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The Night Mail


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Went to Germany in the early 2000s - felt very strange to be able to go to the East. Some nice historic places (e.g. Quedlinburg), but the minor roads were something else. At least the roads around the HSB  were reasonable.

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39 minutes ago, simontaylor484 said:

We found the same in Croatia having seen the place as a war zone on the tv in the 90s although we were warned not to stray in certain woods just in case there were uncleared minefields/munitions.

 

But it was a fantastic holiday and I would reccomend the Istrian Riviera to anyone its stunning 

 

I found it quite odd to be in places half seen on TV in the  80s as scenes on the news of some industrial action with the police and army in attendance. 

I spent most of those times taking little interest as one does as a pre teen and teenager, but actually being to  places like Koplania Wujek in Katowice, where several miners were killed in 1981 by the militia or the gates of the Lenin shipyard in Gdansk where Solidarnosc was born, made me shiver a little.

The former I was vaguely aware of, the later I remember more coverage of. 

 

The history and consequences of the what took place at such locations are immense.  

The Europe we have today was born of the sacrifices in such  locations. 

 

Andy

Edited by SM42
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55 minutes ago, simontaylor484 said:

We found the same in Croatia having seen the place as a war zone on the tv in the 90s although we were warned not to stray in certain woods just in case there were uncleared minefields/munitions.

 

But it was a fantastic holiday and I would reccomend the Istrian Riviera to anyone its stunning 

When we went to Slovenia it was as if Yugoslavia had never existed apart from a tour we went on to Tito’s summer villa. Trips to Croatia did reveal signs of the 90s conflict. Matthew went to Republika Srpska which is part of Bosnia but acted as if it were independent. He had also visited Montenegro and Serbia on other trips for geography conferences. 

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1 hour ago, SM42 said:

 

I found it quite odd to be in places half seen on TV in the  80s as scenes on the news of some industrial action with the police and army in attendance. 

I spent most of those times taking little interest as one does as a pre teen and teenager, but actually being to  places like Koplania Wujek in Katowice, where several miners were killed in 1981 by the militia or the gates of the Lenin shipyard in Gdansk where Solidarnosc was born, made me shiver a little.

The former I was vaguely aware of, the later I remember more coverage of. 

 

The history and consequences of the what took place at such locations are immense.  

The Europe we have today was born of the sacrifices in such  locations. 

 

Andy

Daft as it sounds its a bit like going to places round here like Cortonwood and Orgreave.

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When I went to Germany in the 70's the part of Germany I visited was n the opposite bank of the Rhine to Mannerheim well away from the GDR. However the family I stayed with had the family photos out and as it turned out they had relatives living in the east. What was shocking was that they seemed to accept the status quo. Thankfully the family were reunited  when the wall came down.

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Went to have my hooter checked and got a clean bill of health from the clinic. The size of the dressing l have now is less than a quarter of the previous one and as a result the field of vision from my right eye is almost normal so that's a bonus. To celebrate I went down to the shed and got on with ballasting, working on one of the three throw turnouts which is an interesting exercise to say the least. So far I've managed to get it about half done without actually gumming everything up.

 

3 hours ago, simontaylor484 said:

When i went to Germany the wall had already come down but i did go to some places no doubt visited by @Dave Hunt such as Bruggen and Gutersloh and Rhiendalen

Spent three and a half years at Bruggen 1970 - 74, have landed at Gutersloh and stood Battle Flight from there many times, and since Rheindahlen was HQ RAF Germany as well as having the big NAAFI supermarket and cinema, visited there lots of times - a couple of times to give very senior officers good listenings to when I'd been a naughty boy.

 

'Night all

 

Dave 

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Visited former DDR a couple of times on holiday and the places I visited were quite chintzy, Wernigerode, Quedlinburg, Warnemunde, and Kuhlungborn.  Halberstat, not so good. Took SWMBO who wasn’t too impressed, neither was I, most of the railway infrastructure been had been swept away.

 

 

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2 hours ago, simontaylor484 said:

Daft as it sounds its a bit like going to places round here like Cortonwood……

Yes, SWMBO likes going to Cortonwood, there’s even a Marks and Spencer’s there.

