Military traffic on the Salisbury and Dorset Junction Railway

[Clive Mortimore]

7 minutes ago, Jack Benson said:

Hi Brian,

 

Supposition that Comets were still in service in 62 or 63 can be confirmed (or not) by ex-service personnel that have contributed but to quote Jane's The Comet remained in British service until 1958, when the remaining tanks were sold to foreign governments;  presumably all over* by 1960 so what was seen in 62-63?

The author specifically states "the track over hang (sic)" which does rule out wheeled AFV's

 

Unfortunately the author of the claim is somewhat overwrought and further information is limited.

 

Ironically, an outsize load did pass along the Salisbury and Dorset in 1950 enroute to Poole Power station but as can been seen in the contempoary press, click here, it certainly was not a routine journey.

 

*Lack of ready-use spares and ammo were the root causes of their demise.

 

Cherers and Stay Safe

 

 

Hi Jack

 

Out of gauge loads were carried on specially constructed wagons, as noted in the text to the link you provided they could be slewed off center to clear line side obstacles, sometimes there would be a civil engineers gang who would remove track side  obstacles as the train approached and another gang following putting them back up.

[Guest Jack Benson]

Clive,

 

The difference is that the load in the link was essentially a one-off requiring trackside personnel at all critical points rather than the irregular Sunday traffic as alluded to in the OP which describes multiple wagon load on a number of occasions.

 

The only mention of trackside personnel by the author was his grandfather passing the token at Verwood.  
 

Cheers and Stay Safe

[daveyb]

I'm not sure anything would stop an out of gauge move as long as it didn't physically strike anything lineside; As long as it could be fitted into a timetable, which couldn't happen now without significant disruption; and someone was willing to pay!

[Barry O]

If you put a FV430 Series vehicle with added side bins on a Warflat it does bash into things..I watched a 66 hauled special go through Tilehurst .. bang in the middle was a FV432 with a big aluminium smear where it had been out of gauge..

 

Baz

[Guest Jack Benson]

Hi, whilst searching the Marchwood archive, this image of a Ruston with a train of F430s was found. The tracks appear to be in gauge limits. Btw there were a pair of similar Rustons at Bramley during the decommissioning, one was Army 422. 
 

These vehicles might have traversed the Avon valley line but only if they were in widespread service in ‘62-63.

 

 

 

 

 

[Fat Controller]

2 hours ago, Jack Benson said:

Hi, whilst searching the Marchwood archive, this image of a Ruston with a train of F430s was found. The tracks appear to be in gauge limits. Btw there were a pair of similar Rustons at Bramley during the decommissioning, one was Army 422. 
 

These vehicles might have traversed the Avon valley line but only if they were in widespread service in ‘62-63.

 

 

 

 

 

This family of vehicles was introduced from 1962 onwards, I believe. I'm not sure if the army had used other tracked APCs before this. 

[daveyb]

Those are early Mk1 FV430s with the petrol engine (a Rolls Royce B60, I think) in the picture.  They went quickly (but I don't know how quickly) into fairly widespread use until they were turned into Mk3s with the diesel conversion.  Some Mk 1s were never converted and retired from service with the petrol engines (many on the ranges in Alberta where I served last - a long time after the Mk 1s retired) 

 

Amazingly, some of them are still in service having been re-engineered in the mid 00s to a spec known as BULLDOG.  New diesel, new gearbox, new brakes, new comms,  add-on air-con, same steel box, same suspension, same armour and same armament mostly same interior and equipment. They were also fitted with new appliqué armour for use in Iraq but with the heat and all the extra weight, they really struggled with lack of power.  Comfy... by armoured standards!

[Ian J.]

I believe, though could be wrong, that the passing loop at Breamore was extended for military traffic purposes during World War II. If so, then yes military traffic did use the line. However, not necessarily in the time period the thread seems to be focussed on.

[Guest Jack Benson]

2 hours ago, Ian J. said:

I believe, though could be wrong, that the passing loop at Breamore was extended for military traffic purposes during World War II. If so, then yes military traffic did use the line. However, not necessarily in the time period the thread seems to be focussed on.

 

Ian,

The line was upgraded to allow a passing block to relieve the pressure on Fordingbridge, the signal cabin at Breamore was demolished and the ground frame moved to the station building. However the passing loop and signal cabin were not re-instated at Downton, it remained a storage siding, moreover Daggons Road was never a block.

 

The only verified military traffic seems to have been casualty evacuation traffic from mid '44 onwards (normally LNER vehicles) but the temporary storage siding at Drovers Road and the MoS buffer store at Burford must have been serviced - just no records exist. 

 

As you correct stated, the OP was focussed on military traffic in the early 60s, it was simply an effort to establish the veracity of a 'claim' that Centurion tanks once traversed the line. Rather than dismiss the claim as fantasy, an attempt to establish if other rail-borne AFVs might have used the line is on-going.

 

Cheers and Stay Safe

 

[exet1095]

9 hours ago, daveyb said:

Those are early Mk1 FV430s with the petrol engine (a Rolls Royce B60, I think) in the picture. 

The Rolls B60 was four litres and powered the Ferret. A B80 in Saracen, Saladin and Stalwart (the most fun I have ever had driving a wheeled vehicle!)

 

FV430s started off with a Rolls Eagle I believe, which was originally multi-fuel, but were later differentiated into petrol or diesel vehicles, with red or yellow fuel fillers. The Bulldog is still in service, and the FV436 is the main Brigade HQ command vehicle.

[daveyb]

We're getting off topic again... The Rolls Royce (later Perkins) Eagle was definitely a diesel and didn't enter the market until the late 60s. It was used in the the various Foden trucks of the 70s (8x4 low mob, FH 70 6x6 tractor and limber and lastly the wrecker) and the upgraded 350 was the in The DROPS trucks. 

 

The B60 was a mis-type, I meant B80, but I'm not sure on that now. B80 was is in the Antar and later pushed into the B81 in the Stalwart and Mighty Antar. All before my time unfortunately.

[exet1095]

You’re right, it wasn’t the Eagle. It was the RR K60 - a two stroke opposed piston engine, like the L60 in the Chieftain, except that it ran rather better. Both super and turbo-charged. Multi-fuel if you used low enough octane petrol as it was compression ignition. Just had chapter and verse from one of my old VM friends.