More model ideas

[atom3624]

That's more hideous than the modern Class 70!!

 

Looks like a Cyberman on rails!

 

Al.

[newbryford]

2 hours ago, ndg910 said:

Let’s not forget they are dipping their toes into the pool that is GWR models with the Manor and my hope is for more GW or Southern models. 

 

But once they've done a GWR 4-6-0 then there's no need to do another as they all look the same.

 

Once A/S do a pannier tank, then they can move on from the GW as their work is complete..................

[Covkid]

14 hours ago, Wickham Green too said:

Has anyone mentioned the class 70 yet ? .................... no, not the hideous modern imposter but the original Southern 'booster' locos. 

 

12 hours ago, Colin_McLeod said:

 

Or the best of all 70 class, the UTA (later NIR)  DEMU.

 

12 hours ago, atom3624 said:

That's more hideous than the modern Class 70!!

 

Looks like a Cyberman on rails!

 

Al.

Beauty is in the eye of the beholder "Atom" !!! Wish I wrote down the number of the one I rode on from Larne Harbour to Larne Town back in the early 1980s. 

 

We are talking about Irish prototypes though - which is where Accurascale / IRM are from.  I have no doubt that in the fullness of time an NIR class 70 will come to the market, with the big diamond on the nose and the single windscreen. Am I right in thinking some of these had LMS design coaches in ?  Is there any crossover with designs for ex LMS / BR coaches for the mainland - obviously on different gauge bogies ? 

 

EDIT

This was the kind of train I remember

https://thetransportlibrary.co.uk/index.php?route=product/product&product_id=54529&category_id=410&page=1

Edited September 3, 2021 by Covkid
Adding

[Wickham Green too]

I'm not sure any N.C.C. coaches were incorporated in the 70 class - but if there were they'd have had their panelled bodies plated and would have looked rather different.

[mdvle]

15 hours ago, atom3624 said:

I have mentioned the ubiquitous and popular 14xx on several occasions ... 

Not been 'updated' be routine proprietary manufacturers for some time.

 

I suspect the Hattons 14xx model - which they only finally sold off not all that long ago after years of selling - means that there isn't all that much demand at the moment so a new model is unlikely for another several years (yes, many had issues with the mechanisms, but most of the market isn't online so would have been unaware of the issue so that didn't prevent many sales).

 

 

[wombatofludham]

3 hours ago, Wickham Green too said:

I'm not sure any N.C.C. coaches were incorporated in the 70 class - but if there were they'd have had their panelled bodies plated and would have looked rather different.

Apparently the "70" class trailers used ex NCC underframes from the 1920s, with new bodies to broadly an LMS Period 3 profile.  Earlier MPD and MED units had used ex NCC and ex LMS coaches (which had been sent to Northern Ireland post war to replace wartime losses) as part of their construction, which meant all the better, more modern coaches were already spoken for, hence the use of older coaches stripped of their bodies.

I like the Ulster 70 class although it does seem the class designator "70" is attached to rolling stock only it's designer could love.

[Wickham Green too]

3 hours ago, wombatofludham said:

...... the class designator "70" is attached to rolling stock only it's designer could love.

Though that doesn't, of course, apply to the charismatic Southern 'Boosters' as OVSB never had an inkling they'd be called 'class 70' ( briefly ) towards the end of their lives

[The Black Hat]

Given the Mk. 2 a and b stock I think that its now even more likely of the class 50th cometh.... 

[GordonC]

On 31/08/2021 at 15:50, TomScrut said:

 

Yes, although I wouldn't say that means there is no reason. Plenty of us will have 90s with no relevant one left to buy, but would snap their hands off at something from whatever era of interest. There is plenty of conjecture on the 90 thread that they maybe should have lost a BR livery and gone with EWS given the choice of liveries they picked ignores a big chunk of their years in service. I think the thing is at the moment is where manufacturers do a couple of liveries then they are limiting how many people will want more than one. I aren't sure how the MOQs work in this industry but I expect the main focal point would be around moldings and castings rather than paint jobs. Maybe they should have done twice as many liveries in the size run? I'd have had another had there been another relevant one. In fairness Bachmann may have started doing this, even doing HNRC 20s in multiple numbers, and the new 47 has quite a lot of options.

 

On a similar note it would be interesting to compare how long AS have 92s for, I expect the market will be a similar size but AS are doing a LOT more liveries but we do not know how the overall quantities compare. There is more than 1 92 livery on offer I'd be tempted by to go with the 92020 I already have on order.

 

I appreciate they do need to make a business decision about it, the point is more that if they aren't using it then somebody else might think it is worth a go. They'd then start churning them out again I expect!

