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Was this engine based on a real locomotive.


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It’s based off of the Sole SECR S class No.685, it was a saddle tank rebuild of one of the Wainright C classes hence it’s ungainly height. It worked at Richburough port then Bricklayers Arms until 1951. The Triang model is way oversize for an already pretty big engine as it was originally clockwork and the large tank was to fit the spring, same went for the diesel shunter lookalike. My guess is a designer must have seen it at Bricklayers Arms and figured it a good fit to the clockwork 0-6-0 mechanism.  

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I 'ad one, a very good slow runner until I swapped it's chassis into my Jinty, which for some reason then became the better runner of the two...  For many years I thought it might be an attempt to represent a Newport (Alexander Dock) Rly saddle tank, from the 3 digit number.  It was out of loading gauge and wouldn't go under my Airfix kit footbridge on 'standard' Triang track.  There's an element of Andrew Barclay about the tank shape and and the spectacle plate windows.

 

It's an odd little creature, with several omissions if it's to represent an S, I mean the S.  Splasher, no boxy thing at the cab end of the running plate, no plumbing between middle and leading splashers because of the single splasher, no sandboxes, wrong handrail around the smokebox front, cab roof nothing like prototype.  But the little steps each side of the smokebox saddle are there!

 

Good luck with the restoration; you'll fly through it after the 3MT!  I'd consider adding sandboxes to hide the side view of the coupling rivets, and maybe a reversing rod!  It'd be some work to make into a more accurate S, and can't be done with the Triang chassis because of the height issue, but resurrecting old trains is fun, as I've just found out with my Dock Authority diesel.

 

 

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For some obscure reason I always wanted one of these as a lad.  It must have prompted/sparked some sort of latent interest in small saddle tanks (although the model itself is quite large and not scale, a point not really appreciated by a 9 year old!).  There was a clockwork one for sale at Barnsley show a few years ago for a good (ie low!) price but I resisted the temptation.  Converting it to P4 possibly isn't an easy project :unsure:

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It was appreciated by 9 year old Johnster, especially the out of loading gauge aspect.  It is what it is; converting one to P4 is wrong on multiple levels, but is easy, surely.  You have to replace the wheels anyway and all it requires is spacers between the wheel hub backs and the chassis block...

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It was Tri-ang's solution to replacing the ex Trackmaster clockwork N2 (can't have anything with a zinc alloy body...). Why it had to be hugely out of scale when the N2 wasn't is lost in Margate's archives! The choice was between this and their dreadful diesel shunter* - no contest! I would have thought she was not worth converting to P4. The errors in the model are considerably worse than a couple of millimetres in the track gauge. Why they numbered her 748 I have never been able to fathom.

 

One is on the Grifone 'to do' list. I don't think I have enough years left (especially considering it seems to get longer and longer...). It would help if SWMBO and daughter didn't conspire together to find jobs to do and things to spend money on.

The Sardinian sun looks tempting, but there is a new gazebo to put together. The result of a female safari to Sassari on Saturday. I followed the instructions, which resulted in 3 unmanageable sections to bolt together. A rethink is required

 

* This remains my choice for Tri-ang's (everyone's?) worst ever model. It even beats their 'Princess'.

Edited by Il Grifone
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27 minutes ago, Il Grifone said:

It was Tri-ang's solution to replacing the ex Trackmaster clockwork N2 (can't have anything with a zinc alloy body...) Why it had to be hugely out of scale when the N2 wasn't is lost in Margate's archives! The choice was between this and their dreadful diesel shunter* - no contest! I would have thought she was not worth converting to P4. The errors in the model are considerably worse than a couple of millimetres in the track gauge. Why they numbered her 748 I have never been able to fathom.

 

One is on the Grifone 'to do' list. I don't think I have enough years left (especially considering it seems to get longer and longer...). It would help if SWMBO and daughter didn't conspire together to find jobs to do and things to spend money on.

The Sardinian sun looks tempting, but there is a new gazebo to put together. The result of a female safari to Sassari on Saturday. I followed the instructions, which resulted in 3 unmanageable sections to bolt together. A rethink is required

 

* This remains my choice for Tri-ang's (everyone's?) worst ever model. It even beats their 'Princess'.

The diesel shunter appears to have been re-tooled around 1980 but I'm not sure why they bothered as it seems to be almost as bad as the original. Not quite so high I suspect.

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The Triang shunter is the one thing I grew up with. 

 

Every now & again I'll see one on e-bay, and think; "shall I?"  About this time Triang used to sell an much older EMU, and If I find one, I'll probably succumb....

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1 hour ago, giz said:

The diesel shunter appears to have been re-tooled around 1980 but I'm not sure why they bothered as it seems to be almost as bad as the original. Not quite so high I suspect.

 

Are you thinking of the same diesel shunter as me?

 

The 1977 (I think) Class 08 was an accurate model apart from the chassis. If you bunged the body on a Lima chassis then it was a very good model and better in some aspects than the Lima version.

 

http://www.hornbyguide.com/item_year_details.asp?itemyearid=11

 

 

 

Jason

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23 hours ago, Il Grifone said:

The EMU was/is quite nice, but the compartments are decidedly on the generous side.

As were the loco hauled suburbans that matched it.  I suspect this was to overcome the problem of structural weakness at the window pillars.  The green composite was sold as a centre car for the emu; 'to convert to 3-car', which I always found strange as the nearest things in my Combined were 2 or 4 car sets.  A friend chopped one into an ersatz 2-Bil, and given some of my teenage kitbashing abominations I had no right to criticise...  

