Passenger numbers after lockdown easing: your experiences

[31A]

I haven't been on a train since March (which must certainly be a record for me) and until today neither had I been to a railway station or a pub since then, either.  But this afternoon I went to the Station Tap on York station to meet  a friend and enjoy a couple of pints whilst watching the passing trains.  The trains we saw were no more than about 20% or so full; the Cross Country and Trans Pennine (Class 185 formed) trains that we saw were 'double units' presumably to allow for social distancing.  Having said that, there were more people about on the station than I'd expected, and virtually everyone we saw on the station was wearing face covering.  Masks aren't required in the pub area (obviously) and when we left I forgot to put mine on.  I wondered why I seemed to be getting black looks and had walked back as far as the footbridge before I realised my error!

 

[SM42]

The loadings on trains I see going by the window in Birmingham (Cross Country servics mainly) seem to vary for reasons that defy explanation.

 

Trains at traditional work day travel times are empty, maybe around 20 on there at best. Trains at other rather bizarre times seem to be a lot fuller. Around 1730hrs on a Saturday seems to be peak loading now. Perhaps it's time to go home for tea after a hard days shopping.

 

As a rule though and by nothing more than a rough count as they swish past  I would say most trains are between 10 and 25% loaded (in relation to total seats on board) with the occasional one pushing the 50% mark.

 

It is certainly a lot different to the beginning of April when the train crew  were in the majority.

 

Andy

[phil-b259]

On 02/08/2020 at 19:52, bazjones1711 said:

I have been catching the train to work and back all through this pandemic , passenger numbers were next to nothing , with car parks at Pengam etc..that once were full with commuters to Cardiff now empty , since the relaxing of the lock down this has remained virtually the same , either people are using their cars or still working from home , the trains have now been lengthened to 4 car units in the last few weeks to account for social distancing , with seats now out of use and mandatory face coverings . Whilst the trains still  remain for the use of key workers and essential travel only , along with myself and 3 - 5 people daily use it for this purpose , the rest of the time it is used by teenagers and kids with bikes , drinking  etc... to travel around on with no restrictions in place  ( masks etc... ) guards just let them travel . The stickers on the platforms about staying 2 meters apart are ripped up , plastic signs are ripped down , seat covers for out of use seating are removed , thrown around  , bottles of drink  rolling around , so whist i adhere to the rules , seems most others disregard everything , the only people i can blame are the youngsters for all this , so  it is possible it is the youngsters that are spreading the virus around without any care or thought for anyone else , so a ban on non essential travel would be welcome but how enforceable it would be remains as nearly 5 months of this nothing as yet has been done to stop non essential travel so far .

It’s easy to blame the young - but it doesn’t help that many of the usual things to keep them busy (Schools, youth clubs, parks, cinemas, etc) have been shut for so long, yet many parents are trying to work from home with the disruptions that causes.

 

You know the saying they devil makes work for idle hands’ never was that more true when feeling with teenagers. If you don’t provide things to keep them occupied they will devise their own entertainment - which for many does involve doing things they are not supposed to be doing because of the excitement that comes from breaking rules.

 

Thats part of the reason we need to get them back to school / college in September.

[DCB]

On 03/08/2020 at 12:42, Edge said:

In a slight tangent to the conversation, I’m hoping to make a trip to the Ffestiniog in a week or two, but can only reach it by train

 

Because of the different standards which apply along the route because of the English welsh border and I am thoroughly uncertain about what to do

 

now I don’t want to take a key workers seat on the train, but I would also like to have my first day out since February. Does anyone actually understand what I should do?

