The Night Mail

[SM42]

For no apparent reason Beirut was the first thing that came to mind

 

Andy

[AndyID]

29 minutes ago, SM42 said:

For no apparent reason Beirut was the first thing that came to mind

 

Andy

 

Not all that far off. An island a bit to the West.

 

 

 

 

 

 

Edited September 18, 2021 by AndyID

[SM42]

Must be Cyprus then

 

Strange to think, looking at it now that Beirut was a popular tourist spot till the mid 70s 

 

Andy

[J. S. Bach]

Or Corfu. Crete is probably too far west; plus, I was there and the backround just does not look right for Crete.

[AndyID]

Too far east

[SM42]

Now we are heading towards Malta

 

Andy

[AndyID]

31 minutes ago, SM42 said:

Now we are heading towards Malta

 

 

Malta shmalta

 

Go West young man.

[PhilJ W]

Somewhere in the Balearics?

[jamie92208]

Time for a Night Mail report on yesterdays activities.   It was the monthly Model railway Group meeting.   Started as usual with a nice lunch, we are of course in France.   The restaurant was called La Marmite, which I have been informed means Cooking Pot in French.  It's next to the local Hippodrome, but there was no sign of a muddy hollow.

After the meal we headed for Richard's house a few miles away. He has a lovely Gauge 1 garden track and a huge collection of stock, much of it scratchbuilt. However whilst essentials like tea and cake were being sourced and consumed one member ran this lovely little thing with some of Richards stock.

By the time I'd eaten the cake this magnificent beast had appeared and was raising steam.  It's an Aster, complete with all 4 cylinders working. It was Richard's retirement present from work.

Whilst steam was being raised a small misguided team was running this battery RC loco. One drive, the other had to constantly watch for conkers falling onto the track and remove them.

Then the main event. Off set 6233 with 7 coaches that Richard had built

As you can see it managed the load with ease and had steam to spare.

The above is a still from the video.    When I've edited the video clips I'll try and upload a link.  

 

After that I had a pleasant hour trainspotting, without any trips slips or falls.  I even got an hour in the shed later whilst Beth chatted to a friend. All in all a good day.

 

Jamie

 

1

 

Edited April 21, 2022 by jamie92208

[Happy Hippo]

And so into the reals of compromise...

 

Anyone who has ever built a model railway, will realise from the moment the pen meets paper or the first section of Peco set track is laid, that the model they have just started to build is full of compromise.  It's driven by electricity (or the wrong type of electricity), the flanges are too deep, the curves are too sharp, and then there is the life modelled outside of the model railway envelope, it's almost invariably static.  Neither does the wind blow, there is no rain or snow and there is none natural sounds that accompany the real thing.

 

Without doubt we know that our proposed model will never be 100% perfection and accept the compromises we have to make.  We can even import some of the sounds from around the railway:  How I would love the sound of correct bell codes from a signal box heralding the arrival of a train.  But realistically, it's unlikely you'd ever hear them from what we would term normal viewing distances.

 

Although I have had the occasional wobble when it comes to my preferred railway company, I have settled with the ex GWR, so BR(W) in the 1956-66 period.  The time frame selected from the year of my birth until just after the demise of steam on the Western region.

 

In modelling terms the GWR was the basis of the 'Branch Line Terminus'(BLT) made popular by the late Cyril Freezer and his numerous plans in (mainly) Railway modeller.  I'd suggest that these were targeted at the cash and space starved modeller of the day, as they provided a simple and somewhat formulaic model railway.   

 

This consisted of a terminal station, probably in Devon or Cornwall, with a simple track plan of a run around loop, a couple of sidings, an engine shed and a bay platform.  Rolling stock would invariably be a small prairie tank,  a pannier tank and an auto tank.  Passenger stock would be an auto coach paired with the auto tank, a 'B' set (two brake ends coupled together), whilst freight would be a slew of various wagons and the ubiquitous 'Toad' brake van.  Invariably the freight stock would include a number of brightly coloured wooden mineral wagons from a variety of private owners.

