Ray Von Posted September 6, 2020 Share Posted September 6, 2020 I'm 99% sure that I want to use beach sand as ballast on my current layout. I've seen several threads to recommend this idea too, but most advise rinsing and then drying. Now that the heatwave of summer is most likely behind us, I was wondering if it would be ok to bake said sand in the oven after it had been rinsed? Or would baking actually negate the need to rinse? Obviously sifting would still be advisable and I also intend to scour the whole lot with a large magnet, as to remove metal particles. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Premium Kris Posted September 6, 2020 RMweb Premium Share Posted September 6, 2020 I never baked the sand that I used for ballasting. I did make sure that I gave it a long time to fully dry out. Sifting is essential to get a uniform size as well as removing the excess rubbish. 1 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
eastglosmog Posted September 6, 2020 Share Posted September 6, 2020 Most beach sand is silica, which is perfectly stable at any temperature your oven is likely to reach. Best to dry at 105-110C. 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
bimble Posted September 6, 2020 Share Posted September 6, 2020 5 hours ago, Ray Von said: Or would baking actually negate the need to rinse? If it's beach sand you might want to rinse it to remove any traces of sea salt 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ray Von Posted September 7, 2020 Author Share Posted September 7, 2020 10 hours ago, bimble said: If it's beach sand you might want to rinse it to remove any traces of sea salt Is that a problem if the sand is locked up in PVA, just theorising really- can the salt then do much damage? I probably will rinse it, but it just occurred to me that it could be omitted if needs be?? Happy to be corrected tho! Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
GeoffAlan Posted September 7, 2020 Share Posted September 7, 2020 (edited) 20 minutes ago, Ray Von said: Is that a problem if the sand is locked up in PVA, just theorising really- can the salt then do much damage? I probably will rinse it, but it just occurred to me that it could be omitted if needs be?? Happy to be corrected tho! Yes, it may be a long term issue. The salt will pick up any moisture and corrode anything it can reach. A good rinse with warm water in a bowl, pour off the water and repeat as many times as you can before drying out. I know because, in my youth I made a sand table with sand illegally* taken off a beach, and any unpainted metal corroded. *IIRC It's still illegal! Better to invest a couple of quid on sand from the builders merchants. they'll have soft and sharp sands, soft has much smaller grains. Edited September 7, 2020 by GeoffAlan grammar 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ben B Posted September 7, 2020 Share Posted September 7, 2020 I used a bag of playsand from my local toy shop for a project last year, cost £2 and it was a nicely uniform size, no problem with salt either 2 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ray Von Posted September 7, 2020 Author Share Posted September 7, 2020 Have to admit to coming down in favour of purchased sand, for the reasons stated above. Anyone know what size bags they usually come in? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Premium boxbrownie Posted September 7, 2020 RMweb Premium Share Posted September 7, 2020 11 hours ago, bimble said: If it's beach sand you might want to rinse it to remove any traces of sea salt And anything else the doggies might leave behind 1 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Premium boxbrownie Posted September 7, 2020 RMweb Premium Share Posted September 7, 2020 Yes doggies......NOT doggers......I know your minds! 3 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Premium TheQ Posted September 7, 2020 RMweb Premium Share Posted September 7, 2020 32 minutes ago, Ray Von said: Have to admit to coming down in favour of purchased sand, for the reasons stated above. Anyone know what size bags they usually come in? 20KG approx, that will keep you going for years... I would recommend , Kiln dried sand, saves all the problems of drying... £4:90 from the big orange shed. 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ray Von Posted September 7, 2020 Author Share Posted September 7, 2020 1 hour ago, TheQ said: 20KG approx, that will keep you going for years... Yikes, that's a lot more than I think I'll need - maybe I'll tip what's left on the beach.... Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Premium TheQ Posted September 7, 2020 RMweb Premium Share Posted September 7, 2020 8 minutes ago, Ray Von said: Yikes, that's a lot more than I think I'll need - maybe I'll tip what's left on the beach.... knowing our stupid laws that's probably illegal too 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Premium Kris Posted September 7, 2020 RMweb Premium Share Posted September 7, 2020 The size of beach sand can be very variable, even from the same beach. Some beaches have very very fine sand. One thing you do get with beach sand that you don't get with builders sand is colour variation. When you look closely at sand from a beach is a fantastic variety of colours. Unfortunately most ballast is quite uniform in colour. 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
John Arkell Posted September 8, 2020 Share Posted September 8, 2020 Quite prototypical using sand as ballast if you are modelling the SE&CR or the LBSCR who both used beach shingle as top ballast. The SER and later SE&CR got theirs from a ballast pit at Dungeness and the LBSCR got theirs from the Crumbles at Eastbourne. It was not good as ballast as the rounded nature of beach ballast did not lock together well and was a factor in the poor track condition leading to the Sevenoaks accident in 1927 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Michael Hodgson Posted September 8, 2020 Share Posted September 8, 2020 Isn't there a risk that this stuff will not be secured 100% and some will get into mechanisms, damage commutators etc? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
devondynosoar118 Posted September 8, 2020 Share Posted September 8, 2020 (edited) Another vote for play sand or washed builders sand. I use sieved grey builders sand and play sand on my N layout, parts of which are 10 years old now, no corrosion, lifting or shifting has occurred. If you use PVA etc like normal ballast it never gets loose or falls off. You can also dye the PVA mix with inks to weather and tint the finish. The picture below shows track ballasted with building sand and the cess laid with play sand. I dried both fully in a low temp oven, then sieved and bagged the stuff for later use. Edited September 8, 2020 by devondynosoar118 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
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