Malcolm 0-6-0 Posted July 8, 2020 Share Posted July 8, 2020 1 hour ago, Edwardian said: I wonder sometimes if I'm the only railway modeller left who still uses a species of papier-mâché? It's the simplest thing in the world to do, and can fill the void at little weight and be readily formed to the desired shape. It's old tech but it works and I do wonder why people seem to want to make life complicated with other exotic ways of 'terraforming'. I use very dilute PVA, so it's mainly water, and newspaper, or pretty much any paper going spare. This seems infinitely easier than messy polystyrene cutting or frigging about with plaster. Some large bits of geography benefit from foundations - polystyrene, insulation material etc - and, for instance, the basic land formation of the test track is cardboard 'bricks' than came with some flat-pack furniture, but the shapes and contours are all papier-mâché and I'm struggling to see the advantage of, say, cardboard lattice work. Is this not an unnecessary faff? If there is one thing in modelling that sets my teeth on edge its that styrofoam/insulation material. Just handling it is like squeaky chalk on a blackboard to me. I can't even touch styrofoam cups. 1 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Florence Locomotive Works Posted July 8, 2020 Author Share Posted July 8, 2020 3 hours ago, Edwardian said: I wonder sometimes if I'm the only railway modeller left who still uses a species of papier-mâché? It's the simplest thing in the world to do, and can fill the void at little weight and be readily formed to the desired shape. It's old tech but it works and I do wonder why people seem to want to make life complicated with other exotic ways of 'terraforming'. I use very dilute PVA, so it's mainly water, and newspaper, or pretty much any paper going spare. This seems infinitely easier than messy polystyrene cutting or frigging about with plaster. Some large bits of geography benefit from foundations - polystyrene, insulation material etc - and, for instance, the basic land formation of the test track is cardboard 'bricks' than came with some flat-pack furniture, but the shapes and contours are all papier-mâché and I'm struggling to see the advantage of, say, cardboard lattice work. Is this not an unnecessary faff? With regards to the cardboard lattice work, it’s designed to be covered in bandage plaster, which is what I was told the plaster we have was. It obviously wasn’t. 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Florence Locomotive Works Posted July 8, 2020 Author Share Posted July 8, 2020 4 hours ago, Caley Jim said: Instead of PoP or filler I use thinned down DAS modelling clay, coloured with powder or acrylic paint. Much lighter and more resilient to knocks etc. You can also adjust it and blend a new piece in just by wetting the original. For formers, cut up pieces of polystyrene packaging are lighter and stronger than card. Jim That could be a solution, but I don’t really want to go and run everything up again and remake the embankment. But then again I might end up doing so. 2 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Edwardian Posted July 8, 2020 Share Posted July 8, 2020 11 minutes ago, Florence Locomotive Works said: With regards to the cardboard lattice work, it’s designed to be covered in bandage plaster, which is what I was told the plaster we have was. It obviously wasn’t. Yes, but why bother? Terra-forming: 1. Form shape of landscape with crumpled newspaper steeped in very dilute PVA. If a large or tall feature, I might build up the landscape first with anything from cardboard box card layers to polystyrene blocks. If the feature is, say, against a board edge, a card profile can be used to back it. I use mount board. 2. Overlay with criss-crossed strips of paper steeped in very dilute PVA 3. Allow to dry. To add a flexible strengthening skin and give a head-start on ground texture: 4. Paint with slightly dilute PVA and cover with sand 5. Allow to dry 6. Paint green with acrylics or poster paint (dries quickly). Dry brush with ochre or ochre/green mix. You are all ready for flock, static grass etc It's as easy as falling off a log. Apart from the PVA, it's all pretty much free material. Why people bother with plaster bandage or card weaving, I'll never know. Chicken wire covered by papier-mâché suffices if the hill needs to be hollow, otherwise I don't understand why anyone need bother with that either. As Norfolk is rather short on tunnels, I've not had to do that yet. Unless you've inherited a plaster-bandage company, I cannot honestly see the point of using the stuff.. Cheap and simple wins the day! 2 2 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Florence Locomotive Works Posted July 8, 2020 Author Share Posted July 8, 2020 1 minute ago, Edwardian said: Yes, but why bother? Terra-forming: 1. Form shape of landscape with crumpled newspaper steeped in very dilute PVA. If a large or tall feature, I might build up the landscape first with anything from cardboard box card layers to polystyrene blocks. If the feature is, say, against a board edge, a card profile can be used to back it. I use mount board. 