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Watering facilities for industrial steam


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Browsing through various albums of 'Southern and SouthWestern industrial steam' there is a paucity of images of watering facilities beyond the very occasional ground stanchion/hydrant with attached canvas hose, certainly no eleborate water crane - I suppose the relatively large amounts of water rapidly dispensed to mainline machines were just not needed. 

Similarly, coal seemed to be replenished by a low platform with a couple of small tubs that were man-handled through the cab doors - in the case of very small locos - nothing much larger than a W4.

 

Any thoughts or images?

 

Cheers and Stay Safe

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31 minutes ago, Jack Benson said:

Browsing through various albums of 'Southern and SouthWestern industrial steam' there is a paucity of images of watering facilities beyond the very occasional ground stanchion/hydrant with attached canvas hose, certainly no eleborate water crane - I suppose the relatively large amounts of water rapidly dispensed to mainline machines were just not needed. 

Similarly, coal seemed to be replenished by a low platform with a couple of small tubs that were man-handled through the cab doors - in the case of very small locos - nothing much larger than a W4.

 

Any thoughts or images?

 

Cheers and Stay Safe

Google: 'egg-end boiler High Gameshill farm images' :)

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  • RMweb Gold

Finding images of water and coal loco faciities on industrial systems can be a bit daunting, this is one of only two* images that feature a water supply. This was found in Dad's collection of oddities - no other data.

20200821_01a_800.jpg.dd40362bc7e90b00c701119215a01f5a.jpg

Whilst loading coal onto the footplate seems to a manual task involving steps, tubs etc. The steps are from Kotol.de as recommended by Mikkel.

 

l002.jpg.6e8b3abadfced037f03f28f6ab3020d9.jpg

 

 

87-678-2-1a.jpg.88ede0c20db6885c92d3e30eaa345695.jpg

 

For the record, in all the industrial albums, I cannot find an image of a loco being coaled.

 

*The other image involved just a pipe from a supply hidden in a hillside. No sign of control valve or any other apparatus.

 

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2 hours ago, Jack Benson said:

Finding images of water and coal loco faciities on industrial systems can be a bit daunting, this is one of only two* images that feature a water supply. This was found in Dad's collection of oddities - no other data.

20200821_01a_800.jpg.dd40362bc7e90b00c701119215a01f5a.jpg

Whilst loading coal onto the footplate seems to a manual task involving steps, tubs etc. The steps are from Kotol.de as recommended by Mikkel.

 

l002.jpg.6e8b3abadfced037f03f28f6ab3020d9.jpg

 

 

87-678-2-1a.jpg.88ede0c20db6885c92d3e30eaa345695.jpg

 

For the record, in all the industrial albums, I cannot find an image of a loco being coaled.

 

*The other image involved just a pipe from a supply hidden in a hillside. No sign of control valve or any other apparatus.

 

If you can get hold of copies of the excellent industrial loco albums thet Ian Allen published in the 70's, there are several excellent photographs of both watering and coaling at industrial sites.

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It is a subject that has interested me, and yes very rare to see coaling or watering facilities - and I look at photos on the IRS forum (which is open to all) and flicr - lots of industrials on there. 

 

I picked this up on the internet - apologies if someone objects to copyright infringement. It shows how simple they were, the tank as Paul Vigor mentions with a hose and valve from the base. I don't think you can separate storage and delivery in many instances. s-l1600.jpg.bf5a28910a3cfaf765c19abfa2666932.jpg

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Looking at the handful of books I have on UK industrial steam I found the following examples of engines being watered.

 

M.J. Fox and G.D. King, 'Industrial Steam Album', Ian Allan, 1970. SBN 7110 0714 X.

 

Page 22. Ex GWR 57xx 7754 being watered outside the loco shed at Elliot Colliery, New Tredegar (no date given, photo credit W.J. Shore). The hosepipe shown is I guess about 4 to 6 inches in diameter. The tank can't be seen. It looks like the supply runs through a metal pipe (maybe 2" in diameter) to a valve/tap and is supported off the ground by a simple metal post. The hosepipe is attached to the valve/tap.

Page 33. Andrew Barclay 0-6-0T N. 1245 of 1911 (NCB Fife area No. 10) at Methil colliery (no date given, photo credit M.J. Fox). Large diameter hosepipe attached to a water tank as per mainline examples.

