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The K's kit that never was; A BR Cartic


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I was recently looking for a middle bogie for the Triang Cartic. I had worked out that cannibalising a freightliner flat would get me a matching bogie, but it seemed a bit of a waste to trash a perfectly good model, ignoring its inaccuracies, just to get a bogie. so I looked around for alternatives, and came the the conclusion that the Cambrian C72 RideControl bogie was a reasonable lookalike.

 

https://www.pufferwillies-stm.co.uk/cambrian-c72-176-oo-scale-br-ride-control-bogies-16326-p.asp

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The photos of the Cartics shown on the links above clearly show a Cartic set with a vacuum pipe on the end which is why I mentioned it.

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The end photo in this link seems to show a vacuum pipe by the left buffer.

 

MAT90100 = 426A MAT Cartic 4 @ Stanlow 81-09-20 � Paul Bartlett w

 

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3 hours ago, roythebus said:

The end photo in this link seems to show a vacuum pipe by the left buffer.

 

MAT90100 = 426A MAT Cartic 4 @ Stanlow 81-09-20 � Paul Bartlett w

 

The diagrams show they had vac pipe. https://PaulBartlett.zenfolio.com/matcartic/e385f26bf in 1981, but removed by 1991 https://PaulBartlett.zenfolio.com/matcartic/e3b55008a

 

As to the bogie, they are 2metres, I think that Cambrian Ridemaster bogie would be too short, https://PaulBartlett.zenfolio.com/bogies/e24bdd201

Paul

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Thanks. Air brakes were't "the norm" when they were introduced. I seem to remember the first modern stock with air brakes only were the Freightliner wagons. there was a n open day at Willesden in the mid 1960s just after the juice was turned on to London and we were shown the new Freightliner depot at Willesden. The tour guide told us they were so smooth riding that a fitter sent his mate in Manchester a spanner on the bar coupling and it was still there when the train got to Manchester. BS or fact? :)

 

Edited by roythebus
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On 20/08/2020 at 22:04, Gibbo675 said:

Hi Folks,

 

These correct pattern bogies are available from @TangoOscarMike should you contact him:

 

 

Thanks Gibbo

 

Yes. I'm still tinkering with the design of the bogie. I can't help myself, for some reason. The latest version has slightly thicker (stronger) arms for the NEM pocket support. It also has sockets for top hat wheel bearings instead of built in bearings (although the plastic is very hard, so I'm not sure if this will make much difference).

 

@hayfield- on the strength of this topic I'll get this moving again. Let me know if you're interested and I'll make it a priority.

 

 

Cheers

Tom

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1 minute ago, TangoOscarMike said:

 

Thanks Gibbo

 

Yes. I'm still tinkering with the design of the bogie. I can't help myself, for some reason. The latest version has slightly thicker (stronger) arms for the NEM pocket support. It also has sockets for top hat wheel bearings instead of built in bearings (although the plastic is very hard, so I'm not sure if this will make much difference).

 

@hayfield- on the strength of this topic I'll get this moving again. Let me know if you're interested and I'll make it a priority.

 

 

Cheers

Tom

Hi Tom,

 

Thanks for the reply, unfortunately I haven't done anything about the rest of the Cartic-4 kit as this year has been a bit tight financially because buying a new van was more important than playing toy trains !

 

There are some minor alterations required to the main body of the kit to make it easier to build and I need to work out the etched brass details. Should anyone have experience of designing and producing etched parts, advice and assistance would be most welcome.

 

Gibbo.

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26 minutes ago, TangoOscarMike said:

 

Thanks Gibbo

 

Yes. I'm still tinkering with the design of the bogie. I can't help myself, for some reason. The latest version has slightly thicker (stronger) arms for the NEM pocket support. It also has sockets for top hat wheel bearings instead of built in bearings (although the plastic is very hard, so I'm not sure if this will make much difference).

 

@hayfield- on the strength of this topic I'll get this moving again. Let me know if you're interested and I'll make it a priority.

 

 

Cheers

Tom

 

Tom

 

My interest in this subject is limited to the k's model, having said this detailing it will be of importance to me and possibly converting it into a 3 or 4 car unit may be also of interest.