2. Overlay with criss-crossed strips of paper steeped in very dilute PVA 3. Allow to dry. To add a flexible strengthening skin and give a head-start on ground texture: 4. Paint with slightly dilute PVA and cover with sand 5. Allow to dry 6. Paint green with acrylics or poster paint (dries quickly). Dry brush with ochre or ochre/green mix. You are all ready for flock, static grass etc It's as easy as falling off a log. Apart from the PVA, it's all pretty much free material. Why people bother with plaster bandage or card weaving, I'll never know. Chicken wire covered by papier-mâché suffices if the hill needs to be hollow, otherwise I don't understand why anyone need bother with that either. As Norfolk is rather short on tunnels, I've not had to do that yet. Unless you've inherited a plaster-bandage company, I cannot honestly see the point of using the stuff.. Cheap and simple wins the day! I shall look into this, it seems like the best way to proceed if I must rip up the current progress. But the tunnel structure will still be left off, as I need more room for the string instrument yard. Falling off a log can be quite hard, especially if one is rather high up in the air, and wishes not to descend at great speed. 1 2 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Caley Jim Posted July 8, 2020 Share Posted July 8, 2020 (edited) 3 hours ago, Edwardian said: I wonder sometimes if I'm the only railway modeller left who still uses a species of papier-mâché......... No your not, James. My techniques are very similar to yours. The basic shape from either polystyrene formers with card 'slats' or solid polystyrene blocks, the latter where I plan to 'plant' trees, covered with strips of newspaper, then a layer of papier-mâché followed by the final ground surface in watered down DAS. PVA being the glue of choice throughout. I make my papier-mâché from egg boxes put through the shredder, leave to soak for a few days, then mash it up with an old fork and add a little PVA. Jim Edited July 8, 2020 by Caley Jim Spelling correction 1 3 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jeff Smith Posted July 8, 2020 Share Posted July 8, 2020 This is what I use:- https://www.amazon.com/ACTIVA-CelluClay-Instant-Papier-Mache/dp/B001144SDE/ref=sr_1_7?crid=2VN8LYCAGW6ZS&dchild=1&keywords=papier-mâché&qid=1594220107&sprefix=Papie%2Caps%2C223&sr=8-7 It is very light so doesn't need a strong under-structure. It sets really hard but can be drilled for fence posts and trees. A one pound bag goes a long way! 1 2 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jeff Smith Posted July 8, 2020 Share Posted July 8, 2020 This might interest you, it being a similar concept. It started life as a P4 exhibition display to demonstrate some 'through the landscape' scenic work. Now is the exit board of my modest BLT. 4 5 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Florence Locomotive Works Posted July 8, 2020 Author Share Posted July 8, 2020 Paper machèing has begun, I will post some pictures soon. The main structure will be a piece of wood though. 3 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Florence Locomotive Works Posted July 8, 2020 Author Share Posted July 8, 2020 (edited) I am now in the debt of Mr. @Edwardian, as the paper mâchè method has worked “a treat”, as I believe they say on yonder green isles ‘cross the sea. The main structure is piece of wood, to give the paper some backing. This then has balls of paper along it creating a slope, which has been covered in a smooth layer of paper. Right now it does look a bit arctic, but after it’s been blasted with the Oklahoma sun outside and painted it should improve. Edited July 8, 2020 by Florence Locomotive Works 10 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Florence Locomotive Works Posted July 8, 2020 Author Share Posted July 8, 2020 Grass has been grassed on one side of the tunnel approach, and half of the signal has also been installed. I’m working on a possible 3d printed tender for Mammoth, but I’ll have to wait till Friday when the engine gets here to check the dimensions. The main problem with this will be the axle box/suspension assembly, which is very hard to design using TinkerCAD, the software I’m using. Really I should upgrade to Fusion 360 or something like that. Apologies for the rubbish photography. 8 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold Regularity Posted July 8, 2020 RMweb Gold Share Posted July 8, 2020 https://www.rmweb.co.uk/community/index.php?