 

We went to North Wales yesterday and it was surreal.  Porthmadoc  were crowded  with apparently no one taking the slightest notice of Covid in the town but the Welsh Highland was not running and while the FFestiniog was running it was using compartment coaches, not their more recent post 1950 open stock with three four wheel bug boxes, three bogie coaches and a brake van as the load for Linda or was it Blanche.   Only members of the same household are allowed in any one compartment, and each compartment was thoroughly cleaned after each trip before the fresh passengers boarded.  Trains ran only to Tanybwlch with a 0ne hour layover and a 2hr 45min round trip using 3 train sets.  We saw Linda  and Blanche and I think the third trains was hauled by one of the England 0-4-0s.

If that sort of precautions are needed what the hell are network rail doing running trains of open stock?  No way will you get me on a train or bus until I have had the vaccine. Other places we visited,  LLandudno was ridiculous with wall to wall people in the streets and bouncers restricting Charity shops to 10 people and queues outside supermarkets.  We stayed about 30 minutes.  LLanfair PG station is closed temporarily presumably due to covid but we got some pics of LlanfairPG station and Video of Linda and Blanche in action and of the Welspool and Llanfair train and pics of the new Corwen station so it was quite a nice couple of days, but no way would I risk a trip on "Public Transport," until this covid thing is over. 

Edited August 4, 2020 by DavidCBroad

[phil-b259]

43 minutes ago, DavidCBroad said:

 

We went to North Wales yesterday and it was surreal.  Porthmadoc  were crowded  with apparently no one taking the slightest notice of Covid in the town but the Welsh Highland was not running and while the FFestiniog was running it was using compartment coaches, not their more recent post 1950 open stock with three four wheel bug boxes, three bogie coaches and a brake van as the load for Linda or was it Blanche.   Only members of the same household are allowed in any one compartment, and each compartment was thoroughly cleaned after each trip before the fresh passengers boarded.  Trains ran only to Tanybwlch with a 0ne hour layover and a 2hr 45min round trip using 3 train sets.  We saw Linda  and Blanche and I think the third trains was hauled by one of the England 0-4-0s.

If that sort of precautions are needed what the hell are network rail doing running trains of open stock?  No way will you get me on a train or bus until I have had the vaccine. Other places we visited,  LLandudno was ridiculous with wall to wall people in the streets and bouncers restricting Charity shops to 10 people and queues outside supermarkets.  We stayed about 30 minutes.  LLanfair PG station is closed temporarily presumably due to covid but we got some pics of LlanfairPG station and Video of Linda and Blanche in action and of the Welspool and Llanfair train and pics of the new Corwen station so it was quite a nice couple of days, but no way would I risk a trip on "Public Transport," until this covid thing is over. 

(1) Network Rail DO NOT operate passenger trains!

 

(2) National Rail train operators can only use the stock they have - and compartment stock has long been extinct on the national network as security issues, accessability requirements plus the ability to accommodate standing passengers mean open stock has been preferred for several decades. Clovid 19 hasn’t suddenly magicked up a endless supply of compartment only trains so operators have had to make do with what they have got and hope people behave responsibly while on board.

 

(3) Heritage Railways are no different in that they can only use the stock they have. While some like the Ffestiniog or Bluebell may have a decent selection of compartment stock they can use, other railways operational fleets mainly consist of open coaches and like national rail operators other measures must be employed.
 

(4) While there are justifiable questions / concerns over the behaviour of the public - only an idiot would believe that people can be made to stay at home for months, if not a year or more while we await a vaccine or other ‘cure’ for the Pandemic. Right from the start of lockdown all the experts in human behaviours said that eventually folk would get fed up with social distancing as humans are fundamentally social beings who enjoy being in close contact with others (hence the delay in implementing the lockdown in the first place). What we are seeing now is the entirely predictable result of people been stuck at home for months on end and with limited options to go away now lockdown has been eased. You can huff and puff about it as much as you like but thats not going to change the fundamentals or stop people trying to enjoy themselves.
 

