Motorising Peco oo electrofrog points

[delticfan]

Can anyone suggest an idiots guide to motorising a peco point I will have about 15 to do. I want to make my own track layout board with toggle switches on the points maybe even some nice led lights showing which roads are switched. I haven’t a clue about power supply or motors but seep ones look good. Oh and although the locos will be dcc I want the points and signals analogue. Thanks in anticipation.

[Pete the Elaner]

I would avoid Seep. I went with those for my layout & feel now that it was a bad decision because some seem to be a little sticky & they are more current hungry than Peco motors.

Some would argue that Seeps simply need setting up very carefully, but when there are alternatives available at a similar cost which are not so fussy for set up, then why bother?

I had less issues with Peco motors & will use these to replace any Seeps which fail. Seeps are available with an integrated switch (primarily for frog powering) but it is very crude & unreliable. I set up 5 of these on a friend's layout & 2 never worked. Happily I had seen how crude the switch was & had some micro switches ready.

 

Do you want to use solenoids or slow action motors? Solenoids change with a thump which can be a little harsh for hand-built track & require wiring very differently.

Slow action (stall motors) will work nicely with toggle switches which latch so you can see from the switch position which way they are thrown (maybe an alternative to LEDs for route indication). Solenoids are momentary so if you want to use toggle switches, you will need ones which self-centre.

 

Do you want to actively switch your point frogs or rely on point blades for track current? This really needs to be considered before you lay the track because changing your mind later involves lifting & re-laying points. Custom accessory switches are available for most types of motor this but micro switches are another option. Some motors such as tortoises have 2 internal switches & I have never heard of a problem with them.

 

There is nothing wrong with using another switch for a LED but since you are using DCC, another option for route indication is to use the polarity of the frogs themselves. When you throw a point, the frog polarity should change. You can use this to wire a LED across the rails to show which route has been selected.

If it fails to change, this indicates a problem.

 

For powering, Solenoids require a short burst of current. AC will work, but DC from a Capacitor Discharge Unit is preferred by many. The CDU provides a short, sharp burst of current which gives several benefits:

It gives a powerful kick to throw a motor or point which can be a little sticky.

It prevents the motor from burning out due to having power applied for too long.

It prevents the switch contacts from arcing when the switch is released, prolonging the life of the switch.

Slow action (stall) motors work very differently. They are effectively a small motor which turns in either direction, depending on which way you want the point set. These are good for appearance on a modern motor, but not for an older lever frame where the signalman grabs his lever & puts his weight behind throwing it. These tend to be a little faster.

They are more gentle & the force they put on the blades can be adjustable. They also remain powered to hold the blade in place. They change direction by switching the polarity of the DC supply to the point, requiring 2 wires for each point instead of 3. I guess you could always use this polarity to drive route indicating LEDs from the switch, keeping that part of it on the panel instead of having to wire back from the layout.

[delticfan]

Thanks for such a detailed reply, I’ll have a good read and digest, many thanks.

[Gavin Liddiard]

I suggest you look at the MTB-MP1 point motor found here: link

I fitted 40 of these last summer to replace unreliable Peco PL10 solenoid motors on my club's layout Mauch Chunk.

They are a slow acting motorised point motors that incorporate an accessory switch that can be used to change frog polarity if needed.

They are very easy to fit as they have plenty of adjustment including the actuator rod that can slide up and down so there's no need to cut it above the point, as is needed with many other point motors.

You do need to remove the detent spring from the point as it's not needed with this point motor.

To fit route leds on a control panel you should look at the post of a Czech blogger who shows how to add lights into the switching circuit of these motors: link.

[JimFin]

A different approach would be to use servo motors for both signals and points. I have an analogue layout with mimic board and use stud and wander lead rather than toggle switches but to same effect with section switches and LED's showing track power.

 

I have used the ESU Servo pilot controllers which run 4 servos each and they run happily on 12v. They have pins to hard wire for analogue operation and the control for start point, end point and speed of sweep is built into the controller with push buttons.

 

In my case the servos are mounted under the board and have an 8mm hole under the point centred on the mid point of the tie. The servo is held by a bracket and actuator extended with stiff wire into the tie bar. There are variants of the brackets with micro switch options for frog polarity switching if that was a feature you wanted and could be used with a feed back to your mimic board to show the routes.

 

It would be equally possible to mount them above board concealed in a structure and use wire in tube to actuate.

 

If at some point you wanted to convert these to DCC, just plug in your command station and assign a number to each point.

 

http://www.esu.eu/en/products/former-products/switchpilot-servo/

 

 

 

[delticfan]

Thanks chaps, information overload so I’m going to spend a bit of time digesting you’re thoughts. I’m not electrical so need to think it through.

[RobinofLoxley]

For some of us cost might be relevant too. You can get SEEP PM2's for under a fiver each, but some of these other options are much pricier per unit.