 

On a serious note that was the place my cousin had his last job with the NCB, in the offices there. It’s where the 1984 miners strike started and I remember it well.

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cortonwood

Edited by Erichill16
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2 hours ago, Dave Hunt said:

 

Spent three and a half years at Bruggen 1970 - 74, have landed at Gutersloh and stood Battle Flight from there many times, and since Rheindahlen was HQ RAF Germany as well as having the big NAAFI supermarket and cinema, visited there lots of times - a couple of times to give very senior officers good listenings to when I'd been a naughty boy.

 

 

 I imagine you were quite happy to not be flying Starfighters :)

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My cousin told us about his experience. In the US Army, it was the last day of his tour in Berlin. He was attached to some sort of intelligence. He'd been sent back to pack. Someone came around saying that something was happening and they had to get back to work. He dressed, went in, and was told "What are you doing here? Get back to barracks."

Noone seemed to know what was going on. So he and a friend went out on the town and watched the wall go up.

(Some details may have suffered my fuzzy memory.)

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I have had the privilege to be able to visit many places that many know well from the history of the 20th century and especially those from  WW2.

But despite being aware of the suffering, sacrifice or world changing events that occurred at these places, they don't have the same impact as those places of more recent events

 

It seems that perhaps a greater overall effect on one's feelings or sensations depends on whether what happened there has a personal connection  or occurred within your own living memory .

 

Andy

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8 hours ago, Dave Hunt said:

.......visited there lots of times - a couple of times to give very senior officers good listenings to when I'd been a naughty boy.

 

'Night all

 

Dave 

 

A naughty boy?  Surely not...can't imagine that for one moment....

:laugh:

 

 

 

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23 minutes ago, SM42 said:

I have had the privilege to be able to visit many places that many know well from the history of the 20th century and especially those from  WW2.

But despite being aware of the suffering, sacrifice or world changing events that occurred at these places, they don't have the same impact as those places of more recent events

 

It seems that perhaps a greater overall effect on one's feelings or sensations depends on whether what happened there has a personal connection  or occurred within your own living memory .

 

Andy

I'm not sure.  Oradour sur Glane is very impactive and most people just walk round in silence. However that only occurred  in 1944.  I did visit the Vimy Ridge memorial and having done the short walk from the visitor centre by the Canadian trenches, to the memorial, suddenly felt quite emotional when I realised how many thousands of soldiers had died to make that walk in 1917.  We are all affected differently I suppose as I can normally deal with death and serious injury with no problems.

 

Jamie

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On a lighter note can I take a contract out on whoever designed Skater's coach bogies please. They are fiendish things to try and assemble.  On the third attempt I managed to construct a bolster yesterday, 2 etchings, 1 WM casting, 4 brass casti gs and four pieces of wire. Part soldered, part glued.  I suppose the whiffs of phosphoric  acid kept the brain alert.

 

Jamie

 

 

 

 

 

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Well things are looking up today. 

 

The smell of bacon and eggs wafts through SM42 Hall ( we aren't at the Towers at the mo) and it has been announced that tomorrow I have a day pass to go train watching, as long as I report back for duty at 1700hrs :yahoo:

 

On top of that Mrs ID has perked up and the Hunt Hooter is on the mend. :dance_mini:

 

It's not even 0900hrs yet (0800 UK)

 

Can the day get any better ?

 

 

Andy

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I find Oradour-sur-Glane an odd one. I just about remember the state of much of East London, well into the early 1960s when playing on bombsites was common and derelict, uninhabited houses still stood in many streets. No-one regarded this as particularly noteworthy at the time, despite high casualties. Coventry Cathedral is we known but Charles Cross, a burnt-out church in the centre of Plymouth preserved as a memorial, stands neglected and forgotten in an sight; there is a small bombed-out church preserved as a garden in the East of London which even I, knowing the place, can't name off-hand. *

 

*St Dunstan In The East. I'm also reminded of St Lukes in Liverpool.

