My First & Last Layout Project - Physical Progress at Last!!

[cctransuk]

1 hour ago, AndyID said:

You won't have to worry about voltage drop

 

Try googling 12awg copper or 12ga bare copper. There are lots of online suppliers in the US but maybe not in UK.

 

Precisely !!

 

Googling did the trick, thanks - I now know where to source my bus wire!

 

John Isherwood.

 

 

Edited September 6, 2020 by cctransuk

[DCB]

Builders skips are a fruitful source of mains cable.   I use car or van wiring recovered from scrap yards, 5 amp rated from lighting circuits mainly,  Lots of different colours, and I feel I am doing my bit to save the planet while saving myself a few quid to re invest in the layout.

I really don't like the sound of bare copper. It will short out sooner or later.unless supported at unfeasibly  close intervals.

[kevinlms]

17 hours ago, cctransuk said:

Nigel,

 

I have something similar, from Gaugemaster, thank you.

 

However, it seemed silly to pay for plastic insulation that I'd send to landfill, if it were possible to buy bare copper wire.

 

Regards,

John Isherwood.

But often this cable can be found for free, as loads of it gets used, or even ripped out of office buildings, as frequently the internal partitions get ripped out for alterations.

 

In fact I know of a building where ALL the internals got gutted, they been installed 6 months prior. Why? Because some moron hit a fire hydrant outside and knocked the top off a high pressure mains. For 3 hours the water went up 15 metres in the air and landed on the roof, which couldn't handle it and so flooded inside. The plasterboard walls & ceiling were completely saturated and needs to be replaced completely, along with all electrical & data wiring.

 

I hope the driver had good insurance!

[cctransuk]

5 minutes ago, kevinlms said:

But often this cable can be found for free, as loads of it gets used, or even ripped out of office buildings, as frequently the internal partitions get ripped out for alterations.

 

In fact I know of a building where ALL the internals got gutted, they been installed 6 months prior. Why? Because some moron hit a fire hydrant outside and knocked the top off a high pressure mains. For 3 hours the water went up 15 metres in the air and landed on the roof, which couldn't handle it and so flooded inside. The plasterboard walls & ceiling were completely saturated and needs to be replaced completely, along with all electrical & data wiring.

 

I hope the driver had good insurance!

 

Quite so - but obtaining and stripping in excess of 100 metres, in a timescale that fits in with the long-delayed plans of someone who is aged 70+, could be a challenge!

 

Time is an increasingly precious resource!

 

John Isherwood.

[kevinlms]

9 minutes ago, cctransuk said:

 

Quite so - but obtaining and stripping in excess of 100 metres, in a timescale that fits in with the long-delayed plans of someone who is aged 70+, could be a challenge!

 

Time is an increasingly precious resource!

 

John Isherwood.

I don't see a need to strip the whole lot, only the bits you need. I have successfully stripped 20mm gaps and wrapped droppers around and soldered to the bus.

Most of the insulation can stay put. You said you already had the stripping tool.

 

But obviously it's your call regarding time vs. cash.

[cctransuk]

6 minutes ago, kevinlms said:

I don't see a need to strip the whole lot, only the bits you need. I have successfully stripped 20mm gaps and wrapped droppers around and soldered to the bus.

Most of the insulation can stay put. You said you already had the stripping tool.

 

But obviously it's your call regarding time vs. cash.

 

I need to strip the wires so that it is possible to : -

 

support the seven wires at a constant but close distance apart using choc. block connectors;

 

make soldered dropper connections at any point; this will ensure that dropper connections to the bus wires are as short and direct as possible, and can thus be easily be traced.

 

John Isherwood.

[cctransuk]

On 02/09/2020 at 14:50, cctransuk said:

I am - after some fifty years procrastination, about to embark on what will be my first - and last - substantial model railway.

 

 

 

 

 

The design and costing of this project proceed apace; I anticipate having estimates by the end of the month, and garage conversion / baseboard installation is provisionally scheduled to commence immediately in the new year.

 

Some fundamental decisions have been taken - the cassette stock storage system is indefinitely postponed; primarily because kitchen base units with four 1000mm. wide drawers are twice the price of two units with 500mm. wide drawers. I anticipate that stock storage will be in two tier stacked trays, to fit within the 500mm. wide drawers. This will involve more stock handling than is ideal; but pragmatism (and the bank balance) rules!

 

 

 

As shown in the drawing, the layout has been divided up into colour-coded sections, but each of the 11 baseboards will be electrically independent, taking power from bus-wires fixed to the rear of the base units. There will be no inter-board wiring.