(5) Also you cannot ignore the fact that having everyone confined to home as it were was crippling the nations finances! The Government cannot carry on paying for empty trains to be run or shop staff to sit at home for a prolonged period while at the same time seeing tax revenues nosedive and a whole generation have their educational / employment prospects ruined. As such the country simply HAS to get back to a large degree of normality - which is inevitably going to mean that excessive social distancing / avoiding travel is going to have to stop.

Edited August 4, 2020 by phil-b259

[rockershovel]

10 hours ago, Nearholmer said:

One person per carriage?

 

Two family groups per open bogie carriage, with alternate areas taped off. 

[Wickham Green too]

9 hours ago, phil-b259 said:

......... The Government cannot carry on paying for empty trains to be run or shop staff to sit at home for a prolonged period while at the same time seeing tax revenues nosedive and a whole generation have their educational / employment prospects ruined. As such the country simply HAS to get back to a large degree of normality - which is inevitably going to mean that excessive social distancing / avoiding travel is going to have to stop.

Then the Government can go back to counting a spiralling covid-wave, reopening the Nightingale Hospitals and wondering why the NHS - not to mention the care home sector - is running out of PPE it can't afford.

As has been mentioned before on this thread, it's an impossible balancing act.

[Nearholmer]

I'm the one who keeps banging-on about it being a balancing act, and it really is, but even I think that an awful lot of people are behaving in ways that are negligently lacking in simple caution in public places, and I suspect in their homes and gardens too, by herding-together, not taking even the barest precautions.

 

I'm not thinking of teenagers, because as has been said above they are bordering on a lost cause when it comes to this sort of thing, and most of them will soon be back at school/college soon anyway; I'm thinking of adults (of all ages, shapes and sizes) who are old enough to know/do better, but don't.

 

A great deal of this is down to human nature and the special obstinance/selfishness of the British when it comes to following instructions for the wider good (the flip-side of "rugged independence"), but some of it is, IMO, down to poor messaging by HMG. I think there are now TV ad campaigns, but the whole of Government communication has been weedy ........ where are the good. clear posters on every street corner, the radio announcements, the hard-hitting (not nicey, nicey) newspaper ads, the stuff in languages other than English etc. etc.

 

Our approach as a family of mum, dad and two children (one about to become a teenager, and exhibiting plenty of the typical behaviours) is to avoid indoor public places unless absolutely essential (the supermarket, one of us, once a week, basically), and to steer clear of outdoor places where 2m starts to come under pressure (some local parks and "the wrong kind of beaches"). Luckily we can both do our work from home. Beyond that, wash hands frequently, and hope for the best.

 

Edited August 5, 2020 by Nearholmer

[phil-b259]

8 hours ago, Wickham Green too said:

Then the Government can go back to counting a spiralling covid-wave, reopening the Nightingale Hospitals and wondering why the NHS - not to mention the care home sector - is running out of PPE it can't afford.

As has been mentioned before on this thread, it's an impossible balancing act.

 

Its worth remembering that the whole point of the lockdown was NOT to stop people catching Covid-19!

 

The lockdown was ONLY to enable the NHS to cope with the predicted workload which would arise including the need for mass ventilation of those suffering from the virus. However as we learnt more about the virus it transpired that fewer people needed ventilators than initially thought - that plus other factors means the NHS may well be able to cope with a higher infection rate than previously thought.

 

As such it then follows that an easing of lockdown and the increase in infection rates may not be as disastrous as some are making out - provided the NHS can cope with the number of serious cases then the goal should be for the nation to try and operate as normally as possible, thus trying to keep the economy going and education delivered to all age groups.

[Wickham Green too]

It's worth remembering that if YOU get serious complications from a covid-19 infection you might regret it ! - as would the rest of us if we caught it ...... however well the NHS was coping overall and the economy booming.

[Nearholmer]

3 hours ago, phil-b259 said:

increase in infection rates may not be as disastrous as some are making out

 

My reading of the situation is quite the opposite: that a significant increase in the incidence of infection would over-top NHS capacity in the coming winter, which is why everyone is so twitchy about getting "test and trace" right, why some "lockdown easing" has been postponed, and why "local lockdowns" are being applied to prevent the thing running amok right across Britain again.