Page 36. Hawthorn 'Holwell No.  3', Middle Peak Quarry, Wirksworth, Derbyshire (no date given, photo credit G.D. King). This is an interesting one. The engine is being watered inside the shed from a large metal pipe supported from the wooden beams of the shed roof. The pipe is about 6" in diameter and a shed or loco crewman is standing on the engine controlling the flow with a valve wheel (not sure of the correct terminology for this if I'm being honest). It's not entirely clear from the photo but it looks as though there is a short length of hose attached to the end of the pipe with a slightly smaller diameter to enable the water to be supplied to the engine tank.

Page 39. Hunslet Austerity (HE 3818/1954), NCB Fife Area No. 19, Methil Colliery (no date given, photo credit M.J. Fox). I'm guessing this is an alternative view of the facility shown on page 22. Again it shows a large diameter hosepipe coming from the water tank which looks to be a substantial affair with a brick base supporting a metal framework which cradles what looks to be a cylindrical tank. Also on page 39. Andrew Barclay, 0-6-0T 2067 of 1939 at East Weymyss, Weymyss private railway (no date given, photo credit M.J. Fox). Two large diameter hosepipes (circa 6" diameter) are shown servicing two parallel sidings. The tank is a cylinder on a substantial two story brick building/base. The pipe servicing the furthest from the tank is supported by a rather Heath-Robinsonesque metal frame which appears to incorporate a crude metal box/old domestic watertank. Not sure what's going on here but the whole set up would make a rather wonderful model.

 

Colin T. Gifford and Horace Gamble, 'Steam Railways in Industry', B.T. Batsford Limited, 1976 (1983 reprint). ISBN. 0 7134 3155 5.

 

Page 74. Two Jinties (47289 and 47629) on hire from BR at Williamsthorpe Colliery, Derbyshire (September 1967, photo credit Collin Gifford). The Jinties, line astern, appear to be being simultaneously watered. There are two narrow diameter hosepipes running to the engines from a large cylindrical watertank on a brick support. The caption describes them as being apparently 'one inch garden hoses'. The hose to the nearest engine runs along the ground while the hose to the rear is supported off the ground by an insubtsantial looking simple metal support. The caption states the Jinties were allocated to Westhouses shed and I think they must have been among the last few in BR service.

 

Roger Siviter, 'Industrial Steam in Action', Great Bear Publishing,  2005. ISBN 0-9541 150-5-8.

 

Page 38. Pecket No. 5 0-6-0ST, Birchenwood Gas and Coke Co. Ltd, Kidsgrove, North Staffordshire (June 20th 1972, photo credit Roger Siviter). A crewmember is shown standing on the tank feeding a narrow (circa 1" diameter) hosepipe into the loco from a large upright cylindrical tank mounted on a metal framework. Lots of close up detail useful for modelling in this shot.

 

Page 51. Hunset 0-6-0ST, works No. 3685 of 1948, Manvers Main Colliery, Wath-on-Dearne, NCB South Yorkshire Area (April 1970, photo credit Roger Siviter). A medium diameter hosepipe (circa 2" to 3") is being used. It is shown running along the ground, presumably from an offscene tank, then up a metal post (about 12 feet high) held in place with metal clips/brackets, with about 10 feet free running from the top.

 

Hope this is helpful. On a personal note the Roger Siviter book has a few more pictures of the Kidsgrove location from the early 70s. As a kid we often stayed down the road on family visits to relatives in Stoke-on-Trent. I wish I had known about it as I would have badgered Dad to take me to have a look, clutching my Kodak Instamatic.

Edited by Will Crompton
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  • RMweb Gold

The layout uses the excellent Bachmann small water tower, an appropriate device would be the simple addition of a pipe from the tower. Coaling via a simple wooden platform incorporating those excellent steps from Kotol.de.

 

The nondescript appearance of the Bachmann tower seems to ‘shout’ industrial.

 

Cheers and Stay Safe

 

5DD2D82B-2601-42D8-94C2-097D98C7FB78.jpeg.abdbe487e509499ae52d92a3115345fb.jpeg

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1 hour ago, hmrspaul said:

It is a subject that has interested me, and yes very rare to see coaling or watering facilities - and I look at photos on the IRS forum (which is open to all) and flicr - lots of industrials on there. 