 

It might have been a good idea at the time, but I'm sure that the huge number of GWT BLT spawned from this and then seen in the modelling press and at exhibitions up and down the country, must have been pretty depressing for those not quite as enamoured with the GWR or it's successor.  I suspect the latest incarnation of this type of modelling is now the Cornish china clay branch.

 

Without going into too many details, the Freezer GWR BLT was riddled with inaccuracies that have been perpetuated through the decades.  I'm sure that each of his individual elements in the design cropped up somewhere, but I don't think it was ever all at once!  But the continual perpetuation has created models that are somewhat cliched.

 

Now this must be a very bitter pill to swallow for the builders of models such as Faringdon in P4, where everything is as it should be, and as a result is a very fine model where the railway blends into the landscape, but this tends to be the exception.  Most model railways finish at the railway boundary fence!

 

So where am I compromising?

 

I wanted to model something I remembered as a child, and although I did experience the Devon mainline at Dawlish Warren in 1959 and 1960, where in the space of 12 months I witnessed the transition between steam and diesel on express trains  which was quite marked, I was more comfortable with the two branch lines that ran behind the houses of  grandparents.  The first being the freight only Ely Tidal Harbour Branch in Cardiff, and the second being the remains of the Cardiff railway between Whitchurch and Rhiwbina.  I also had a bit of main line as my godfather was the last stationmaster at Peterston- super- Ely.  Later I was to find out that a cousin of my father lived in the old Station House at Pentyrch Crossing between Radyr and Taffs Well.

 

Having decided to base a 7 mm scale model in South Wales, I then had to decide what elements I wanted to include.  It was certainly impractical to try and start a quadruple track arterial route up a valley, or a section of the main line west of Cardiff.  The space and stock requirements would be too great, so I was forced to lower my sights.

 

As a result, I ended up designing a small shunting plank, Splott West Sidings.  As with all plans, this morphed from a simple couple of sidings and a run round loop into a set of exchange sidings with  a short halt for  a workman's train: first as a terminal and then later to allow a through passenger service.   The fiction behind the plan creating  a pair of exchange sidings that fed a number of off scene industries, the exchange sidings being located at the tail end of a much larger yard complex  As in most model railways, the larger yard and the industries down the 'branch' being presented by the fiddle yard traverser.  The 'through' passenger service was merely an extended tail of the run around loop, where the passenger train could hide just beyond the bridge until it was time to return to the fiddle yard.

 

All pretty staple stuff, but the whole thing was only 18' long, so there was a lot of compromise in the length of run.  This was reflected in the original traverser which at 4 feet long, could just hold a maximum of a pannier tank, six mineral wagons and a brake van on one of the roads.  Not really a prototypical size of train for the area, but we got around it by pretending that the stuff arriving for the exchange sidings had been cut from larger trains in the off scene section of the yard.  The passenger stuff was covered by the rather cliched Auto train or single car DMU.  

 

Now although auto working and single car DMUs were not unknown in the south Wales area, the were not as common as one would like to think.  Until 1958 and the introduction of interval working in the S Wales valleys, passenger services had mainly been in the hands of much larger trains, 5 coaches being the norm until their replacement by 3 car DMUs which were doubled up for the heavier traffic loads.  Obviously there was no way that I can fit in a 5 coach set onto a model that is only 18 feet long, so I am having to compromise, so an auto train for steam days, and then the single car DMU for the later period is all I can do.

 

Those that would like to know a lot more about passenger working in S Wales should approach Chrisf, as he is extremely knowledgeable about such matters.

 

In order to make our freight trains on SWS look bigger than they actually where,  we made the two exchange sidings around eight feet long.  With a maximum train length of 6 minerals and a brake van, the sidings tended to swallow up the exchange traffic.  This created an optical illusion which made everything look much bigger than what it really was!

 

The resurrection of Pantmawr Sidings has raised similar issues.  With a scenic section of just ten feet, and a board width of eighteen inches. it does look longer than it is. but due to it being built on a continual curve all you have on view is the crossover at the end of the loop and the two exchange sidings.  Unlike SWS, these siding will take a six wagon set of mineral wagons, but they are much shorter than those on SWS, and it shows as we were forced to compromise length to get everything on scene.  Again, a platform for workmen is provided opposite the sidings, but this will probably be modelled in a disused state.  Any passenger trains being a simple shuttle.