 

Its going to depend an awful lot on who you ask as to whether Bachmann brought out the best selection of liveries or not. Personally I bought 3 (1 IC and 2 RfD) and I'd quite happily have more IC (swallow or mainline ones) if I could find them on sale. If the RfD one hadn't been brought out then they'd have lost 2 sales for me as I'm only interested in the BR era liveries. Whether EWS would have sold more we'll never know. I do think with the increased competition in the market that Bachmann could do with making more of the toolings they have quicker than they have in the past with normally 3 or 4 liveries in a batch with long gaps between batches. Something like Class 90s have had a large number of livery variations and while it might not be realistic to expect every single variation to be covered, there must surely be demand for more liveries to have been produced by now. Even if they split the batches into producing 50% of one number and 50% of another on exactly the same livery it could help sales at minimal cost to them

[TomScrut]

21 minutes ago, GordonC said:

Its going to depend an awful lot on who you ask as to whether Bachmann brought out the best selection of liveries or not.

 

Yes, it is more that if they had lost RFD or IC and done an EWS then they'd have covered the life of the locos with 3 models. They could have done that potentially by losing Freightliner and doing an appropriate EWS but I think FL were involved somewhere down the line (their loco measured or recorded I think).

 

24 minutes ago, GordonC said:

Even if they split the batches into producing 50% of one number and 50% of another on exactly the same livery it could help sales at minimal cost to them

 

Exactly. I'd have maybe had another FL one if there was another numbered one. I was tempted to buy one and renumber it myself but I couldn't be bothered in the end.

 

They have done this with the HN 20s so maybe they are doing this in the future? People will say HN 20s always travel about together and that's why they did it but how often do you see a FL 90 pulling a train by itself?

 

28 minutes ago, GordonC said:

demand for more liveries to have been produced by now

 

That's what I don't understand about it either. Likewise with the 158/159. Loads of liveries, been/are all over the place, lots of money spent on tooling....

[wombatofludham]

At the risk of perpetuating thread drift, I expect that Bachmann are playing a long game with their 158 and 90s, and will drip feed other popular colour schemes out rather than saturate the market at once.  I quite fancy a "mainline" liveried 90 to go with my ICS liveried one but can wait.

 

[GordonC]

1 hour ago, wombatofludham said:

At the risk of perpetuating thread drift, I expect that Bachmann are playing a long game with their 158 and 90s, and will drip feed other popular colour schemes out rather than saturate the market at once.  I quite fancy a "mainline" liveried 90 to go with my ICS liveried one but can wait.

 

 

I would guess that they are, it'll be unlikely any other company will pick off the 90 or 158 with a model of the Bachmann quality available, but then something like the Class 31 I would think would be ripe for re-tooling. With Hornby playing the long game with that too will be inviting competition where there are big gaps in what has been produced from it over the best part of 20 years.

[Legend]

23 minutes ago, GordonC said:

 

I would guess that they are, it'll be unlikely any other company will pick off the 90 or 158 with a model of the Bachmann quality available, but then something like the Class 31 I would think would be ripe for re-tooling. With Hornby playing the long game with that too will be inviting competition where there are big gaps in what has been produced from it over the best part of 20 years.

 

Its only smart to plan for the long game if you are sure youll survive to play it . I would have though Hornby would be in the maximise revenue when we can game . 

[Steven B]

Drip feeding models is OK as a manufacturer if you're confident no one else is likely to jump in and release an updated model. With the advances made by the likes of Accurascale and Revolution I'd have thought Bachmann would be wanting to extract as much profit from each set of tooling as possible. Bachmann UK are having to fight for factory space alongside all the other ranges in the Kader empire, something I'm guessing frustrates those in Bachmann UK HQ almost as it does us modellers.

 

 

Steven B.

Edited September 7, 2021 by Steven B

[TomScrut]

3 hours ago, wombatofludham said:

Bachmann are playing a long game with their 158 and 90s

 

1 hour ago, GordonC said:

there are big gaps in what has been produced from it over the best part of 20 years

 

I think the thing is that playing the long game probably works for models applicable to the BR eras, privatisation liveries seem to be more fashionable whilst they are current-ish IMO and therefore in that case I think striking whilst the iron is hot may be a good idea.

[mdvle]

12 hours ago, TomScrut said:

They have done this with the HN 20s so maybe they are doing this in the future? People will say HN 20s always travel about together and that's why they did it but how often do you see a FL 90 pulling a train by itself?

 

I think one of the issues is the number of people still refusing to go DCC, which makes (in addition to the lack of layout space) running 2 FL 90s troublesome for most.  So I don't think (yet) there is that much of a demand for people wanting multiple Class 90s to run together.

 

12 hours ago, TomScrut said:

That's what I don't understand about it either. Likewise with the 158/159. Loads of liveries, been/are all over the place, lots of money spent on tooling....

 

How many other 2nd generation DMUs are currently on the market from competing manufacturers?

 

Now how much competition is there in the locomotive market...

