The Night Mail

[Northmoor]

37 minutes ago, simontaylor484 said:

I think all schoolchildren should be taken to a military cemetery. I have visited some in US ones in East Anglia and Commonwealth ones at Osterbeek. Although they are a sad place obviously with the death they represent the way they are laid out is simply stunning the way the graves line up on various axis. I also visited a German cemetery in Holland that was laid out in a similar way but with black headstones granite if i recall but it was when i was 16

My father takes this idea further and believes the UK government should relocate to somewhere nearer the geographic centre of Britain.  This is conveniently close to the National Memorial Arboretum, so any bombastic politicians keen to send other people's children into warzones, can be invited to spend an hour walking round the NMA, counting the number of people sacrificed by the decisions of politicians and see if they're still quite so keen afterwards.

 

My grandfather served in Tunisia in 1943, was injured and captured when the transport aircraft he was in was shot down, spending about a month in a German Military hospital until it was liberated.  He talked about it very little until the 1980s when he wrote down his experiences in the form of a hand-written book which he later typed up.  I have the original written manuscript and am considering publishing these memoirs if all the family agree; it's a wonderful description of an typical, ordinary soldier doing pretty extraordinary things.  He wrote very positively about the German soldiers he met in the hospital, being professional, courteous and often quite friendly towards him.  He often wrote much less positively about his own senior officers.....

[petethemole]

My stepson's history trip was to the Ypres battlefields, concluding with the Last Post ceremony at the Menin Gate.  It had a profound effect on him. 

[PhilJ W]

I visited Ypres and watched the ceremony at the Menin Gate several years ago. Tyn Cot really blows you away with its size and the number of graves. What struck me was that a large number of headstones were marked unknown. Its something that should be on everyones bucket list is a visit to such sites. 

[jamie92208]

My father's 1st cousin was killed near Arras in 1917 on 23rd April which happens to be my eldest's birthday. I have visited the cemetery 3 times and the last was on the centenary of his death. That was a very moving experience. 

I was able to lay a rather makeshift wreath there that lovely spring morning.

I'd done a bit of research so had made this up.

As he was a junior officer details of the action are recorded in the regimental war diary and Dave and I were able to walk along and find the field where the action had taken place.

We met several local people out for walks that Sunday morning and without exception they were courteous and polite and expressed gratitude for the sacrifices that had been made on behalf of their country.  We had time to spare that day before the Menin gate ceremony and visited many tiny cemeteries which we both found  far more poignant and moving than the large ones. Dave had lost a great uncle in the Paschendale battle and we visited that cemetery the next day.  The cemeteries are always immaculate and well kept. One, not far from Geoffrey's grave was on unstable ground so had a hedge round it rather than a wall. 

 

My father had vague memories of his cousin. My dad was 4 when Geoffrey was killed and the effect that it had on his uncle and aunt laid the foundation for lifelong pacifist beliefs that I respect but don't fully share.

 

Jamie

 

1

 

[Happy Hippo]

It doesn't matter how hot and calm it is at outside the Menin Gate, a wind always blows through it.

 

When you are on parade and have marched out of a perfectly calm afternoon and are then stood to attention in the middle of the road at the centre of the gate, the breeze be quite unnerving.

 

However it's not a supernatural phenomena.

 

It is a huge structure which creates a temperature difference where the hot air outside  is cooled in the shadow and as it sinks and cools further more air is cooled.  It slips under the hotter air and creates a thermal wind.  The design of the gate, whether deliberate or not,  then draws the air through it from the end where the sun is shining from.

 

It is not as noticeable when it is cold and overcast. 

[Winslow Boy]

I may be wrong but I think the chap who designed the cemeteries and their associated memorials was called Lutyens. He was a very well known architect, designing much of the government buildings in New Delhi. He also worked in partnership with Gertrude Jekyll, the noted garden designer who helped select the planting used in the cemeteries. There was considerable thought put into the design of the cemeteries the ethos being that they being somewhere for people to remember and to be quiet and peaceful.

[PhilJ W]

When I watched the ceremony at the Menin Gate it was on the 11th of November and it was freezing. Luckily I was given a recommendation for a restaurant which served a nice hot meal and the best coffee I have ever tasted. FYI it was called Sante. From the Menin Gate walk past the Cloth Hall and its about 100 metres up the road in front of you on the left. Ask for the Flemish stew, delicious. 

[polybear]

3 hours ago, Compound2632 said:

 

It is (or perhaps one should say, was) the standard GCSE History trip. Apart from the impact of Covid, I suspect that Brexit will have made organising such trips more complicated and expensive - no EHIC - and of course not all pupils elect to do history.

 

Bear recalls mention on the TV fairly recently that many schoolchildren didn't even know who Britain were at war with during WW2....

 

One of the TV prorammes (not sure if it was an antiques programme or maybe something to do with memorabilia) was in France during one episode - they stopped in a country lane, next to a field - there was a pile of live ordnance on the grass verge, waiting for collection; the farmers are trawling it up all the time when they plough the fields etc., so they put it out for collection and safe disposal - live shells, chemical warfare shells, the lot.