Edited by rockershovel
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I found working in Tunisia in 2007-08 to be emotionally challenging, occasionally. My late father, a pre-War regular served from the opening campaigns (where Italian troops established their reputation for military excellence....) to the now largely-forgotten  capitulation at Tunis. 

 

Places like Mareth, Gabez and Wadi Akarit are little changed, apart from the increased building. The CWG cemetery in Sfax is exactly as you would expect, and I was able to locate the grave of my late uncle, one of four set immediately adjacent (denoting the individually unidentifiable remains of a tank crew, a common sight in these cemeteries).

 

My colleague, with no connections to the area, didn't feel this at all. To him, it was just another hot, dusty job to get done and get out. 

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Tunisia / Libya / Egypt. I'd like to visit as My grandfather fought in the Western Desert Gallop, he was lucky in only being wounded and taken prisoner, many of his men didn't make it. He started WW2 as a CSM in Europe pre Dunkirk, but was RSM RTR by the time of capture at the second siege of Tobruk..

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1 hour ago, jamie92208 said:

I'm not sure.  Oradour sur Glane is very impactive and most people just walk round in silence. However that only occurred  in 1944.  I did visit the Vimy Ridge memorial and having done the short walk from the visitor centre by the Canadian trenches, to the memorial, suddenly felt quite emotional when I realised how many thousands of soldiers had died to make that walk in 1917.  We are all affected differently I suppose as I can normally deal with death and serious injury with no problems.

 

Jamie

Stand at Tyne Cote cemetery and look back to the Canadian memorial at Vancouver Corner in the Ypres salient area, and realise that approximately 10,000 men still lie between the two with no known grave cuts right to your soul.

 

If one can have a favourite memorial, then mine is the Welsh Dragon facing Mametz Wood on the Somme.

 

image.png.4e80748d317ba57fb5d0d64b948011b9.png

 

 

The wood has grown back and has been left alone.

 

You can walk through it and find all manner of both spent and unexploded ordnance plus other wartime detritus. 

 

The fields surrounding the woods, when ploughed, still generate the 'iron harvest'.

 

 

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21 hours ago, PhilJ W said:

Now your retired how about putting yourself up as a candidate. :jester:

 

I'm actually active in local politics, I am admin for a local pressure group.  This brought about a big fight during our general election two weeks ago about the proposed housing development (on the beach - that is a nature reserve!)  to fund a marina.  We won....but its not all over yet.  

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1 minute ago, New Haven Neil said:

 

I'm actually active in local politics, I am admin for a local pressure group.  This brought about a big fight during our general election two weeks ago about the proposed housing development (on the beach - that is a nature reserve!)  to fund a marina.  We won....but Yits not all over yet.  

 

Yes I remember you mentioned that you going to take on the 'the powers to be'. Glad to hear that you won. I also recall seeing a petition about that marina - I think I signed it. Its nice to know that sometimes the people are listened too.:superman:

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28 minutes ago, Winslow Boy said:

 

 

 

Yes I remember you mentioned that you going to take on the 'the powers to be'. Glad to hear that you won. I also recall seeing a petition about that marina - I think I signed it. Its nice to know that sometimes the people are listened too.:superman:

 

Thanks for the support.  It's not 'dead in the water' yet, but close to.  One MHK has already raised the issue in Tynwald, and public opinion is strongly on our side.  The proposers are a right bunch, some research reveals a lot of hot air and wishful thinking, but little substance.  Or funds.  Not the place for it here, but it has been a struggle against one person mostly.  He used to be my GP.....

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2 minutes ago, New Haven Neil said:

 

Thanks for the support.  It's not 'dead in the water' yet, but close to.  One MHK has already raised the issue in Tynwald, and public opinion is strongly on our side.  The proposers are a right bunch, some research reveals a lot of hot air and wishful thinking, but little substance.  Or funds.  Not the place for it here, but it has been a struggle against one person mostly.  He used to be my GP.....

 

I can hear the reasons for it - help the young families to stay on the island- support the local economy- attract more visitors etc. A get rich scheme by any other name and so what if a few ducks arnt able to nest. Always the way when it comes to wildlife I'm afraid. Keep up the pressure.

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