50's 60's BR Vans and colours - newbie assist please

[sumo]

I can't easily get or use specialist paints so I was wondering if anyone could tell me which colours are close to BR Bauxite and Grey. Ideally Vallejo or even Humbrol as I may have the colour already. 

 

Also why were some vans bauxite, grey or white?

 

Thanks.

 

Mike

[MartinWales]

Bauxite would, generally, have been applied to fitted vehicles.

 

Grey would denote that the vehicle was unfitted

 

White would be generally applied to insulated (ie Meat) of Fish Vans, the alternative livery being ice blue

[The Johnster]

Bauxite was used for fitted and through piped vehicles, but some vans were given  white or blue livery as MartinWales has stated.  In addition there were meat vans  in maroon coaching stock livery as produced by Airfix, then Dapol, and recently Kitmaster as plastic construction kits.  These were anomalous in carrying a coaching stock livery but being numbered in the wagon series and ‘XP’ branded.  Because the kit has been available for many years it is used on many layouts, but in reality only a small number were ever built and some of those were repainted into bauxite.  
 

I wouldn’t spend too much time or effort in getting the unfitted grey livery spot on correct, as many, especially of the wooden bodied wagons and vans that carried, it had it applied in the early 50s at a time of austerity.  This meant that the actual colour was a bit of a moveable feast, and vehicles appears in whatever shade was available at that workshop at that time.  For some time, newly built unfitted wooden open wagons were sent into traffic unpainted bar black panels to background the number and other branding

[Wheatley]

Bauxite  - Halfords red primer as it comes (bit too pink for me),  Games Workshop / Citadel Dark Flesh, Vallejo 70846 Mahogany Sand, or for the more orange (earlier ?) version Revell 95 Brown. Bauxite is one of those colours which varies wildly once it weathers (not quite as badly as olive green) so I defy you to find a photo with all the bauxite wagons in the train exactly the same shade !

 

Grey - Humbrol 64 or Revell 75. 

[doctor quinn]

Carplan and Simoniz red primers are deeper and redder which I think works better for BR fitted stock. I prefer Tamiya grey primer for unfitted stock as it’s paler and goes on smoothly. Best thing would be to experiment on scrap plastic or scrap models to see which looks best to you.

Edited July 3, 2020 by doctor quinn

[SM42]

Humbrol 64 for unfitted grey

 

Humbrol 133 is OK for bauxite (perhaps better for the later freight brown colour) and is a semi gloss colour so good for adding decals before knocking back with a matt varnish.

 

Andy

[PatB]

I've previously used Tamiya IJN Grey for unfitted stock as it looked about right to me. However, whilst not colour blind, my perception of shades, tones and other subtle differences is mediocre to poor, so I'm probably not entirely reliable. 

[34theletterbetweenB&D]

11 hours ago, Wheatley said:

... Bauxite is one of those colours which varies wildly once it weathers (not quite as badly as olive green) so I defy you to find a photo with all the bauxite wagons in the train exactly the same shade ...

And yet more: as applied by BR it was far from consistent when new.

 

Short answer is that the last thing you want if aiming to accurately represent BR wagons in service is consistent appearance of either bauxite or grey painted wagons. Between the variation in the paint itself, applied over a new build or whatever previous substrate of a repainted vehicle, and the various effects of fading, the constant shower of filth on the railway and corrosion of steel bodywork elements: 'no two alike' was the end result fairly swiftly after leaving the paint shop...

[TheSignalEngineer]

I tend to use Halfords red or grey primer as a base for most wagons then vary it with washes and weathering powder.

Don't forget that a lot of paints were still hand mixed on site in the 1950s, so there were wide variations. Also for the grey there was a lot of MOD surplus paint around after WW2 and any steel bodied fitted wagons could have been set out in red oxide primer without a finishing coat in times of shortage.

[sumo]

Thanks for all this.

 

Spoilt for choice! I have some of these so can do some experimenting before my next trip to the model shop.

 

I was never going to make them all the same colour, but I needed to get a feel from the experts. I have a Bachmann van that is very red in tone which I wasn't convinced by. But if I ring the changes all will be well. 

 

Very helpful.

[The Johnster]

There is also the matter of the different way paint fades on planked or ply wood surfaces, and on steel.  If something you've painted looks obviously wrong to you, then you need to repaint it, but if you're happy with the colours you've got I'd leave them be, even if there is a bit of variation.

[Chris Turnbull]

To see what weathering does to wagons of supposedly the same livery look at those in the foreground on this photo:

 

 

Bury St Edmunds on 13th May 1968

 

Chris Turnbull

[Chris Turnbull]

And here's some "grey" minerals:

 

 

And here's some bauxite:

 

Both taken at Carnforth on the 8th and 9th July 1968 respectively.

 

Chris Turnbull

Edited July 9, 2020 by Chris Turnbull

[45125]

16 hours ago, The Johnster said:

There is also the matter of the different way paint fades on planked or ply wood surfaces, and on steel.  If something you've painted looks obviously wrong to you, then you need to repaint it, but if you're happy with the colours you've got I'd leave them be, even if there is a bit of variation.

Not only the way it fades o different materials, but how it is applied.