Jump to content

Gilbert Lane its P Way and Signals etc.


Recommended Posts

Here's another signal from my stash that as not made it to Gilbert Lane.

 I made this c1995, the etches are from D&S but, as is my usual practice the main post and dolls are filed from brass bar. The "Down Rods" are bent wire and Hornby Dublo style, but from normal viewing distance they make a good representation of the Rocking Shafts often used on NERly bracket signals. I have of course moved on, and if I was now to make the signal I would have correct and working "Rockers".

SPARE, Ex NERly Bracket.JPG

  • Like 7
Link to post
Share on other sites
On 04/05/2020 at 21:57, Compound2632 said:

There aren't enough layouts that take the signalling as their starting-point!

 

That is a very good point. Many years ago I was taught that when designing a layout, the signalling should be a very early part of the process. If signalling it is either very difficult to work out, or massively complicated, then the design is probably not too prototypical.

 

If you need a forest of signals to work a simple layout, you should look at redesigning the layout or you are modelling the North Eastern Railway!  

  • Like 1
  • Agree 2
Link to post
Share on other sites
10 hours ago, micknich2003 said:

Here's another signal from my stash that as not made it to Gilbert Lane.

 I made this c1995, the etches are from D&S but, as is my usual practice the main post and dolls are filed from brass bar. The "Down Rods" are bent wire and Hornby Dublo style, but from normal viewing distance they make a good representation of the Rocking Shafts often used on NERly bracket signals. I have of course moved on, and if I was now to make the signal I would have correct and working "Rockers".

SPARE, Ex NERly Bracket.JPG

 

That’s a beautifully built signal. Interesting arrangement too with the arm behind the doll but the spectacle plate in front (or are my eyes deceiving me?) Was that a common arrangement on the H&B?

Edited by Titanius Anglesmith
Spelling
  • Like 2
Link to post
Share on other sites

NERly signals were "Inside Arm" or as often ref to "Slotted Post". After the Grouping several NERly pattern signals appeared on the former H&BRly.

 The H&BRly like most other railways used conventional "Outside Arms", see earlier posts.

  • Like 2
Link to post
Share on other sites
6 hours ago, t-b-g said:

 

That is a very good point. Many years ago I was taught that when designing a layout, the signalling should be a very early part of the process. If signalling it is either very difficult to work out, or massively complicated, then the design is probably not too prototypical.

 

If you need a forest of signals to work a simple layout, you should look at redesigning the layout or you are modelling the North Eastern Railway!  

Tony a matter of opinion if or not the NERly was over signalled or correctly signalled, there's a lot to be said for "A Signal for every move", see attached.

 Top sketch shows how the NERly would have done it with two separate signals.

 Bottom sketch shows the same layout after the LNERly had rationalized. The signalman backs a train from the Siding and onto the Up Main to shunt through the X Over and away via the Down Main. Unfourtantly he forgets to restore No2 points before pulling off No3 Shunt Signal which now reads two ways. The driver see's it off (3) and proceeds only to find himself back where he started., or worst sets back through the buffer stops and does a lot of damage.

EXAMPLE.jpg

  • Like 4
Link to post
Share on other sites

Here is No30 Down Main Distant. Ex H&BRly signal as later fitted with a UQ arm. Usual etches etc and post filed from brass, the finial is a lost wax casting.  Additional details, battery box at foot of post made from Plasticard, insulator at top of post cut from line arm of an old Airfix telegraph pole.

30 Down Main Distant.  .JPG

  • Like 6
Link to post
Share on other sites
  • RMweb Gold
On 08/05/2020 at 13:47, micknich2003 said:

Tony a matter of opinion if or not the NERly was over signalled or correctly signalled, there's a lot to be said for "A Signal for every move", see attached.

 Top sketch shows how the NERly would have done it with two separate signals.

 Bottom sketch shows the same layout after the LNERly had rationalized. The signalman backs a train from the Siding and onto the Up Main to shunt through the X Over and away via the Down Main. Unfourtantly he forgets to restore No2 points before pulling off No3 Shunt Signal which now reads two ways. The driver see's it off (3) and proceeds only to find himself back where he started., or worst sets back through the buffer stops and does a lot of damage.

