LMC Bakelite Coach Restoration a cautionary tale

[BernardTPM]

The small, round circles are, I'm pretty sure, 'witness marks' where the ejector pins would push the roof off the inner part of the mould. The four large bosses may well have been for holding pea bulbs for lighting (or holding little screw fittings for pea bulbs).

[Silverfox17]

Here are my 3, all done about 30 years ago.  The blood and custard one had most of its vents missing so whitemetal ones were fitted by gluing onto the windows after painting.  You can see the brass rod used to hold the roof down, and, on mine the roof is very slightly narrower than the body.  Because I put seats etc in these you do not see the rod holding the roof down or it is not as noticeable.

 

Garry

[Nearholmer]

They really look ‘the business’.

[Bassettblowke]

Agreed a first class job and something to aspire to, I like the brass rod fixing,  simple yet functional, brilliant. Did you scratch build the seating ?

[Silverfox17]

3 minutes ago, Bassettblowke said:

Agreed a first class job and something to aspire to, I like the brass rod fixing,  simple yet functional, brilliant. Did you scratch build the seating ?

Yes, it was just a narrow tall piece for the centre and a couple of square blocks on each side then coverd in one strip of some material that I have no idea now what it was.  Covering in one piece gave the round edges I think. I very much doubt I shaped them. It is possible I did them in longer lengths and cut off later. 

 

Garry 

[Bassettblowke]

When I started this thread I was hoping that someone like your good self would chip in with some sound advice and steer me in the right direction. That’s one of the good things about the internet and especially forums such as this, in  that someone like me with little knowledge of the subject in hand can acquire a few obscure bits and pieces from a long defunct model railway company and with a lot of help from fellow members actually (hopefully) produce the finished article, looking as it would of back in the day.

Edited July 15, 2020 by Bassettblowke

[Silverfox17]

21 minutes ago, Bassettblowke said:

When I started this thread I was hoping that someone like your good self would chip in with some sound advice and steer me in the right direction. That’s one of the good things about the internet and especially forums such as this that someone like me with little knowledge of the subject in hand can acquire a few obscure bits and pieces from a long defunct model railway company and with a lot of help from fellow members actually (hopefully) produce the finished article looking as it would of back in the day.

Thanks, I have no knowledge of these really I just bought them cheap somewhere as bodies but knew who LMC was. I did not research anything just went my own way, which I still do with my TT layout, and did what I thought necessary. The bogies are whitemetal and in those days bought most of my parts from Home of 0 gauge in Raynes Park. Nick was a very helpful chap regarding what was available. 

 

I have never seen an original so no idea what they really looked like when factory fresh. 

 

Garry 

[Bassettblowke]

Searching around the web I’ve come across several different types of mouldings the obvious one is the coach body minus window vent frets, apparently it was common for any damaged frets to be removed completely and the coach body offered for sale sans window frets. The other stand out one was the ribbing on the roof mine is perfectly smooth but I’ve found pictures of others with ribs seemingly in the mould, unless of course they have been added. These coaches were available as the finished article or as a kit of parts and were sold from the immediate pre war years until the company ceased trading. Garry’s three I would guess to be factory finished and then subsequently refurbished and upgraded by him and very nice too.

On my example so far so good however looking to the future the thought of lining them gives me the heebie jeebies.

[Nearholmer]

Did you see the young woman lining them in that Pathe film?

 

Speed! She was doing a coach in about ten seconds.

[Silverfox17]

As far as I can remember mine did not have much left on them, if anything. The roofs were all smooth and mine just have thin tape put on before painting. When I did mine I could use a lining pen reasonably well and even managed twin lines on N gauge, now I cannot use one. I think it is partly to do with the paint but mostly my age. 

 

My TT ones have to be transferred, I tried lining but it was no good. 

 

Garry 

[Bassettblowke]

Wobbly hand syndrome is my problem, fortunately it’s not constant but I have to judge the moment. Out of curiosity does anyone have any experience with lining pens I have been looking at a few and they don’t come cheap.

[Silverfox17]

I did buy  Bob Moores lining pen in the late 80's soon after he brought them out and never got the hang of it. I went back to the sprung divider style that draughtsmen use for ink and it was great until I stopped using it around 2000 and then tried to use it again 10 years later. No matter what I did I still could not get it to work properly.  The nib does have to be perfect and the paint the correct consistancy. I was always told fresh paint straight from the tin was ideal and it was in those days. Now, it does not seem to flow the same and thinning it can make it run. I think the paint formula has changed but others still seem to have success with it. 

 

Garry 

[Nearholmer]

Very similar to Silverfox, out of practice bow-pen user.

 

I don't know where you get bow-pens these days, the few good ones I have are truly ancient, bought in junk shops years ago. The ones in cheap "geometry sets" are nowhere near good enough. Maybe art shops stock them.

 

The best paint is enamel, very, very well mixed, and slightly thicker than milk. I agree that thinning paint can make it problematic - it tends to wick out of the pen and spread, when what you want is for it to sit as a fine bead.

 

 

 

 

Edited July 15, 2020 by Nearholmer

[Mark Carne]

4 hours ago, Bassettblowke said:

Searching around the web I’ve come across several different types of mouldings the obvious one is the coach body minus window vent frets, apparently it was common for any damaged frets to be removed completely and the coach body offered for sale sans window frets. The other stand out one was the ribbing on the roof mine is perfectly smooth but I’ve found pictures of others with ribs seemingly in the mould, unless of course they have been added. These coaches were available as the finished article or as a kit of parts and were sold from the immediate pre war years until the company ceased trading. Garry’s three I would guess to be factory finished and then subsequently refurbished and upgraded by him and very nice too.

On my example so far so good however looking to the future the thought of lining them gives me the heebie jeebies.

Leeds used the damaged ones with the window frets removed for Southern coaches post war. Bakelite coaches were introduced in 1937, all pre war models were made in self coloured bakelite, post war they were all made with black bakelite, which is why there are no post war LNER coaches, as the finish was produced using coloured bakelite.

 

Mark

[cctransuk]

53 minutes ago, Nearholmer said:

Very similar to Silverfox, out of practice bow-pen user.

 

I don't know where you get bow-pens these days, the few good ones I have are truly ancient, bought in junk shops years ago. The ones in cheap "geometry sets" are nowhere near good enough. Maybe art shops stock them.

 

The best paint is enamel, very, very well mixed, and slightly thicker than milk. I agree that thinning paint can make it problematic - it tends to wick out of the pen and spread, when what you want is for it to sit as a fine bead.

 

 

 

 

 

In drawing office practice, we used to apply a film of pounce - chalk dust - to discourage 'wicking'. I've tried this on models - years ago - and it did help.

 

I would imagine that the application of thinned paint via a bow pen would be more successful on a matt finish; certainly our drawing film was matt finished, and we applied the pounce to this to absorb any greasy fingermarks before starting work.

 

John Isherwood.