 

 

 

In this way, each baseboard will be capable of being hinged up to a vertical position for wiring / fault-finding purposes. Adjoining baseboards will be drilled for the eventual installation of coach bolts so that they can be clamped together. Thus it should be possible to ensure no differential movement between individual boards, which would be very detrimental to good running.

 

 

 

Point actuation will be mechanical from the baseboard edge, using slide switches and wire-in-tube to both set the point direction and switch the frog polarity.

 

With no central control panel, operator movement around the layout will be increased, but several plug-in points for walkabout controllers will be provided.

 

I have to admit that the development of what has hitherto been an armchair dream has provided new impetus, after what was increasingly becoming a rather boring routine of stock building towards no ultimate purpose.

 

John Isherwood.

 

 

Edited December 9, 2022 by cctransuk

[cctransuk]

Well, the builders started on the garage conversion promptly after the New Year, and are making rapid progress. Internal framing, floor, and ceiling are installed, as is the first fix electricals.

 

In the meantime, I have been doing as much preparatory work as possible. All the Peco Electrofrog points have been modified such that the blades are not reliant on contact with the stock rails for electrical continuity.

 

A pair of cased transformers have been built to provide the AC feeds to the controllers, and the walkabout controllers themselves, based on cheap Chinese voltage regulators, have been completed and tested.

 

As there will be a duplicate set of buildings, etc., in order to portray either S&DJR or Midland Mainline, I thought that I should get on with structure modelling. Various railway sheds and huts have been built; a Ratio goods depot is under construction; and the latest on the workbench has been the venerable (64 years old) Airfix Midland signalbox.

 

 

 

I have replaced the somewhat 'chunky' windows with Churchward Models etches, and added handrails around the exterior walkway. For such an ancient kit, I think that it scrubs up very well indeed.

 

John Isherwood.

Edited December 9, 2022 by cctransuk

[cctransuk]

Having spent the afternoon building an Airfix 'Country Pub', I decided to spend a spare half hour before dinner designing the signage.

 

As the layout will be able to portray, via alternative buildings, BR S&DJR; BR Midland Mainline and BR-LSWR (Cornwall), I came up with three alternative pub signs : -

 

 

 

I trust that those amongst us who miss their customary visits to their 'local' will approve.

 

John Isherwood.

Edited December 9, 2022 by cctransuk

[cctransuk]

On 24/09/2020 at 16:52, cctransuk said:

 

The design and costing of this project proceed apace; I anticipate having estimates by the end of the month, and garage conversion / baseboard installation is provisionally scheduled to commence immediately in the new year.

 

Some fundamental decisions have been taken - the cassette stock storage system is indefinitely postponed; primarily because kitchen base units with four 1000mm. wide drawers are twice the price of two units with 500mm. wide drawers. I anticipate that stock storage will be in two tier stacked trays, to fit within the 500mm. wide drawers. This will involve more stock handling than is ideal; but pragmatism (and the bank balance) rules!

 

 

As shown in the drawing, the layout has been devided up into colour-coded sections, but each of the 11 baseboards will be electrically independent, taking power from bus-wires fixed to the rear of the base units. There will be no inter-board wiring.

 

 

In this way, each baseboard will be capable of being hinged up to a vertical position for wiring / fault-finding purposes. Adjoining baseboards will be drilled for the eventual installation of coach bolts so that they can be clamped together. Thus it should be possible to ensure no differential movement between individual boards, which would be very detrimental to good running.

 

 

Point actuation will be mechanical from the basboard edge, using slide switches and wire-in-tube to both set the point direction and switch the frog polarity.

 

With no central control panel, operator movement around the layout will be increased, but several plug-in points for walkabout controllers will be provided.

 

I have to admit that the development of what has hitherto been an armchair dream has provided new impetus, after what was increasingly becoming a rather boring routine of stock building towards no ultimate purpose.

 

John Isherwood.

 

 

 

Five months have now elapsed, but the builders did start promptly after the New Year; and the garage / railway room conversion is now well advanced.

 

A complete, free-standing room-within-a-garage is now completed, with copious insulation between the original and new structures. First fix electrics are installed, as are wall storage cupboards down the two long sides. Today, the base drawer units were installed that will support the (hinged to the wall) baseboards; construction of which commences tomorrow. Second fix electrics are scheduled for Thursday. By the end of next week, all should be complete, bar the laying of floor covering.