The first job will be to source a center bogie and build buffer beams, then make up some guard irons and chains. Doubt if it will ever run as not my era or interest, I do plan to have a display unit with one of everything in it.  Just a K's devotee 

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  • 3 months later...
On 23/08/2020 at 07:55, Gibbo675 said:

Hi Tom,

 

Thanks for the reply, unfortunately I haven't done anything about the rest of the Cartic-4 kit as this year has been a bit tight financially because buying a new van was more important than playing toy trains !

 

There are some minor alterations required to the main body of the kit to make it easier to build and I need to work out the etched brass details. Should anyone have experience of designing and producing etched parts, advice and assistance would be most welcome.

 

Gibbo.


 

For etched brass have a look at the PPD limited website, I am also looking to produce a caeprtic 4 and had the sides made of etched brass a few years ago but gave just made contact with York model making myself

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Brass etches are more complex as the parts need to remain on the sheet of the material so each part needs a gap crated around any section to be removed with tabs left in place to hold everything in place.

You then need to create a drawing which uses one colour where you want to etch on the front of the sheet

Another colour where you want a half depth etch on the front of the sheet

and finally a third colour where you want a half depth etch on the front of the sheet.

 

You then mirror the drawing so you have a front and back image removing the colours which are on the opposite side.

This gives the etches for the front of the sheet and the back of the sheet as separate images.

 

You then convert all the colours to Black an White.

 

Basically with acid etching each side of the sheet is half etched and where the etchings coincide on both sides you get a hole, if that make sense

 

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The Tri-ang  Hornby Cartic uses exactly the same bogies as the Tri-ang  Hornby Freightliner flats.

 

The centre bogie has a special moulding with two pillars to form the attachment points for each unit. This simply clips into the central hole for the bogie pivot...

 

Also there is no tension lock coupling fitted to the centre bogie. ;)

 

32A258C8-1078-4303-84B6-98DD1AE6FDD2.jpeg.311116da2fec688686f7bc0c93f9585e.jpeg
Photo edited from cypherman’s post above...



 

 

 

Edited by Ruffnut Thorston
Typo...photo added
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I've now got my spare Ks cartic bogie indoors along with a spare side frame. I'll take a photo of them before I post them to Hayfield tomorrow. :)

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On 23/08/2020 at 07:41, TangoOscarMike said:

 

Thanks Gibbo

 

Yes. I'm still tinkering with the design of the bogie. I can't help myself, for some reason. The latest version has slightly thicker (stronger) arms for the NEM pocket support. It also has sockets for top hat wheel bearings instead of built in bearings (although the plastic is very hard, so I'm not sure if this will make much difference).

 

@hayfield- on the strength of this topic I'll get this moving again. Let me know if you're interested and I'll make it a priority.

 

 

Cheers

Tom

Some photos here may help with shapes. http://www.norgrove.me.uk/freightliner/freightliner.htm

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  • hayfield changed the title to The K's kit that never was; A BR Cartic
On 26/11/2020 at 14:26, Grovenor said:

Some photos here may help with shapes. http://www.norgrove.me.uk/freightliner/freightliner.htm

Thanks Grovenor

 

In fact I completed the bogie model (based on Gibbo's drawings) some time ago. Making it generally available is being held up by modelling technicalities, specifically:

 

  • The 3D print works nicely with a built-in conical axle bearing. I've made a version with sockets for metal top-hat bearings, but I haven't tested it yet.
  • The NEM coupling pocket arrangement is a little flimsy.

 

Cheers

Tom

 

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  • 4 months later...

To re-awaken this thread, rummaging through my drawers like we all do at times I've for another 2 or 4 K's Cartic bogies unmade, and maybe the other odd one with stretcher plate that I sent to Hayfield a few months ago. there's also a Motorail name board as carried on the side of the wagon, and some new K's Motorail transfers! Still interested Hayfield?

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Noting that revolution trains are going to produce the cartic 4 in n gauge I wonder if they will follow up with a 00 gauge model

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2 hours ago, LongRail said:

Noting that revolution trains are going to produce the cartic 4 in n gauge I wonder if they will follow up with a 00 gauge model

I'd probably go for a couple of those if they did.

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