 

Get someone else (I like Realtrack, but their pace of output is such that they aren't really competing) offering 2nd generation multiple units (or perhaps even 1st generation/privatization era) and Bachmann may need to treat their 158/159 and other DMU models with a bit more urgency.

[Markwj]

This has probably been mentioned but I wonder if accurascale have considered something to shunt their awesome wagon range like a new 08. While the Hornby and Bachmann ones are nice they have been around for some time so a new one with lights etc would be really cool!

[TomScrut]

9 hours ago, mdvle said:

I think one of the issues is the number of people still refusing to go DCC, which makes (in addition to the lack of layout space) running 2 FL 90s troublesome for most.  So I don't think (yet) there is that much of a demand for people wanting multiple Class 90s to run together.

 

Yes I suppose despite the fact a 90 is not much longer than a 20, in pairs the difference is greater and prototypically they pull much longer trains (as the 5x more power would suggest).

 

10 hours ago, mdvle said:

How many other 2nd generation DMUs are currently on the market from competing manufacturers?

 

Good point, as you say there is Realtrack and then their own 150 really. I don't know what the best practice is though, capitalise on lack of competition or wait for it to come along? I have a 150, have an RT 156 on pre order, might get an RT 142, but would love a Northern 158.

 

Would also love a Northern 170 or 195 (back towards the topic of the conversation in general)!

[Monkersson]

10 hours ago, Markwj said:

This has probably been mentioned but I wonder if accurascale have considered something to shunt their awesome wagon range like a new 08. While the Hornby and Bachmann ones are nice they have been around for some time so a new one with lights etc would be really cool!

I don't understand the fascination with lights on models that can hardly be seen on the prototypes

[TomScrut]

1 hour ago, Monkersson said:

I don't understand the fascination with lights on models that can hardly be seen on the prototypes

 

If the lights can hardly be seen, fair dos, but in the case of most modern stuff bad lighting stands out more than missing tiny details.

[Mark Hamlin]

What about some Banana vans? The SR ones look particularly nice. Would also love a BR cattle van so I can stop butchering the old Aifix kits

[Markwj]

1 hour ago, Monkersson said:

I don't understand the fascination with lights on models that can hardly be seen on the prototypes

Having seen a few with lights added and also having the Dapol O gauge I think it really adds something to the 08.

[Monkersson]

29 minutes ago, TomScrut said:

 

If the lights can hardly be seen, fair dos, but in the case of most modern stuff bad lighting stands out more than missing tiny details.

They do on modern stock, and stock refitted with LED lighting, but on older stock you could hardly see the lighting, even in the dead of night.

 

On the majority of diesels you couldn't light both tail lamps at the same time - up until the 90's I think?  Earlier on some specific loco's (47/7 in push-pull service)

 

If folk really want lighting on existing good models, spend £20 on a lighting kit and support a cottage industry, rather than waiting years for a new loco, with lights. that will cost a lot more that the current versions, and may not turn out as good!

 

Ive disabled the lighting altogether on any of my stock that has it.  My layout is set in the early 90's with more stock with original lighting than WIPAC, just my personal preference.

Edited September 8, 2021 by Monkersson

[TomScrut]

4 minutes ago, Monkersson said:

They do on modern stock, and stock refitted with LED lighting, but on older stock you could hardly see the lighting, even in the dead of night.

 

On the majority of diesels you couldn't light both tail lamps at the same time - up until the 90's I think?  Earlier on some specific loco's (47/7 in push-pull service)

 

If folk really want lighting on existing good models, spend £20 on a lighting kit and support a cottage industry, rather than waiting years for a new loco, with lights. that will cost a lot more that the current versions, and may not turn out as good!

 

Exactly, that's what I meant by modern stuff, not the (incorrect IMO) definition of pretty much anything post steam.

 

The interesting one in terms of the lighting kits are that the Bachmann 66 for example could be improved so easily by them yet we have to rely on (excellent and reasonably priced) kits by such as Illuminated models to make them look right.

[Monkersson]

8 minutes ago, TomScrut said:

 

Exactly, that's what I meant by modern stuff, not the (incorrect IMO) definition of pretty much anything post steam.

 

The interesting one in terms of the lighting kits are that the Bachmann 66 for example could be improved so easily by them yet we have to rely on (excellent and reasonably priced) kits by such as Illuminated models to make them look right.

I fully agree, but if Bachmann were to retool to include prototypical lighting on their 66, it would come in a lot more expensive than an existing  model plus an aftermarket kit.  Buying these extra bits and pieces keep these small traders going, and they are a massive part of the hobby.  

 

Of course the other side of the coin is that too many people just don't want to do any modelling at all, to me, that is their loss.

 

Dont get me started on those wanting lighting on steam loco's!!!!

Edited September 8, 2021 by Monkersson