 

Meantime, I have been keeping busy. Thirty-eight Peco Code 75 Unifrog points have been modified so as not to rely on point blade contact; and a similar number of tie-bar actuators have been fabricated from brass hinges and rod. All necessary wiring, switches and wire-in-tube actuating materials are in stock; and a considerable number of structure kits have been acquired, many of which are now assembled and await better weather for painting.

 

Once the builder moves out, (and I have reclaimed the contents of a storage container and relocated them into the new cupboards), tracklaying will commence. I am about to have the trackplans printed at 1:1 scale, so that the track centrelines can be marked-out. Point control; point switches and section switch locations have been plotted, and these will be transferred onto the electrical trunking that will form the front edges of the baseboards.

 

I have also built two controllers, based on Chinese voltage regulator modules, together with a pair of 15vAC / 50VA power packs that will supply the AC bus-bars. The AC bus-bars will be accessed at any of four pairs of plug-in points for the controllers, which will feed back to the controlled DC common return bus-bars, for connection via section switches to the running rails.

 

All of this is keeping me on my toes - though the real fun will start when the finished garage conversion is handed-over.

 

Photos soon!

John Isherwood.

[Harlequin]

Hi John,

It all sounds very exciting!

Is this topic morphing into a Layout Topic, not specifically about electrics any more?

 

[cctransuk]

3 minutes ago, Harlequin said:

Is this topic morphing into a Layout Topic, not specifically about electrics any more?

 

It is indeed - I will ask Andy to move it to the appropriate location.

 

Regards,

John Isherwood.

[Damo666]

On 24/09/2020 at 16:52, cctransuk said:

 

The design and costing of this project proceed apace; I anticipate having estimates by the end of the month, and garage conversion / baseboard installation is provisionally scheduled to commence immediately in the new year.

 

Some fundamental decisions have been taken - the cassette stock storage system is indefinitely postponed; primarily because kitchen base units with four 1000mm. wide drawers are twice the price of two units with 500mm. wide drawers. I anticipate that stock storage will be in two tier stacked trays, to fit within the 500mm. wide drawers. This will involve more stock handling than is ideal; but pragmatism (and the bank balance) rules!

 

 

As shown in the drawing, the layout has been divided up into colour-coded sections, but each of the 11 baseboards will be electrically independent, taking power from bus-wires fixed to the rear of the base units. There will be no inter-board wiring.

 

 

In this way, each baseboard will be capable of being hinged up to a vertical position for wiring / fault-finding purposes. Adjoining baseboards will be drilled for the eventual installation of coach bolts so that they can be clamped together. Thus it should be possible to ensure no differential movement between individual boards, which would be very detrimental to good running.

 

 

Point actuation will be mechanical from the basboard edge, using slide switches and wire-in-tube to both set the point direction and switch the frog polarity.

 

With no central control panel, operator movement around the layout will be increased, but several plug-in points for walkabout controllers will be provided.

 

I have to admit that the development of what has hitherto been an armchair dream has provided new impetus, after what was increasingly becoming a rather boring routine of stock building towards no ultimate purpose.

 

John Isherwood.

 

Hi John,

I've just found your thread, fascinating and I really like your detailed drawings. I'm in the process of slowly assembling my layout boards so that they can be easily (and quickly) stored in a purpose-made storage rack. The original storage system was precarious and I was fearful of damaging the boards and scenery.

 

Question about the room section drawings you've shown. Looking at the board in it's upright position I was assuming that there will be no scenery, this will be just a track layout, but your next post shows a signal-box. I know your 1st post says that you only intend to rotate the boards 45 degrees, and I know what designs get refined and improved, so maybe 90 degrees is the latest, but what about the scenery?

 

Apologies in advance if you've already answered this, I've only read the first few posts so far, and will come back to this thread later to digest the detail.

 

Edited February 24, 2021 by Damo666
Typo

[cctransuk]

On 24/02/2021 at 12:35, Damo666 said:

 

Hi John,

I've just found your thread, fascinating and I really like your detailed drawings. I'm in the process of slowly assembling my layout boards so that they can be easily (and quickly) stored in a purpose-made storage rack. The original storage system was precarious and I was fearful of damaging the boards and scenery.

 

Question about the room section drawings you've shown. Looking at the board in it's upright position I was assuming that there will be no scenery, this will be just a track layout, but your next post shows a signal-box. I know your 1st post says that you only intend to rotate the boards 45 degrees, and I know what designs get refined and improved, so maybe 90 degrees is the latest, but what about the scenery?

 

Apologies in advance if you've already answered this, I've only read the first few posts so far, and will come back to this thread later to digest the detail.

 

 

A perfectly reasonable question.