[PhilJ W]

Even today some areas of the Western Front are no-go areas due to the vast amount of unexploded ordinance just inches below the surface and considered to dangerous to remove.

[jamie92208]

25 minutes ago, polybear said:

 

Bear recalls mention on the TV fairly recently that many schoolchildren didn't even know who Britain were at war with during WW2....

 

One of the TV prorammes (not sure if it was an antiques programme or maybe something to do with memorabilia) was in France during one episode - they stopped in a country lane, next to a field - there was a pile of live ordnance on the grass verge, waiting for collection; the farmers are trawling it up all the time when they plough the fields etc., so they put it out for collection and safe disposal - live shells, chemical warfare shells, the lot.

It's called the Iron harvest, I thi k it's over 100 tons per year and occasionally people get killed. It's a major problem as many are gas shells and they don't know how to dispose of them safely so there sre 1000's of tons in unsafe storage.

 

Jamie

[Florence Locomotive Works]

Well another steaming was just had.

 

This one went much better, the engine ran very well, and after a few warm up laps really got going under no load, and then it caught fire. 
 

 

Why I have absolutely no clue, but I would venture to say some oil came alight between the frames, as that’s what it looked like. However the paint was saved, after the fire was put out with my massive syringe, as the wet towel wasn’t to hand. 
 

So as I haven’t time for another steaming today, one will be had tomorrow. 
 

I did however manage some pictures of the ensign with my two BL Stanier coaches, which BL painted to look like MK 1s. It would have been tested with these had it not caught fire. 
 

 

 

 

Douglas

Edited April 24, 2021 by Florence Locomotive Works

[polybear]

15 minutes ago, jamie92208 said:

It's called the Iron harvest, I thi k it's over 100 tons per year and occasionally people get killed. It's a major problem as many are gas shells and they don't know how to dispose of them safely so there sre 1000's of tons in unsafe storage.

 

Jamie

 

ISTR that Porton Down does a little sideline in the disposal of such shells, unless I'm wrong - which has been known...

[Dave Hunt]

Chaired the Midland Railway Society AGM on Zoom today. Quite a good attendance with some notable absentees including a certain ex-gendarme now resident in France.

 

Off to Ludlow tomorrow to see Dad then I may have a celebratory dram or two to mark another notch in the tree of life.

 

Glad to see that Douglas is making progress even if the odd fire breaks out. Just make sure the syringe isn't filled with meths by mistake when putting it out. 

 

G'night all.

 

Dave

[simontaylor484]

Lutyens did design the cemeteries and the Cenotaph.

 

I remember watching a tv documentary and the Belgian farmer used to stack the shells at the side of the lane and bomb disposal came round every month to deal with the ordnance.

 

There are some you tube videos of Russian students digging up bodies around Stalingrad they are rebutting them in large cardboard boxes because the individual remains are in a mix as they were buried in mass graves unmarked 

[Joseph_Pestell]

46 minutes ago, Dave Hunt said:

some notable absentees including a certain ex-gendarme now resident in France.

 

 

 

One of the best aspects of the UK is that it is not policed by the army. The gentleman concerned was a "policier".

[jamie92208]

Bonjour, from La Belle France.  It seems that I'm on a fizzer for non attendance at an AGM.  I will have to plead Force Majeur as I was obeying orders from SWMBO. As she had threatened,  not to make a fresh Victoria sponge with butter icing filling, I didn't have much choice. However I'm dure that you managed without me.   

 

Happy Birthday Dave and I hope that you have a good and worthwhile  journey to see your Dad.

 

Jamie

[Mike Bellamy]

On 23/04/2021 at 09:01, Dave Hunt said:

Dad is now in a community hospital in Ludlow, which is sixty miles away 

 

We had similar with father-in-law. He lives in Grantham, was taken to Lincoln after a fall and then went to Gainsborough for rehab.

 

Grantham - Gainsborough is about 50 miles but we live the other side of Derby and so had to travel about 70 miles.  This was back in February and so we couldn't visit, but had to take a bag of clean clothes and bring home his dirty washing - we were only there five minutes !

 

Best wishes for your birthday . . . . . . . . 

.

[Happy Hippo]

Happy birthday to Dave and a safe trip to and from Ludlow.

 

Give your father my best wishes.

 

For some reason the internet connection to the Hippodrome was misbehaving yesterday, so my reporting times were somewhat disrupted.

 

Having seen Jamie's  reason for the non attendance at the Red Brigade AGM I can see that retirement to France has weakened his resolve and he is now merely a slave to cake.

[SM42]

11 hours ago, polybear said:

 

Bear recalls mention on the TV fairly recently that many schoolchildren didn't even know who Britain were at war with during WW2....

 

That really is sad, that the knowledge of modern history is so lacking. 

 

On a slightly related note, 10 years ago, (10 years!  ) we stopped off in Normandy for a few days en route to the Motherland. 

 

Mrs SM42 asked who's side the Americans were on.

I found this to be a rather strange question until I realised she had had a rather different  view of history taught to her at school.

 

HAppy birthday Dave and best wishes to your dad for a speedy recovery.

