EFE Rail launches

[mdvle]

On 07/08/2020 at 10:51, Ron Ron Ron said:

 

Do you think it really was like that, or is it just an established urban myth?

 

.

 

I can't comment on the UK market, but certainly in the US it was/is urban myth that things were always available.

 

In the US the "bible" of products was the annual Walthers catalog, which until about 20 years ago listed pretty much everything available that was mass produced - and anyone honest will remember that for a lot of the major items like diesels there was always a disclaimer that availability couldn't be guaranteed - for the simple reason that there was no hurry to suddenly make more until demand built up again because the production line could be more profitably used to make something else.

[mdvle]

On 07/08/2020 at 15:51, MarkSG said:

It was like that. For a lot of things, it still is. If you own the factory, then you can run it as a continuous production line, with supply broadly keeping up with demand. Cars are still made like that,

 

I suspect that is an oversimplification that doesn't really reflect reality.  Yes, the car makers run assembly lines, but they aren't for 12 months churning out product A - rather they churn out the basic A, and then they switch to the deluxe version of A, and then the super deluxe version for another several months, and all of that is subdivided by colour and other things.  Hence the reason why if you look at a catalog and decide you want a certain car in a certain colour with certain options you may well be told sorry but it is out of stock with no more to be made until the next model year (or if you are lucky the dealer calls around/checks the computer and finds one in stock elsewhere and arranges for it to be shipped).

 

On 07/08/2020 at 15:51, MarkSG said:

and so are the sort of things you buy from Ikea and B&Q. Once it starts to be made it carries on being made until it's discontinued.

 

Again, doubtful.  Ikea puts in an order for a quarter worth of stock of item X, and it gets made - and then the production line shifts to the next product for the upcoming quarter.  Even for a good selling product to have a dedicated 12 month production line would be woefully inefficient and thus expensive.

 

On 07/08/2020 at 15:51, MarkSG said:

Some model railway products are still done like that. I'm pretty sure it's how Peco keeps the supply of track going year after year after year, for example.

 

My suspicion is that their production line alternatives between products as necessary, with a risk that they can run out of product temporarily if a sudden surge in orders happens.

[Oldddudders]

I bought a number of Walthers catalogues over the years. It was like Argos on steroids, more like a home-shopping catalogue loved by so many ladies in the UK.

 

The nearest UK equivalent in our hobby was the W&H catalogue, packed full of all sorts of exotic stuff - much of which, particularly from overseas brands, was seldom anywhere near W&H's shop!

[TomScrut]

6 hours ago, The Stationmaster said:

Nothing new there.  In fact I've already referred to it in this thread - on the page linked below.  In fact at last publication of detailed information Mr Kenneth Ting owned every share in Bachmann Europe except for 2. yes, two - out of a paid up share capital of over 2 million shares.  So he personally (and not Kader, of which he is still the Chairman and the largest shareholder) owns in excess off 99.99% of Bachmann Europe.

 

https://www.rmweb.co.uk/community/index.php?/topic/157035-efe-rail-launches/page/13/

 

 

9 hours ago, adb968008 said:

who owns Bachmann ?

 

Which given between him and his family they pretty much own Kader too, I'd expect that in reality the change in share ownership is probably to do with isolating the companies from each other on paper for whatever reason rather than a practicality of the day to day running of the business.

 

So whilst it's interesting information I'd expect Bachmann's hands would be tied in terms of where they are supposed to be getting stuff made as a rule of thumb. I'm sure most of us would want the same if we were in control of both companies (as a generalisation without knowing specifics)

[rembrow]

In respect of the latest versions of the Austerity/J94, do we know if the changed motor from the original fitted to the DJ version has solved the 'cogging' problem that several contributors to this and other forums reported, with the DJ Models all wheel drive system fitted to their steam outline models. The Austerity/J94 and Hattons 14xx models seem to have been the worse affected. The problem exhibited itself when the models were run down an incline, worse with a rear load of wagons, where there was stuttering or 'cogging' in the loco movement, primarily at low speed, which is how Austerities are going to work. With Austerities used in coal industry settings, likely to be run on layouts with inclines, this seems to be an issue that needs to have been addressed.

Albion Yard did a strip down of the Austerity drive system, testing at each stage and came to the conclusion it was likely to be a combination of play in the drive train and play in the worm and 1st gear. I've attached a link to their article:

https://albionyard.wordpress.com/2017/08/21/removals/

 

I remember Captain Kernow of this parish, decided to replace the chassis on his 14xx with an alternative to try and resolve the issue.

[The Stationmaster]

1 hour ago, TomScrut said:

 

 

Which given between him and his family they pretty much own Kader too, I'd expect that in reality the change in share ownership is probably to do with isolating the companies from each other on paper for whatever reason rather than a practicality of the day to day running of the business.