 

Read the government-sponsored academic opinion here 

https://www.gov.uk/government/publications/covid-19-preparing-for-a-challenging-winter-202021-7-july-2020

 

Whether the incidence of infection is at a level now  that threatens to over-top NHS capacity is a different question.

 

If you look at the figures at "national average" level, it doesn't seem to be. But, if you look place-by-place, in some areas the incidence of infection is many times the national average and must be seriously stretching local hospitals already, hence the "local lockdowns", more of which must be just around the corner.

 

And, there doesn't seem to be much if any margin to allow for the affects of re-opening schools or of many more people returning to their usual workplaces. 

 

Getting back to the subject of the thread for a millisecond, medium-to-long distance commuting into London by large numbers of people looks like particularly bad idea right now, because there are several places from which large numbers of people would usually commute which have much higher-than-average incidences of infection.

 

As a "not such good news" PS, from what I can work out, during the earlier peak in infections the NHS was not as good at treating (by which I mean "saving") "hospital cases" as the health services in some other countries. A relatively high proportion of hospital cases in the UK ended in fatality. There could be a host of reasons for that, but it suggests that the NHS was in fact "over-topped" then. The fact that the Nightingale Hospitals were barely used was possibly because they were actually the wrong tool for the job, which turned out to be intensive treatment of people with a really complex systemic illness, and because staffing capacity for intensive care was consumed within the pre-existing hospitals.

Edited August 5, 2020 by Nearholmer

[phil-b259]

11 hours ago, Wickham Green too said:

It's worth remembering that if YOU get serious complications from a covid-19 infection you might regret it ! - as would the rest of us if we caught it ...... however well the NHS was coping overall and the economy booming.

That goes without saying - but the whole point of Government is managing the country for the best interests of the majority. Keeping everyone sat at home is ‘just in case’ not sustainable*.
 

That means not just keeping people healthy / Covid free, but also enabling them to be educated, earn money to sustain themselves and generate tax revenue to support those recieving NHS care.

 

It is I admit a difficult balancing act and the Government have not always got things right, but that does not mean the tightrope they are trying to walk is not sound.
 

 

* Personally I have been working throughout and am not in a position to sit at home doing nothing unless the rail network is completely shut down to ALL traffic.

Edited August 6, 2020 by phil-b259

[phil-b259]

1 hour ago, Nearholmer said:

 

My reading of the situation is quite the opposite: that a significant increase in the incidence of infection would over-top NHS capacity in the coming winter, which is why everyone is so twitchy about getting "test and trace" right, why some "lockdown easing" has been postponed, and why "local lockdowns" are being applied to prevent the thing running amok right across Britain again.

 

Read the government-sponsored academic opinion here 

https://www.gov.uk/government/publications/covid-19-preparing-for-a-challenging-winter-202021-7-july-2020

 

Whether the incidence of infection is at a level now  that threatens to over-top NHS capacity is a different question.

 

If you look at the figures at "national average" level, it doesn't seem to be. But, if you look place-by-place, in some areas the incidence of infection is many times the national average and must be seriously stretching local hospitals already, hence the "local lockdowns", more of which must be just around the corner.

 

And, there doesn't seem to be much if any margin to allow for the affects of re-opening schools or of many more people returning to their usual workplaces. 

 

Getting back to the subject of the thread for a millisecond, medium-to-long distance commuting into London by large numbers of people looks like particularly bad idea right now, because there are several places from which large numbers of people would usually commute which have much higher-than-average incidences of infection.