 

The emu power bogie found it's way underneath the Blue Pullman power car, and matched the equally incorrect B1s well enough...

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Yes supposedly a composite, but all the compartments are the same width. It wouldn't have been a bad model of a Mk1 non-corridor apart from this (ignoring the raised door lines). It has seven compartments IIRC whereas the real thing has nine (57 foot 2nd class version). (The Southern Region only had 64' 6" coaches (the 2nds had ten compartments), but we'll ignore this pedantic point).

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On 20/06/2020 at 23:31, Player of trains said:

It’s based off of the Sole SECR S class No.685, it was a saddle tank rebuild of one of the Wainright C classes hence it’s ungainly height. It worked at Richburough port then Bricklayers Arms until 1951. The Triang model is way oversize for an already pretty big engine as it was originally clockwork and the large tank was to fit the spring, same went for the diesel shunter lookalike. My guess is a designer must have seen it at Bricklayers Arms and figured it a good fit to the clockwork 0-6-0 mechanism.  

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It wasn't the only unusual thing to turn up at the Bricklayers Arms depot - 

 

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On 23/06/2020 at 18:03, The Johnster said:

As were the loco hauled suburbans that matched it.  I suspect this was to overcome the problem of structural weakness at the window pillars.  The green composite was sold as a centre car for the emu; 'to convert to 3-car', which I always found strange as the nearest things in my Combined were 2 or 4 car sets.  A friend chopped one into an ersatz 2-Bil, and given some of my teenage kitbashing abominations I had no right to criticise...  

 

The emu power bogie found it's way underneath the Blue Pullman power car, and matched the equally incorrect B1s well enough...

 

I assume this is on the same principle as the small O27 carriages made by Lionel in the Post-War period; to give a train incorporating most of the features of a prototype, suitable for use within the track geometry of a table-top sized layout about 6’ x 3’

 

presumably you could, if desired, add two to make a 4-car unit? 

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18 hours ago, The Johnster said:

As were the loco hauled suburbans that matched it.  I suspect this was to overcome the problem of structural weakness at the window pillars.  The green composite was sold as a centre car for the emu; 'to convert to 3-car', which I always found strange as the nearest things in my Combined were 2 or 4 car sets.  A friend chopped one into an ersatz 2-Bil, and given some of my teenage kitbashing abominations I had no right to criticise...  

 

The emu power bogie found it's way underneath the Blue Pullman power car, and matched the equally incorrect B1s well enough...

 

Because you were looking at the wrong region. Although they put an S on it I assume it was meant to be one of these. Maybe they felt they could sell more if they were Southern?

 

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https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/British_Rail_Class_501

 

 

 

Jason

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6 hours ago, Steamport Southport said:

 

Because you were looking at the wrong region. Although they put an S on it I assume it was meant to be one of these. Maybe they felt they could sell more if they were Southern?

 

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https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/British_Rail_Class_501

 

 

 

Jason

I think you’re confusing Triang and Hornby Dublo emus, Jason.  The 501s were LMR sets used on the Euston-Watford and Richmond-Broad St (North London) routes, and Hornby Dublo made a fair representation of them in their correct BR ‘electric green’ (not malachite) livery.  AFIAK but I’m happy to be corrected, the centre car was a renumbered version of their Southern Region suburban composite; like all HD passenger stock, it had printed tinplate sides.  The distinctive droplight bars were not modelled. 
 

The Triang emu had rounded ends clearly based on Maunsell period Southern Railway emus, such as the 2-SUB, 2-BIL/HAL, 5-BEL, 4-SUB,  etc.  In line with the 2-SUB theme, both the powered and dummy motor cars had guard’s compartments at the cab ends, but they followed the form and window spacing of Triang’s suburbans, which were not as far as I have ever been able to tell based on any prototype.  They had B1 bogies, but then, so did the GW clerestories, and the later Collett bowenders and Thompsons.  
 

The Southern did have emus to the mk1 profile, the later 2- and 4-EPB sets and 2-HAP sets, which looked superficially similar to the LMR sets, but never had the droplight bars.  The roof detail was different as well, the SR sets having pipe runs and guard’s periscopes.  
 

Similar looking mk1 profile emus operated on the LT&S services, but these were 25kv overhead versions. 

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2 minutes ago, jcredfer said:

Got a mention here, as a 0-6-0 saddle tank...   need to scroll down to the lists

 

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/GWR_1076_Class 

 

Julian

 

 

Eh? That page is about GWR outside frame Saddle Tanks.

 

Many of which were built as Broad Gauge and then rebuilt to Standard. Most were eventually rebuilt as Panniers.

 

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Better view here.

 

https://www.warwickshirerailways.com/gwr/gwrls2062.htm

 

 

Jason

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On ‎22‎/‎06‎/‎2020 at 18:14, Steamport Southport said:

 

Are you thinking of the same diesel shunter as me?

 

The 1977 (I think) Class 08 was an accurate model apart from the chassis. If you bunged the body on a Lima chassis then it was a very good model and better in some aspects than the Lima version.

 

http://www.hornbyguide.com/item_year_details.asp?itemyearid=11

 

 

 

Jason

 

I did this conversion about a year back just for funsies. The cab is a little large and you do have to do a bit of chopping on the body, but I was quite pleased with the end result.

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