 

The fiddle yard on SWS was not so much a compromise, but a restriction so a slight rebuild led to an extension of some 3 inches on the traverser, which eased the pressure on loading a full freight train, but allowed the introduction of a two coach passenger train in the form of the infamous 'B' set.  Of course it had to terminate at the platform as there was not enough room to hide it out of sight at the far end, nor was there any proper facilities to remarshal the loco to the other end.

 

Back on PS, the decision was made to replace the planned five foot cassette table at the loop end with an 'L' shaped six foot table, and at the platform end it was decided that the single extension spur used (again) to hide the auto train/DMU was to be replaced with a four foot cassette table, although this was changed pdq to a mirror of the table at the other end.

 

This arrangement means we have more off scene storage than we do visible model railway, but it does give us the opportunity of running a pannier tank/ten minerals/brake van should we so desire.  Likewise it gives us the opportunity to run three coach passenger trains should the stock situation permit.

 

The next big build will also see quite a bit of compromise.  Ideally it will utilize much of the same locos and rolling stock and both the 'L' shaped cassette tables, although this time, curvature on the visible section is still going to be quite tight.  I'm currently working on building the visible section on a continual curve apart from a couple of straight sections at the beginning of the respective cassette tables.  Although this ought to  look good, any turnouts will end up on the curve, and they invariably take up more space.

 

Of course, should a typical valleys line be on a long sweeping curve or would it look better a little tighter with a rock face or retaining wall on one side and a river hemming it in on the other?

 

Whichever course it takes, it will be another set of compromises.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Edited September 18, 2021 by Happy Hippo

[Tony_S]

4 hours ago, AndyID said:

 

Malta shmalta

 

Go West young man.

I was thinking somewhere in Scotland. We used to go there in the early 70s for our Summer holidays. 

[Happy Hippo]

16 minutes ago, Tony_S said:

I was thinking somewhere in Scotland. We used to go there in the early 70s for our Summer holidays. 

It's definitely not Wales!

 

The sunshine's not wet enough.

[polybear]

1 hour ago, jamie92208 said:

By the time I'd eaten the cake this magnificent beast had appeared and was raising steam.  It's an Aster, complete with all 4 cylinders working. It was Richard's retirement present from work.

 

 

 

 

An Aster as a leaving prezzie?  My Beary Radar detects a man that wasn't working on the checkouts in Tesco's....

[Northmoor]

1 hour ago, Happy Hippo said:

In modelling terms the GWR was the basis of the 'Branch Line Terminus'(BLT) made popular by the late Cyril Freezer and his numerous plans in (mainly) Railway modeller.  I'd suggest that these were targeted at the cash and space starved modeller of the day, as they provided a simple and somewhat formulaic model railway.   

 

Without going into too many details, the Freezer GWR BLT was riddled with inaccuracies that have been perpetuated through the decades.  I'm sure that each of his individual elements in the design cropped up somewhere, but I don't think it was ever all at once!  But the continual perpetuation has created models that are somewhat cliched.

 

Now this must be a very bitter pill to swallow for the builders of models such as Faringdon in P4, where everything is as it should be, and as a result is a very fine model where the railway blends into the landscape, but this tends to be the exception.  Most model railways finish at the railway boundary fence!

 

An excellent synopysis of how the GWR BLT cliche was created and why.  The need to contrive a means of getting "something like a real railway" into a small home, even if it was only something like it.  I've always thought the biggest error is the false restriction of space; these BLTs are all in fictional small country towns where land would have been almost always (in the railway building era) cheap and available.  If they had been like Minories and in a City setting, the confined sites would have been more believable; most real rural BLTs were on huge sites*.

 

You've also highlighted how a lot of modellers clearly get their inspiration from other layouts and not the real railway.  Every month in the modelling press is another layout which looks like a copy, of a copy, of a copy of a model of a real railway location but it has always been this way.  Just as the 1970s/80s was all about the GWR BLT (Mac Pyrke's Berrow inspired many copies too), Ian Futers' Lochside seemed to have spawned hundreds of similar layouts and someone in the mid-90s - it may have been @Clive Mortimore's Hanging Hill - set a standard for diesel depots that many tried to replicate, but more usually both without Clive's detailed research and using a corruption of the Minories layout to create a small diesel depot of a type that didn't exist in reality.  

