Bachmann 45xx GWR to early BR livery.

[stephenl]

I have a Bachmann 45xx which I am planning to alter to BR from GWR . This will be my first attempt at changing the identity all I am planning to do is remove GWR from the side tanks and replace with the early BR totem and change the loco numbers.

I have looked through several books and cannot see any pictures of the 45xx in plain green livery only black.

So my question is did the 45xx ever run in plain green with the early emblem ?

Thanks in advance for any replies.

[mpeffers]

Looking through here, it seems 4569 is a potential candidate. Not sure on the source though - had a quick look for discernible images and it was definitely lined out/late crest by the end. 

[Miss Prism]

8 minutes ago, mpeffers said:

Not sure on the source though 

 

Steam Colour Portfolio western vol 1, Keith Pirt  (apparently)

 

[stephenl]

2 hours ago, mpeffers said:

Looking through here, it seems 4569 is a potential candidate. Not sure on the source though - had a quick look for discernible images and it was definitely lined out/late crest by the end. 

Thank you that is a great help.

[stephenl]

1 hour ago, Miss Prism said:

 

Steam Colour Portfolio western vol 1, Keith Pirt  (apparently)

 

Thank you I will check that out.

[Mark]

13 hours ago, mpeffers said:

Looking through here, it seems 4569 is a potential candidate. Not sure on the source though - had a quick look for discernible images and it was definitely lined out/late crest by the end. 

Be careful. The Bachmann 45xx represents the last of the flat tank versions from 4555 onwards. The earlier ones had shorter bunkers which were extended with a characteristic thicker rear buffer beam.

 

Regards

 

Mark Humphrys

[The Johnster]

From 1/1/48 to 31/5/48, locos coming out of paint shops were painted in GW unlined green livery but with BR type smokebox door number plates replacing the painted buffer beam numbers and lettered 'BRITISH RAILWAYS' in GW style Egyptian Serif script, similar to the 1924-34 livery.  From 31/5/48 to 31/3/49 (I think, spring 49 anyway) a plain black livery was used with 'BRITISH RAILWAYS' in Gill Sans script and red backpainting to the number plates.  This was replaced by the unicycling lion emblem and some locomotives received lined black mixed traffic livery, and all continued to be given red backpainted number plates.  These were replaced by black backpaints from the early 50s, not sure of exact date.  

 

This was the status quo until 1956, and means that if you want your BR 45xx to carry plain green livery and a unicycling lion during the period 1948-56, you can't.  In 1956, regions were given greater autonomy in regard to liveries, and the WR began to paint more of it's locos in lined green full passenger, which some had never previously carried and of which some were mixed traffic types that should have been painted in the lined black livery.  In 1958, the second BR crest, the 'lion and dartboard', came into use, but the region still seemed to object to the lined black livery.  Following the 1956 change, some locos were painted in 'economy' green, unlined and with the unicycling lion.  So you are looking for a 45xx painted in economy green livery between 1956 and 58.  Many 45xx painted in this period had the fully lined out express passenger green livery, which was also applied to 4575s including auto fitted locos.  

 

Hope this helps and clarifies!

[stephenl]

On 20/06/2020 at 06:42, Mark said:

Be careful. The Bachmann 45xx represents the last of the flat tank versions from 4555 onwards. The earlier ones had shorter bunkers which were extended with a characteristic thicker rear buffer beam.

 

Regards

 

Mark Humphrys

Thank you Mark.

[stephenl]

On 20/06/2020 at 16:16, The Johnster said:

From 1/1/48 to 31/5/48, locos coming out of paint shops were painted in GW unlined green livery but with BR type smokebox door number plates replacing the painted buffer beam numbers and lettered 'BRITISH RAILWAYS' in GW style Egyptian Serif script, similar to the 1924-34 livery.  From 31/5/48 to 31/3/49 (I think, spring 49 anyway) a plain black livery was used with 'BRITISH RAILWAYS' in Gill Sans script and red backpainting to the number plates.  This was replaced by the unicycling lion emblem and some locomotives received lined black mixed traffic livery, and all continued to be given red backpainted number plates.  These were replaced by black backpaints from the early 50s, not sure of exact date.  

 

This was the status quo until 1956, and means that if you want your BR 45xx to carry plain green livery and a unicycling lion during the period 1948-56, you can't.  In 1956, regions were given greater autonomy in regard to liveries, and the WR began to paint more of it's locos in lined green full passenger, which some had never previously carried and of which some were mixed traffic types that should have been painted in the lined black livery.  In 1958, the second BR crest, the 'lion and dartboard', came into use, but the region still seemed to object to the lined black livery.  Following the 1956 change, some locos were painted in 'economy' green, unlined and with the unicycling lion.  So you are looking for a 45xx painted in economy green livery between 1956 and 58.  Many 45xx painted in this period had the fully lined out express passenger green livery, which was also applied to 4575s including auto fitted locos.  

 

Hope this helps and clarifies!

Many thanks for a very in depth reply to my post. I shall have a re-think of my original idea.

[Hal Nail]

On 19/06/2020 at 14:46, stephenl said:

So my question is did the 45xx ever run in plain green with the early emblem ?

 

The Pirt photo of 4569 in plain green, early crest is July 57 at Bodmin Road - it was a St Blazey loco at that time. 

 

It was fairly standard for that era but retained its tall safety valve cover (unpainted) and it had the larger size logo.

 

 

Edited June 28, 2020 by Hal Nail