 

I picked this up on the internet - apologies if someone objects to copyright infringement. It shows how simple they were, the tank as Paul Vigor mentions with a hose and valve from the base. I don't think you can separate storage and delivery in many instances. s-l1600.jpg.bf5a28910a3cfaf765c19abfa2666932.jpg

This is very typical of the facility in most of my local collieries. The tank is an old boiler looking at the end plates. A Google image search for Wheldale colliery/ austerity / Diana should show something similar. This is the arrangement I modelled on Frydale.

A photo is included under Sergeant Pepper.

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The hosepipe filling S134 was needed as Wheldale had been dieselized for a couple of years when Hunslet arranged their efficiency trial in the autumn of 1981. The harsh winter that followed saw steam in service until the following September as the diesels failed.

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"Visions of Steam - The Four Seasons of Steam in Industrial South Wales", Peter Cavalier and Geoff Silcock, has some wonderful atmospheric photos including a full page "Watering the Horse" photo showing filling a saddle tank from what looks like a standpipe, as well as a couple of smaller photos showing tanks being filled.

 

There are / were also some very good industrial loco photos on the Mendip Quarry website quarryfaces.org.uk including the one below showing a Sentinel being watered at Road Reconstructions Vallis Vale quarry loco facilities.  Apologies to the photographer if this infringes any copyright.  The website images and links appear to have broken recently and it doesn't appear the site is being maintained. 

Best regards,

Trevor

 

image.png.4086ade9c68dfd332b74527b49f6f76f.png

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10 hours ago, doilum said:

The hosepipe filling S134 was needed as Wheldale had been dieselized for a couple of years when Hunslet arranged their efficiency trial in the autumn of 1981. The harsh winter that followed saw steam in service until the following September as the diesels failed.

I hadn't thought of this before, but the hosepipe arrangement probably explains the bespoke ladders fitted to S134 and retained in preservation as "Wheldale".

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On 22/08/2020 at 09:11, doilum said:

I hadn't thought of this before, but the hosepipe arrangement probably explains the bespoke ladders fitted to S134 and retained in preservation as "Wheldale".

S134 had the two ladders at Primrose Hill colliery.

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9 hours ago, Respite said:

S134 had the two ladders at Primrose Hill colliery.

Sort of. They were simple ladders that curved round the tank top. By the time of the final fling at Wheldale they had developed the raised hand rail extension which is the loco's signature feature. The Preserved British Steam Locomotives website has a series of photos that illustrate the change. It appears that it lost its ladders during the 1971 rebuild and the ones seen in 1981 are a new fabrication. There is photo somewhere that shows S134 in store at Allerton Bywater colliery in the mid 70s. She is painted in a dull crimson base coat which suggests that the full rebuild across the road at Area Workshops was never quite finished. It would be interesting to see if the ladders are fitted. ( I would be grateful if anyone who knows this image would let me know of the source,).

That said, it is the only local austerity with ladders although S112 (the 50550) and several of the 15" Hunslet had a footplate to tank top vertical hand rail on the right side only.

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1 hour ago, doilum said:

Sort of. They were simple ladders that curved round the tank top. By the time of the final fling at Wheldale they had developed the raised hand rail extension which is the loco's signature feature. The Preserved British Steam Locomotives website has a series of photos that illustrate the change. It appears that it lost its ladders during the 1971 rebuild and the ones seen in 1981 are a new fabrication. There is photo somewhere that shows S134 in store at Allerton Bywater colliery in the mid 70s. She is painted in a dull crimson base coat which suggests that the full rebuild across the road at Area Workshops was never quite finished. It would be interesting to see if the ladders are fitted. ( I would be grateful if anyone who knows this image would let me know of the source,).

That said, it is the only local austerity with ladders although S112 (the 50550) and several of the 15" Hunslet had a footplate to tank top vertical hand rail on the right side only.

I have solved my own question. The book was " The last years of coal mining in Yorkshire" by Steve Grudgings, a mammoth personal photo essay. And, guess what? The present ladders were part of the 1971 rebuild!

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On 21/08/2020 at 10:04, Jack Benson said:

certainly no elaborate water crane

 

You will find a prototype for everything in industrial railways...

 

Barclay.jpg.910eb36a53be08c704ebd4684df10f91.jpg

 

Photograph taken towards the end of steam at Buckminster, South Lincs. with 15'' loco  AB2314 of 1951 SEWSTERN in attendance. 

 

Paul A. 

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