 

Andy

[jamie92208]

There has been talk of the 'iron harvest'.  On the day that we visited my uncle's grave we walked along the track from the cemetery to the location of the action. en route we passed this.

Whilst Dave, who was a former Tornado pilot and know a bit about such things and the effects, and I gave them a wide berth, we watched as one Brit stopped and put one in the back of his car.  Utter stupidity.

 

Jamie

 

[Stuart]

On 23/04/2021 at 17:45, simontaylor484 said:

No i dont think the submarine service would be for me. Sleeping in a coffin virtually ooh no. I sat the Admiralty Interview Board at Hms Sultan in Gosport back in 2000 i was unsuccessful but we were warned not to mention Submarines at all or you would most likely end up on one.

Ditto (although my unsuccessful  AIB was 1970 something). However, younger son, whom HH may recall as a fairly well constructed individual, has wanted to be a submariner since his teens. He did take us round his boat a couple of years ago and we were both amazed at the size of the thing. I gather coffin dreams are not unknown amongst the crew and given that on some ships/boats he has been unable to turn over in his bunk, I can quite understand that.

[Happy Hippo]

I do odd jobs for the older couple who live a few doors away.  The fact that she used to run a cake shop in Birmingham has no influence on my good nature!

 

Yesterday she asked me about a few jobs that needed doing:

 

The first was gluing a garden ornament back together.  That was swiftly accomplished.

 

The second was cutting out a new roof for a bird box.  Again this was a simple case of cutting an offcut of T&G board and then getting it down to the correct thickness.

 

The third was an  example of  a 'craftsman' being totally out of his depth.

 

They had a man in to do some painting and decorating, no problem with that as he did an excellent job:  However when he removed the door handles to paint the doors he found that the f'tard who had originally installed the catches had not used a 10-12 mm dia drill to  cross drill the doors for the square actuating rod but had used a 54mm dia hole saw.  The circular ornamental surrounds to the door knobs being glued back in place.

 

Of course when they were removed, it was obvious that they were not going back on! The catch itself was just hanging in the void. The chap that was doing the decorating stopped work when he realised the issue, and said he would go no further as he didn't want to be in the situation where he was unable to ensure every thing worked again.

 

I was asked what I felt could be done, as they really do not want to be replacing all the doors.

 

Fortunately I  had one of my infrequent bursts of sanity and wondered if my 54 mm hole saw could make a suitable plug to fit into the hole in the door.

 

The prototype was a good tight fit, so  over the next few days, I'll will cut out a number of plugs and bore them out to 12 mm dia for the actuating rod and then glue them into craters on each side of the doors. (Three so far, but I suspect all the doors in the house will be similar.)

 

I really would like to meet the person who did the original installation of the handles and smack him so hard that the next time he wants to clean his teeth he'll have to stick the toothbrush up his posterior.

 

 

 

 

 

Edited April 25, 2021 by Happy Hippo

[Happy Hippo]

9 minutes ago, Stuart said:

Ditto (although my unsuccessful  AIB was 1970 something). However, younger son, whom HH may recall as a fairly well constructed individual, has wanted to be a submariner since his teens. He did take us round his boat a couple of years ago and we were both amazed at the size of the thing. I gather coffin dreams are not unknown amongst the crew and given that on some ships/boats he has been unable to turn over in his bunk, I can quite understand that.

When he retires he could well become a hippo of considerable stature rather than a dolphin!

[Happy Hippo]

51 minutes ago, jamie92208 said:

There has been talk of the 'iron harvest'.  On the day that we visited my uncle's grave we walked along the track from the cemetery to the location of the action. en route we passed this.

Whilst Dave, who was a former Tornado pilot and know a bit about such things and the effects, and I gave them a wide berth, we watched as one Brit stopped and put one in the back of his car.  Utter stupidity.

 

Jamie

 

Those  look like typical cartridges of around the 18 pdr variety, of which many were used by both sides during WW1.

 

I'd suggest that the very top one looks as if it is just a spent case full of mud, but the others could well be fired rounds that have failed to explode on impact.  Landing in soft mud can easily create the conditions  for this to happen. (Probably a cartridge case was picked up and removed rather than the unexploded shell).

 

The when I was serving with the RAOC (now RLC) although we stored and issued all sorts of ammunition, the responsibility for the disposal of spent ordnance was the responsibility of the Royal Engineers above the high water mark, and the Royal Navy where things got salty wet. The only disposal the RAF used to do was their own stuff. RAOC/RLC ammunition disposal responsibilities centres around the more specialised IED.

 

Somewhere in the depth of my brain is an inkling that gas and other chemical warfare shells are disposed of by very high temperature incineration.

Edited April 25, 2021 by Happy Hippo

[SM42]

1 hour ago, jamie92208 said:

There has been talk of the 'iron harvest'.  On the day that we visited my uncle's grave we walked along the track from the cemetery to the location of the action. en route we passed this.

Whilst Dave, who was a former Tornado pilot and know a bit about such things and the effects, and I gave them a wide berth, we watched as one Brit stopped and put one in the back of his car.  Utter stupidity.

 

Jamie

 

 

The fact that  they appear to have been almost, if not,  driven over is a rather worrying too.

 

Andy