 

As a "not such good news" PS, from what I can work out, during the earlier peak in infections the NHS was not as good at treating (by which I mean "saving") "hospital cases" as the health services in some other countries. A relatively high proportion of hospital cases in the UK ended in fatality. There could be a host of reasons for that, but it suggests that the NHS was in fact "over-topped" then. The fact that the Nightingale Hospitals were barely used was possibly because they were actually the wrong tool for the job, which turned out to be intensive treatment of people with a really complex systemic illness, and because staffing capacity for intensive care was consumed within the pre-existing hospitals.

You make some sound points there - but I draw attention to my use of the word “may”

 

I would also suggest there is an element of scare tactics going on (for good and genuine reasons I hasten to add). IF the traditional winter flu turns out to be particularly virulent this year that will have significant  implications on the ability of the NHS to deal with a big rise in Covid cases.
 

As such it helps to play up the seriousness in an effort to (1) get people used to local lockdowns and (2) to make sure they get the flu jab. It also helps in trying to deal with the vast amount of misinformation or downright lies which are circulating on social media.

[rockershovel]

I thought the Nightingale Hospitals were a classic example of the strengths, and weaknesses of both the government, and the Army. They looked good on tv, made good press... and that was about it, really. They seem to have consumed a lot of resources to no real purpose. The Army did a great job of setting them up, which you might expect; they couldn’t provide the specialist equipment and staff, and there’s no reason they could, or should have been expected to do so. 

 

I see today in the press that the UK is far behind Europe in getting people back to work. This doesn’t much surprise me, either. One of the things you come to realise, working outside the U.K. is the frighteningly low proportion of the employed population actually employed in productive output. 

[Joseph_Pestell]

2 hours ago, rockershovel said:

I thought the Nightingale Hospitals were a classic example of the strengths, and weaknesses of both the government, and the Army. They looked good on tv, made good press... and that was about it, really. They seem to have consumed a lot of resources to no real purpose. The Army did a great job of setting them up, which you might expect; they couldn’t provide the specialist equipment and staff, and there’s no reason they could, or should have been expected to do so. 

 

I see today in the press that the UK is far behind Europe in getting people back to work. This doesn’t much surprise me, either. One of the things you come to realise, working outside the U.K. is the frighteningly low proportion of the employed population actually employed in productive output. 

 

I think that is unfair in relation to the Nightingale Hospitals. What would you have said if the incidence of Covid infections and admissions had turned out to be a bit higher and the NHS critical care capacity had been overwhelmed? There is "real purpose" in preparing for the worst. They could be needed yet with Covid still very much on the increase across the World. We can't isolate ourselves completely.

 

For me, the big Govt failure has been in testing, tracking and tracing. Usual complete Govt IT c**k up. Why try to reinvent this particular wheel when various nations already had proven systems? We can not get back to any sort of "normal" until this is sorted.

 

There are any number of businesses that closed down during lockdown that did not need to and have been slow to restart. Government should have been much more selective about the furlough scheme and who it applied to.

[Nearholmer]

Yes, I agree that criticism over the Nightingale Hospitals wouldn’t be fair.

 

My uninformed assumption is that they were based on a pre-existing contingency plan, not dreamed up on the spur of the moment, and that that plan was necessarily based on expectations about needs based on things like swine flu etc, which Create slightly different needs from the present beast.

 

Whether they will actually be (a) staffable, and (b) practically useful in ‘mass outbreak’, I think remain moot, but having them available is still a positive. They might, for instance, be useable for people who are ‘over the worst’, but still need medical support, thereby freeing space at core hospitals for the most acutely I’ll who need to be near every single bit of fancy kit and every super-knowledgable medic.

 

 

[RJS1977]

The main issue I have with the 'Nightingale Hospitals' is that once they were up and running - why weren't all new Covid cases in the local area sent there rather than to existing hospitals? (e.g. London had a Nightingale Hospital but the Prime Minister was treated at St Thomas's). Minimising the number of covid cases in regular hospitals where possible would limit the risk of cross-infection in those hospitals (I read a BBC article a while back which referred to a report saying 20% of cases treated in NHS hospitals were patients who had come in for something else and caught Covid in hospital - which if true is a serious failure by the NHS to keep Covid and non-covid patients, staff and facilities separate).