/topic/47984-morfa-hwyl-fawr/&do=findComment&comment=1754006 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Florence Locomotive Works Posted July 9, 2020 Author Share Posted July 9, 2020 A bit more detail has attached itself to the Bristol & Exeter wagon. Unfortunately the wheels in this will have to be taken out and put in the tender, so I’m off to try and make some 3d printable ones. 5 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold Mikkel Posted July 9, 2020 RMweb Gold Share Posted July 9, 2020 (edited) 12 hours ago, Florence Locomotive Works said: after it’s been blasted with the Oklahoma sun Brunel in Oklahoma. Love it. I know nothing about such things, but would the Foster portable engine possibly have been too heavy for a wagon like that? Or is it a very light steam engine, hence the name? Edited July 9, 2020 by Mikkel 3 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Florence Locomotive Works Posted July 9, 2020 Author Share Posted July 9, 2020 (edited) 8 hours ago, Mikkel said: Brunel in Oklahoma. Love it. I know nothing about such things, but would the Foster portable engine possibly have been too heavy for a wagon like that? Or is it a very light steam engine, hence the name? I don’t think it will be permanent, I was mainly using it as weight, (because every time I breathed the wagon would go sailing across my desk) but I’ll look into it. It would probably be more at home in a gwr steel six wheeler. Edited July 9, 2020 by Florence Locomotive Works 2 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Canadian broad gauge Posted July 9, 2020 Share Posted July 9, 2020 Hi yes interested in canadian broad gauge so any resources v welcome advance info next spark shots model will be the 4-4-0 Waverley class 5 2 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Florence Locomotive Works Posted July 9, 2020 Author Share Posted July 9, 2020 (edited) 36 minutes ago, Canadian broad gauge said: Hi yes interested in canadian broad gauge so any resources v welcome advance info next spark shots model will be the 4-4-0 Waverley class Sparkshot has a chassis and body kit available for a GWR Victoria 2-4-0 which you could turn into the engine that is pictured below. Edited July 9, 2020 by Florence Locomotive Works 4 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Florence Locomotive Works Posted July 9, 2020 Author Share Posted July 9, 2020 More grass ladies and gents. Huzzah. 11 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Florence Locomotive Works Posted July 10, 2020 Author Share Posted July 10, 2020 (edited) GWR tilt wagon taking shape, and the engine should be arriving tomorrow. Edited July 10, 2020 by Florence Locomotive Works 9 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Edwardian Posted July 10, 2020 Share Posted July 10, 2020 9 hours ago, Florence Locomotive Works said: More grass ladies and gents. Huzzah. Great embankment. Fast drying times in Oklahoma! 2 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Florence Locomotive Works Posted July 10, 2020 Author Share Posted July 10, 2020 Mail didn’t come at all today, so no engine. Oh well. 4 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Florence Locomotive Works Posted July 11, 2020 Author Share Posted July 11, 2020 Bit more paint added on both wagons. Sadly I had to remove the cross bracing on the B&E wagon as it wasn’t accurate, so that’s why one will observe the flakes of wood and superglue. This will be repainted very soon though. 6 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Canadian broad gauge Posted July 11, 2020 Share Posted July 11, 2020 I have one of the Victoria class and until you mentioned it it did not occur to me to think about adapting it to gwr Canada but with some proprietary parts from detail associates and the other suppliers it could be done. The chimney and the whistle as well as the cab would be the main items and should be available and adaptable might even ask Gavin at scc if he could do a cab 1 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Canadian broad gauge Posted July 11, 2020 Share Posted July 11, 2020 Broad gauge on a budget I have lots of old broad gauge vans I don’t use and could send you five a a couple of the BGS carriage s I bought second hand don’t know what the postage cost would but could find out 1 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Florence Locomotive Works Posted July 12, 2020 Author Share Posted July 12, 2020 7 hours ago, Canadian broad gauge said: Broad gauge on a budget I have lots of old broad gauge vans I don’t use and could send you five a a couple of the BGS carriage s I bought second hand don’t know what the postage cost would but could find out Thank you very much for your kind offer, Well I’ll pay for shipping, and I can pay you by PayPal for the wagons, as I have no need for the carriages. thanks again, Douglas 2 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
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