 

So whilst it's interesting information I'd expect Bachmann's hands would be tied in terms of where they are supposed to be getting stuff made as a rule of thumb. I'm sure most of us would want the same if we were in control of both companies (as a generalisation without knowing specifics)

There might be more to it than that?  But whether there is or isn't the senior Mr Ting ensured a few years back that he has full control of one of what was Kader's model railway businesses.   Kader is a lot more than a model railway and toy manufacturing business although - when in profit - that area has at times contributed the lion's share of the company's income.  Judging by one previous company report its sales to the USA models & toy market massively exceeds it sales into the UK & Europe so it no doubt concentrates its efforts for that market.

 

The group has a total of 7 subsidiaries involved in the manufacture and trading of toys and models two of them being manufacturers (Kader Industrial in HK and Dongguan Feng Da Electronics in Guangdong Province in the PRC) while the other 6 (including Bachmann Europe in the UK and Bachmann Industries in the USA - these two own the various model railway brands) are basically trading companies.  But beyond that Kader Group is involved in property, investment holdings - e.g Sanda Kan (Cayman III), and even a share of a resort management & property development company in the USA.  Thus its interests/holdings have for some time past been spread well beyond  Hong Kong.

[TomScrut]

49 minutes ago, The Stationmaster said:

There might be more to it than that?  But whether there is or isn't the senior Mr Ting ensured a few years back that he has full control of one of what was Kader's model railway businesses.   Kader is a lot more than a model railway and toy manufacturing business although - when in profit - that area has at times contributed the lion's share of the company's income.  Judging by one previous company report its sales to the USA models & toy market massively exceeds it sales into the UK & Europe so it no doubt concentrates its efforts for that market.

 

The group has a total of 7 subsidiaries involved in the manufacture and trading of toys and models two of them being manufacturers (Kader Industrial in HK and Dongguan Feng Da Electronics in Guangdong Province in the PRC) while the other 6 (including Bachmann Europe in the UK and Bachmann Industries in the USA - these two own the various model railway brands) are basically trading companies.  But beyond that Kader Group is involved in property, investment holdings - e.g Sanda Kan (Cayman III), and even a share of a resort management & property development company in the USA.  Thus its interests/holdings have for some time past been spread well beyond  Hong Kong.

 

I aren't sure how what I said disagrees with what you have replied with. If one bloke is pretty much in charge is he likely to encourage one company to work with another to maximise profit between the two where practical. The reasoning behind the transfer of shares could be for all sorts of reasons but I doubt the Bachmann-Kader working relationship is directly to do with it.

 

On the other hand it maybe does get them around some possible corporate governance that dictates the use of internal facilities and allows external factories such as in the EFE Rail brand. But I'd be very surprised if that was the reason the ownership changed.

Edited August 9, 2020 by TomScrut

[rembrow]

I've had a reply from the Bachmann Collector's Club about the J94/Austerity and the prior technical problem with the DJ Models version, regarding 'cogging' on inclines. I can't copy it here as I didn't ask for permission to, however they have advised that they have tested several of the models, on both flat and inclined track, with and without loads and found all models to be free running. Also of interest maybe that I was advised that review samples have been distributed to the model press and dispatch to retail will start next week. 

[scottystitch]

On 09/08/2020 at 08:29, Oldddudders said:

I bought a number of Walthers catalogues over the years. It was like Argos on steroids, more like a home-shopping catalogue loved by so many ladies in the UK.

 

The nearest UK equivalent in our hobby was the W&H catalogue, packed full of all sorts of exotic stuff - much of which, particularly from overseas brands, was seldom anywhere near W&H's shop!

 

Ripmax used to issue a catalogue not unlike you describe.  Even as an adult it illicited many ooohs and aaaahs!

 

I'm not sure if it still exists or if everything is now online.

 

I never did get that large scale RC Cessna 172...

 

Best

 

Scott.

[Scottish Modeller]

On 09/08/2020 at 08:29, Oldddudders said:

The nearest UK equivalent in our hobby was the W&H catalogue, packed full of all sorts of exotic stuff - much of which, particularly from overseas brands, was seldom anywhere near W&H's shop!

Hi all,

 

I used to love reading through the W & H catalogue......

 

I learned so much about the hobby and history of the makers plus origins of a lot of the stuff on the market.

 

I wish there  was sonmething similar available currently.

 

Thanks

Phil H

[Jeff Smith]

The Walthers catalog was the go-to for hobby shops over here.  If the shop didn't stock an item they ordered it from Walthers......  However when I checked some Peco items they were cheaper elswhere!