[Nearholmer]

11 minutes ago, RJS1977 said:

why weren't all new Covid cases in the local area sent there rather than to existing hospitals?

I wondered that at the time, and my reading is that they weren’t staffed or equipped to deal with the complexities of the illness in its most severe form, which is a really nasty systemic illness so needs the full gamut of ICU, labs, kidney dialysis, top specialist nurses and doctors etc etc.
 

They seem to have been scoped to deal with a high volume of people With “a respiratory illness”, in need of lesser amounts of support than Hospitalised COVID patients actually need. In short, the illness isn’t the one that was foreseen.

 

Other countries seem to have hit the same issue, but quite a few other countries had higher numbers of pre-existing ICU facilities per capita than the UK.
 

But, doubtless we will find out the full/correct story once a select committee has investigated the topic.
 

 

[rockershovel]

My “informed opinion” is mostly derived from my daughter and sister, both of whom work in the NHS.

 

Both were critical of the Nightingale policy, correctly identifying from the outset that the nature of the acute phase of the disease was complex and systemic. Both made the same prediction, that “excess deaths” would become the metric, because it confuses and obscures the (quite separate) issues of ACTUAL deaths FROM the infection, deaths where the infection appears on the Certificate (with, or without a test) as a contributory cause, deaths of patients whose unrelated specialist treatment has been compromised by the general upheaval. It also doesn’t require testing to have been completed, or even carried out. 

 

Both made a range of similar comments regarding the nature of the disease. They both referred to Exercise Cygnus, which had been an issue in medical circles for some time and is an instructive piece of background reading. 

 

Long-term care of elderly and infirm patients, within or outwith the NHS is hardly a new topic. 

 

One thing I do know from personal experience, is that it was known from the outset that there were significant hot-spots in areas like Birmingham and the NW. I had a colleague at the time from Birmingham, and he was very distressed about the prospect of a local lock-down (which didn’t happen at that time). LHR was still running full services to Iran and Pakistan, among other places, after others had suspended them as high-risk. 

 

 

The crux of the matter appears to be that most of the problems had been more-or-less foreseen, or identified in other countries, but not acted upon. 

 

 

Boris Johnson likes to think he is Winston Churchill, we are told. He seems to be mostly demonstrating one of the Great Man’s lesser-known aphorisms from 1940 - “our enemies are organised for the conduct of total war. We are only organised for the conduct of party politics”. I don’t offer this as a specific criticism of the PM, because much of it rests at the feet of his predecessors, but it does highlight the lack of continuity within our system of governance generally. 

 

[John M Upton]

Interesting experience at Gatwick Airport just now as I changed trains.

 

I decided to go via the upper level to see if I could get a drink, no chance, all the shops still shut.

 

What I did notice was probably about a hundred or so travellers, mostly foreign nationals off two trains, very few face coverings in evidence...

[bazjones1711]

It’s easy to blame the young -

 

yes i do blame the young  , traveling home today  , when arriving at Bargoed about 6 -8 youngsters got on the train  , most with bikes   , no masks  , next stop Pengam again another load of youngsters get on  , some again with bikes , who try to use the front carriage doors , which are clearly marked out of use  , guard told them not to use these doors , to which they gave some verbal abuse , this in turn along with all the others who had got on  , ended up with the train departing 10 mins late due to these youngsters non compliance of social distance , no masks , two get off and train departs , only to get to Hengoed for more youngsters to get on with no masks  ... Yet we are told it is mandatory to wear masks  , but the word mandatory is obviously not meant for them , any older person on the train social distances , wears a mask and follows the rules  so why don't they , because they don't care about anyone else or themselves ..if it was they young who were suffering from  this virus don't you think the older generation of parents , grandparents would do their upmost to protect them . I have been working all through this pandemic , my job involves the packaging of masks for the protection of people working 6  and 7 day weeks , so there needs enforcement of no mask no travel , the trains i catch are still advertised for essential travel only and for key workers , obviously a 16 year old on his bike is essential ... i think not  !