 

The layout will cover little more than the railway and its immediate infrastructure, but there will be scenery; ground cover, anyway. There will be buildings, too - in fact, such buildings as there are will be duplicated in most cases, to allow the layout to depict the S&DJR, the Midland Mainline, and SR / WR Cornwall; all in the late 1950s / early 1960s.

 

 

 

The buildings and other infrastructure will be removeable, and the builder and I have today established that the baseboards will be able to hinge up the full 90 degrees and be restrained there by spring catches. The primary purpose of the hinged baseboards is to permit a 70+ person to fit point actuation and wiring from a standing, or even sitting position, and to thus remove the need to fiddle around beneath baseboards.

 

Once the under-baseboard work is completed, I would hope that the need to raise the boards again will be extremely rare - and therefore, the need to remove buildings etc. should be equally infrequent. In addition, by having each board electrically and mechanically independent, a fault on one board will require only the raising of that board, and therefore the removal of buildings etc. will be very localised.

 

When you get to my age, you realise that the time left to you is finite, and the need to 'get on with it' makes any necessary compromise much more acceptable. The layout will be a pastiche of the several locations that it will represent, and the use of kit-built buildings is all part of 'getting on with it'.

 

In the end, all I want to achieve is somewhere to run my excessively large collection of models, but my accumulated knowledge of all things 1950s / 60s BR means that I will need to produce something that has as few anomalies as possible.

 

As a final note, you will see that the marshalling yard headshunt has been extended round to the fiddle yard, and is provided with a run-round loop at that end. This will allow the headshunt to represent a mineral branch in its Midland and Cornish manifestations; ironstone in the former case, and china clay in the latter.

 

Regards,

John Isherwood.

Edited December 9, 2022 by cctransuk

[Damo666]

Strangely, I seem to derive as much pleasure out of solving design problems as I do in making the solution or 'playing' with the trains.

 

I wonder if you were able to move the hinge point out from the wall by, say 75mm, and have the lift angle of 75 degrees, would you be able to retain the scenery (buildings, trees and 3D landscaping) and still access the underside of the boards easily?

 

Don't intend to put a spanner in the/your works, I know what it's like ready to move forward and then an alternative comes along, but just thinking about the ease of future access if it means less work in clearing the scenery.

[cctransuk]

32 minutes ago, Damo666 said:

Strangely, I seem to derive as much pleasure out of solving design problems as I do in making the solution or 'playing' with the trains.

 

I wonder if you were able to move the hinge point out from the wall by, say 75mm, and have the lift angle of 75 degrees, would you be able to retain the scenery (buildings, trees and 3D landscaping) and still access the underside of the boards easily?

 

Don't intend to put a spanner in the/your works, I know what it's like ready to move forward and then an alternative comes along, but just thinking about the ease of future access if it means less work in clearing the scenery.

 

The infrastructure removal is really a non-issue.

 

The hinges will be spaced off the walls by 18mm., which is sufficient to clear the track and cork underlay.

 

All such considerations are now academic; the specifications are set in stone, as the work has passed the point of no return.

 

John Isherwood.

[cctransuk]

The garage / railway room conversion was completed yesterday, with the laying of the floor covering.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

The conversion took all of January, February and half of March to carry out, but the results are all that I could have wished for.

 

It now stores all of the typical contents of a garage; DIY, garden, motoring, etc. accumulations; plus ALL of my model-railway related 'stuff' - completely out of sight. Moreover, I know exactly which shelf / drawer contains any specific item of rolling stock!

 

On the baseboards can be seen my 38-year-old, OO9 layout 'Tan-y-Mynydd'; ( and associated stock boxes); which has been refurbished and will this weekend be donated to a neighbour and his railway-mad Grandson.

 

Also to be seen is the stack of boxes containing the materials required to construct my new - and final - 4mm. scale / 16.5mm. gauge layout, loosely based on Evercreech Junction; (see above).

 

 

 

I look forward to being able to undertake the work in a dry, draught-proof, warm and well-lit environment. The fact that all ten baseboards will be electrically and mechanically self-contained, and hinge up to stand, (retained by spring catches), vertically against the walls under the wall cupboards, should make wiring-up and point actuating installation a seated and convenient task.

 

The under-cupboard lighting provides optimum illumination for both construction and, in due course, train operating.

 

All in all, money and time well-spent, and a pleasing culmination to a life's railway modelling.

 

(To give scale to the photos, the room measures 5.0 x 2.4 metres).

 

John Isherwood.

Edited December 9, 2022 by cctransuk

[cctransuk]

Steady, methodical progress.

