for that...

1590322508_Screenshot_20211029-134041_RandomNumberGeneratorPlus.jpg.8e1df22a49592868d6ec569d4a0eb5f1.jpg

 

But surely a toy bingo machine would be much more fun ?? :rolleyes:

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Yesterday evening, I had the first shunting session with the brake van attached to the 08.

One of the Kadees was sitting a bit low and got caught on the turnouts a few times.  I have had a go with a needle file on both the NEM pocket and the boss that the pocket clips into on the underside of the van floor.  Things improved but I will probably try and file both down a bit further 

This is the first Hornby model that I have had trouble with the height of the NEM pockets. My Mk1s and BGs were all spot on.

I also had an issue with the metal wheelsets being attracted to the hidden magnet at the yard entrance. I have put a bit of camera case foam between one axle and the floor of the van. This stops the van from 'quivering' and uncoupling over the magnet, but I think I need to reduce the amount of foam, as the axle is more or less locked up now.

I still think the weathering below the solebars would be better done with an airbrush. I was looking last night and I hadn't realised that I have three bogie NPCCS in more or less ex-works condition.  I will get the airbrush out when time and atmospheric conditions permit. I am still in two minds about what to do with the Pullman stock. I could have a go at weathering them but I might sell them as a job lot and get some more 'ordinary' stock.

Can anyone think of any yards that we're 'dual-purpose'? i.e. passenger/NPCCS AND freight? I was thinking of an excuse to run a 56 into the yard.  Possibly a steel terminal up the line with trailing access from one line only, which requires the train to reverse in the yard? There is actually a steelworks on the backscene so it wouldn't be too implausible. After all, Rule 1, and that.

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My poor Newspapers BG is getting a hammering.  I tried adding more weathering powders to it, didn't like that, then I tried T-cut to clean it off, didn't have the courage to go through with it, so washed it off, then decided to cover that mistake up with Humbrol black wash. So this is how it looks now...

 

20211031_125932.jpg

Edited by 9C85
Tpyo
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20211031_135753.jpg.6c98b2278a8887155c329a93c8d7d329.jpg

Desperate times...

In a state of panic, the shunter has to make use of the fuel point headshunt/cripple road to hold the four coaches of the Nottingham stopping service in order to make room in No 4 road for the 47 to shunt the incoming Pullman stock.

Things will improve soon, however, as the 47 will then drop back down to the far end of the reception road for the 08 to drop its four coaches onto it. The 47 will propel its stock onto the arrival/departure road and head for Nottingham.

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A few pictures chronicling the moves of the 25 as it comes off the fuel point,traverses the yard, and follows the 08 (plus brake van) up to Burchill Station whence it will drag its train of mixed passenger and parcels stock to Chester. We start with a peek through the girders of the overbridge to catch the 25 waiting for the ground signal to allow it off the fuel road.

20211113_131507.jpg.68b961b2b3a49a530c666613e7ab37ec.jpg

 

 

20211113_131529.jpg

 

20211113_132450.jpg.8fd019fcc861b058e5a7f1844338c60b.jpg

Edited by 9C85
Corrected order of pictures
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Found myself home alone this weekend so I thought I would finally get round to weathering the remaining unweathered stock (apart from the Pullmans). I was quite pleased with how well the airbrush worked and actually enjoyed something I have been putting off for months. 

Some before and after pictures...

 

This is the other side of the Newspapers BG that I have made a mess of...

20211114_094702.jpg.ac2ae3f7f16d44e6247307119a076298.jpg

 

And this is it now...

20211114_115627.jpg.dae56396a095e9d3884b3c2868ff5c59.jpg

 

 

 

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