 

Edited August 6, 2020 by bazjones1711

[Railpassion]

I was in Leeds last night. At rush hour (1730) there were about 50 people on platform 16 compared with 400 on a normal day. Later on around 2100 I counted 52 people on the Birmingham train and over 60 coming off a train from the south west. The station was not deserted but I would guess around 20% of normal. I'd say the city itself had only 20% of normal activity. 

 

Train travel is not that risky if masks are worn and I think capacity could go up to around 50% without too much difficulty. 

 

[phil-b259]

6 hours ago, bazjones1711 said:

It’s easy to blame the young -

 

yes i do blame the young  , traveling home today  , when arriving at Bargoed about 6 -8 youngsters got on the train  , most with bikes   , no masks  , next stop Pengam again another load of youngsters get on  , some again with bikes , who try to use the front carriage doors , which are clearly marked out of use  , guard told them not to use these doors , to which they gave some verbal abuse , this in turn along with all the others who had got on  , ended up with the train departing 10 mins late due to these youngsters non compliance of social distance , no masks , two get off and train departs , only to get to Hengoed for more youngsters to get on with no masks  ... Yet we are told it is mandatory to wear masks  , but the word mandatory is obviously not meant for them , any older person on the train social distances , wears a mask and follows the rules  so why don't they , because they don't care about anyone else or themselves ..if it was they young who were suffering from  this virus don't you think the older generation of parents , grandparents would do their upmost to protect them . I have been working all through this pandemic , my job involves the packaging of masks for the protection of people working 6  and 7 day weeks , so there needs enforcement of no mask no travel , the trains i catch are still advertised for essential travel only and for key workers , obviously a 16 year old on his bike is essential ... i think not  !

 

While I’m not condoning bad behaviour, what exactly do you think teenagers should be doing at the moment?

 

I repeat, bored youngsters are going to make their own entertainment whether you like it or not! That will frequently descend into doing things that are ‘not allowed’ by adults as it stokes the feelings of excitement / rebellion naturally present at that stage of life.

 

If you want to prevent such anti social behaviour then it has been proved many times you need to provide safe places for teenagers to gather and enjoy themselves like youth clubs, after school activities, sports clubs, etc - i.e. all things which Covid has put a stop to happening for months now. Plenty of youth workers have spoken how teenagers are in significant danger of being recruited by gangs or groomed for sex and theft because they have nowhere to go and nothing to do, while those who exploit them can offer excitement and a sense of purpose.

 

This is yet another example of why strict Lockdowns are no good for anything other than short periods. Yes it may we’ll have saved lives but it’s incredibly naive to assume that such drastic action will not have a significantly detrimental effect to many other aspects of society - in this case bad behaviour by youngsters.

 

 

[RJS1977]

13 hours ago, Railpassion said:

I was in Leeds last night. At rush hour (1730) there were about 50 people on platform 16 compared with 400 on a normal day. Later on around 2100 I counted 52 people on the Birmingham train and over 60 coming off a train from the south west. The station was not deserted but I would guess around 20% of normal. I'd say the city itself had only 20% of normal activity. 

 

Train travel is not that risky if masks are worn and I think capacity could go up to around 50% without too much difficulty. 

 

 

And according to RSSB it's not even all that risky even if they aren't worn...

[EmporiaSub]

I've been travelling on Southern's West Coastway service throughout the period.

From having a coach to myself in the early days, now you are lucky, during the off-peak, to get either a bay or two airline style seats to yourself, with many standing, so as to social distance.

As for masks, it's probably about 75% compliance, that other 25% probably being split 15% youngsters and 10% older people.