EXAMPLE.jpg

The oft-claimed advantage of using only a single arm for various different routes on shunting signals was that it made everybody more cautious in both checking the route was correctly set before starting a move and made Drivers proceed very carefully and slowly when making the move.  Of course, depending on the arrangement of the locking, it could also save money and definitely saved lamp oil and time lamping signals.  You may take your choice regarding who made the decision to use a single arm/disc for more than one route ;)

  • Like 1
Link to post
Share on other sites
4 hours ago, The Stationmaster said:

The oft-claimed advantage of using only a single arm for various different routes on shunting signals was that it made everybody more cautious in both checking the route was correctly set before starting a move and made Drivers proceed very carefully and slowly when making the move.  Of course, depending on the arrangement of the locking, it could also save money and definitely saved lamp oil and time lamping signals.  You may take your choice regarding who made the decision to use a single arm/disc for more than one route ;)

 

That's much the same as the argument that lack of AWS made for more careful driving. Or any other safety system...

Edited by Compound2632
  • Agree 2
Link to post
Share on other sites

Here is another one one from my stash that won't get used, an ex H&BRly Three Position signal.

 

 Usual construction details, arm "Home Brewed" from a drawing that was published in the "Model Engineer" c1941.

SF69  Three position UQ..JPG

  • Like 6
Link to post
Share on other sites

Here's another one that wont make it to the new layout. Made some years for the previous layout and now abandoned. It was to signal a junction on two Permissive Block Goods lines hence the two Calling On arms. The lefthand doll at sometime as been fitted with UQ arms, while the righthand doll remains in its original H&BRly style.  Usual construction and etches, though the bracket is cut from Plasticard.

SPARE, SALLYFIELD Jct 509.jpg

  • Like 7
Link to post
Share on other sites
  • 2 weeks later...

Hi, Mick,

I had working signals on Shaw Bridge, which I constructed from MSE parts and one was a double gantry GWR bracket whichI converted to an L & Y bracket using MSE.

unfortunately I have no photos of the bracket signal.

I had a couple of ground signals in the loop but they were none working, I was told it’s very difficult to get ground signals working, very fiddly but not impossible.

peter

 

Edited by Gravy Train
  • Like 1
Link to post
Share on other sites
  • 1 month later...

Some weeks since I have posted anything on Gilbert Lane, and actually owing to other interests nothing done. Whatever, thoughts are now back to the layout and the level crossing, Attached several drawings of the real thing ex Saxby & Farmer and hopefully of interest and of use to some fellow modeller.

 To accommodate the skew. I will probably have to lengthen the gates. Photo' is a "14ft Square" crossing, ex Neville Stead.

GATE_DETAIL_.jpg

GATE ROAD.jpg

GATE_WICKET.jpg

STONEY LANE S B300DPI .jpg

  • Like 6
  • Thanks 1
  • Informative/Useful 2
Link to post
Share on other sites
  • 3 weeks later...

For  something different I have made a start on the over bridge this will span the railway to the left of the level crossing and over Nos11 and 18 points. I have presumed  it came about as part  of a early '30's Ring Road" scheme, and hence the presence of a bridge and level crossing in close proximity.  The plate girders are from the Wills range, the rest is Home brewed from plastic which is not my usual medium, I'm more used to metal. I hope to have a trolley bus route passing over the bridge which spans a nominal sixty feet with a twenty foot six ins roadway.

BRIDGE_Z2_.JPG

  • Like 6
Link to post
Share on other sites

Nice scheme Mick, well done.  I like the trolley bus notion as an addition, it'll add a nice touch of period flavour.

Btw, your H&BR signalling work is exemplary and stands as an essential modelling record of that side of the company's operations.

Over the years, very few have embarked on modelling this fascinating, but sadly neglected, company so your project is doubly valuable.  Hopefully, it will also stimulate a wider, and long overdue, interest in things H&B and even spur other modellers to tackle aspects of the company whether this being pre-1923, LNER or BR.  In particular, the fine station buildings built along the route between Hull and Cudworth are worthy subjects in their own right and deserve to be given modelling attention.  To my knowledge, none have been tackled as yet.

Anyway, nice one Mick - keep up the splendid work!

 

  • Like 3
Link to post
Share on other sites

Hi Mick,

nice to see you cracking on with the layout project and looking forward to watching it develope, nice to see the H&BR getting a look in in the modelling front.

The Wills girder parts are excellent and work well, into a bridge like this.

 

  • Agree 1
Link to post
Share on other sites

Create an account or sign in to comment

You need to be a member in order to leave a comment

Create an account

Sign up for a new account in our community. It's easy!

Register a new account

Sign in

Already have an account? Sign in here.

Sign In Now
×
×
  • Create New...

Important Information

We have placed cookies on your device to help make this website better. You can adjust your cookie settings, otherwise we'll assume you're okay to continue.