 

 

Installation of the LV bus wiring is nearing completion. 2mm. bare copper wire is being used, supported by 'chocolate blocks', and threaded through 4mm. coloured PVC sleeving between supports. In this way, walkabout rectifier / controller sockets can be wired-in at any point on any board, and track section switches can be similarly locally sited on the 40 x 40mm. cable trunking which forms the front edge of each hinged board. There will be no physical or electrical inter-board wiring connections; each board will be autonomous.

 

 

Following no particular convention, the wiring code is :-

 

BLACK & BLUE - 15v AC; CONTROL CIRCUIT A

 

BROWN & GREY - 15v AC; CONTROL CIRCUIT B

 

RED - 0 to 12v DC POSITIVE; CONTROL CIRCUIT A

 

GREEN/YELLOW - 0 to 12v DC POSITIVE; CONTROL CIRCUIT B

 

WHITE - 0 to 12v DC COMMON RETURN; CONTROL CIRCUITS A & B

 

 

It can bee seen that the full-width cupoards at each end of the room are ideal for the storage of larger tools, (pillar drill, spray booth, etc.).

 

 

Similarly, the numerous drawers within the base units that support the baseboards; (plus the wall cupboards above); are ideal for stock storage.

 

John Isherwood.

 

 

Edited December 9, 2022 by cctransuk

[Adrian Stevenson]

Very nice indeed John, a room to be proud of.

 

Cheers, Ade.

[cctransuk]

54 minutes ago, Adrian Stevenson said:

Very nice indeed John, a room to be proud of.

 

Cheers, Ade.

 

Thanks Ade - well worth the extended design time!

 

John Isherwood.

[cctransuk]

Progress continues apace; most afternoons are devoted to layout building nowadays.

 

All under-board power supply and sectional feed wiring is now completed, and the cork sheet trackbed is glued down and sanded. The trackbed joints between boards are the minimum commensurate with the boards being able to be raised to the vertical, and are flush between boards.

 

The 1:1 track centreline plans were stapled over the trackbed, and the track centrelines were lightly cut through into the cork with a Stanley knife. The cut lines on the plans were then run over with a broad black permanent marker, which allowed a fine hairline of ink to be transferred onto the cork trackbed. These hairlines were accentuated with a black Sharpie pen once the plans were removed, and all is now ready for track-laying.

 

Exciting times - photos will follow when some track has been laid.

 

John Isherwood.

Edited June 5, 2021 by cctransuk

[cctransuk]

Some three months since I last posted - an indication of the intense activity of the intervening period!

 

The layout is now fully operational, though lacking any scenics other than a few unpainted buildings.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

You will see that my builder has done a superb job and that, quite apart from providing an ideal basis for the layout, the room provides storage for all my DIY tools and clutter plus all of my stock - in such a way that I can easily find anything. (It has to be confessed that the lap-top seen in some photos provides the stock storage index)!

 

You will also see that each board is hinged to the wall, and they are each clamped down at the front by two recessed hex-bolts. The lifting flap across the doorway is heavily hinged at the RH end, and secured by a pair of draw-bolts which carry the LV DC return current, such that nothing will move on the boards immediately adjacent to the flap when it is raised.

 

Each board is an electrically and physically separate mini-layout; the inter-board rail joints, which are merely cut through with a slitting disk, provide a satisfying 'clickety-click'. Each rail end is soldered to a brass panel pin, and this enables them to be 'tweaked' as necessary to provide optimum alignment. So far, such 'tweaking' is largely eliminating derailments, but no doubt further refinement will be occasionally necessary.

 

The linear, geographically-located control trunking carries the section switches, point control slide switches, controller sockets and 12V DC sockets for modelling power tools. Whilst such an arrangement precludes operation from a single point, a little exercise is no bad thing, and the controller flexible leads can be plugged-in at any of four locations; (there are flexible lead extensions available if needed).

 

Currently, rolling stock on the tracks has been selected mainly from North Cornwall locos and stock - in deference to our local friends who will celebrate the inauguration of the layout this forthcoming Saturday. (The chemical train, largely composed of ICI stock, is not really appropriate - but it is colourful and should appeal to the ladies)!

 

Anyway - that's it for the present; I feel that I am constructing a suitable 'roundy-roundy' on which to exercise the wheels of a lifetime's accumulated stock. The builder's handover of the railway room and baseboards was in early April, and the layout was commissioned last weekend. Not bad, I think, for some five months - I had set myself the target of trains running by Christmas!

 

John Isherwood.

 

Edited December 9, 2022 by cctransuk