[Geoff Endacott]

On 13/08/2020 at 15:44, scottystitch said:

 

Ripmax used to issue a catalogue not unlike you describe.  Even as an adult it illicited many ooohs and aaaahs!

 

Beatties used to issue a catalogue of RTR models which could be updated by adding extra pages and stickers. I am a life member of the Beatties Club. Fortunately my life has been rather longer than that of the aforementioned company.

 

Geoff Endacott

[Paul.Uni]

According to the Bachmann website, the following has arrived at Bachmann:

• OO gauge J94/Austerity
• OO gauge Hymek
• N gauge Class 17

[Trains4U]

16 hours ago, Paul.Uni said:

According to the Bachmann website, the following has arrived at Bachmann:

• OO gauge J94/Austerity
• OO gauge Hymek
• N gauge Class 17

 

Better than that, they’ve arrived in the shops (well, mine at least)

we are working to get them online this afternoon 

 

the JIA and PBA hoppers have also been delivered

 

 

Edited August 18, 2020 by Trains4U

[meatloaf]

3 minutes ago, Trains4U said:

 

Better than that, they’ve arrived in the shops (well, mine at least)

we are working to get them online this afternoon 

 

the JIA and PBA hoppers have also been delivered

 

 

Have you had the j94 tanks?

[Trains4U]

Yes - though only a small selection, I want to assess quality first, and they aren’t cheap!

[D400]

56 minutes ago, Trains4U said:

 

Better than that, they’ve arrived in the shops (well, mine at least)

we are working to get them online this afternoon 

 

the JIA and PBA hoppers have also been delivered

 

 

 

Any chance of posting some photographs when you get a chance? 

 

Very interested to see what differences if any these items have. 

 

Bruce

[adb968008]

Pictures on Kernows site...

 

best news is that nameplate on Waggoner doesnt look to be factory fitted !

http://www.kernowmodelrailcentre.com/p/68459/E85006-EFE-Rail-Class-J94-0-6-0-Steam-Locomotive-number-92
but the white walled tyres look a bit err...

NCB one... (can I call it Ice Cream livery ?)

http://www.kernowmodelrailcentre.com/p/68457/E85003-EFE-Rail-Class-J94-0-6-0-Steam-Locomotive-number-19

LMR looks good

http://www.kernowmodelrailcentre.com/p/68458/E85005-EFE-Rail-Class-J94-0-6-0-Steam-Locomotive-number-195

 

(Good candidate to replicate Dean Forests J94 152 Rennes).

 

 

 

Edited August 18, 2020 by adb968008

[Butler Henderson]

Rails have the Austerities and Hymeks discounted with free postage so making them a smidge cheaper 

['CHARD]

The weathered 'AMAZON'  NCB Austerity looks very tasty indeed.  I don't normally invoke Rule One but perhaps with some  Narrow Planet plates I could wrangle a Lothian engine out of her.

[Trains4U]

Sooo

 

The packaging is bright!

 

 

for any avoidance of doubt as to who owns the tooling...

 

 

The  J94 has been reworked.

 

 

only the smokebix door is removable, as opposed to the whole front of the DJ model. It needed a bit of coaxing with a blade.

the next18 socket replaces the 6 pin version.

 

 

 

It has a much beefier motor and runs more like a Bachmann loco. The motor of the DJ model was buzzy and tinny, the EFE version is definitely beefier.

 

I tried to open it up, but it wasn’t giving up its secrets, it seemed like the motor was attached to the chassis, rather than the body, but the diagram indicates otherwise.

it still has geared wheelsets, so cogging may be an issue (I don’t have a gradient to test it on)

 

The 17 looks nice

 

 

 

 

next 18 socket in the fuel tank (very easy!)

 

 

 

sound fitting would be a challenge!

 

 

If you can get the body off (I’m not even contemplating it), you could potentially get a sound decoder in the cab (but it would be visible)

and a sugarcube in the fuel tank

 

but rather you than me!

 

it runs nicely, comparable with Farish locos. All 4 axles are driven, headcode and tail lights work

 

a nice little engine.

 

 

Edited August 18, 2020 by Trains4U

[Trains4U]

Exploded diagram for the J94 showing body mounted motor and geared wheels

 

[Markn]

Any pics of the Hymek's? Are they just a spit of the Heljan models, or updated in anyway?

[Trains4U]

2 minutes ago, Markn said:

Any pics of the Hymek's? Are they just a spit of the Heljan models, or updated in anyway?

 

It’s just a Heljan loco, in a differently coloured Heljan style box.

 

it has Heljan printed on the bogieframes

Edited August 18, 2020 by Trains4U

[Markn]

4 minutes ago, Trains4U said:

 

It’s just a Heljan loco, in a differently coloured Heljan style box.

 

it has Heljan printed on the bogieframes

Thank you