 

*Having said this I've been building - on and off for 3 years - BR(W) BLT in 5'6", with the excuse that it was built as a light railway with no money.  It's almost plausible in that it is based on a railway planned but never built, with a real site that would have been quite constrained, but should probably still be three times the size I'm making it.

[SM42]

8 hours ago, AndyID said:

 

Malta shmalta

 

Go West young man.

 

OK then

 

Gibraltar 

 

Its a smidge more than "a bit to the west" of Beirut though.

A whole sea away in fact. 

 

After that I'm looking at the Azores or Cuba 

 

Andy

[Happy Hippo]

3 minutes ago, SM42 said:

 

OK then

 

Gibraltar 

 

Its a smidge more than "a bit to the west" of Beirut though.

A whole sea away in fact. 

 

After that I'm looking at the Azores or Cuba 

 

Andy

But Gib is not an island, unless the Sapniards (sic) have done something dastardly in the early hours of the morning!

[SM42]

10 minutes ago, Happy Hippo said:

But Gib is not an island, unless the Sapniards (sic) have done something dastardly in the early hours of the morning!

 

I know, but it is often referred to as one

 

A little island of Britishness but without the rain, perhaps

 

Andy

[SM42]

I'll  throw in Sardinia, Mallorca and The Balliarics into the mix

 

Andy

 

[Happy Hippo]

6 minutes ago, SM42 said:

 

I know, but it is often referred to as one

 

A little island of Britishness but without the rain, perhaps

 

Andy

It must be me, but every time I've visited Gibraltar it's been quite cool and it rained.

 

I'm not a fan and think it similar to Rhyl, but without the charm.

[SM42]

4 minutes ago, Happy Hippo said:

It must be me, but every time I've visited Gibraltar it's been quite cool and it rained.

 

I'm not a fan and think it similar to Rhyl, but without the charm.

 

Well a Hippo does need a muddy hollow wherever they may be

 

Andy

 

[Tony_S]

1 hour ago, Happy Hippo said:

It must be me, but every time I've visited Gibraltar it's been quite cool and it rained.

 

I'm not a fan and think it similar to Rhyl, but without the charm.

I don’t think I have been to Rhyl. When we have been on cruises I have noticed some passengers get quite excited about Gibraltar. The first time we went we saw the tunnels and went up on the cable car to see the monkeys and the view. The next time we went we wandered up to the botanic gardens. We didn’t visit the guinea pig sanctuary but we could smell it. I think the  next time I just walked to the pharmacy near the dock entrance to get some cough remedies for Aditi. 

Edited September 18, 2021 by Tony_S

[Tony_S]

5 hours ago, Happy Hippo said:

It's definitely not Wales!

 

The sunshine's not wet enough.

The earliest summer holidays I can remember were in Wales. It did seem to rain. Then my mother decided we should go to Cornwall instead as she thought Wales was a bit crowded (there were other families on the campsite). It seemed to rain there as well. So just before I stopped going on holiday with them we had a couple of holidays in Scotland (Mum thought Cornwall was getting too crowded) It rained there quite a lot too. 

[AndyID]

BALEARICS! Cala LLonga, Ibiza.

 

We took a trip to Formentera which was a hippo hippie colony at the time.

[simontaylor484]

Is it Benidorm 

[polybear]

2 hours ago, Tony_S said:

When we have been on cruises I have noticed some passengers get quite excited about Gibraltar. The first time we went we saw the tunnels and went up on the cable car to see the monkeys and the view. The next time we went we wandered up to the botanic gardens. We didn’t visit the guinea pig sanctuary but we could smell it. I think the  next time I just walked to the pharmacy near the dock entrance to get some cough remedies for Aditi. 

 

Bear spent about a week in Gib back in 2008 (jeez - was it really that long ago?) working with the RN/FAA on Trials.  Did the cablecar etc., a wander about etc. - but not the tunnels .  It was all pretty good; one of the RN guys took great delight in pointing out a certain garage forecourt where the SAS "had a bit of fun" some years earlier....