Gill Head: Kirkby Luneside's neighbour

[Dragonboy]

Thinking about the sharpness of your blocks which makes them look newly laid - which they are of course, but I was wondering if brushing the stones with a wire brush would take some of the crispness off of the edges?

 

Maybe try on an expendable area if you think it might be worthwhile. 
 

Or of course you could try it on individual stones before laying ................. 

[Winslow Boy]

25 minutes ago, Dragonboy said:

Thinking about the sharpness of your blocks which makes them look newly laid - which they are of course, but I was wondering if brushing the stones with a wire brush would take some of the crispness off of the edges?

 

Maybe try on an expendable area if you think it might be worthwhile. 
 

Or of course you could try it on individual stones before laying ................. 

Are yes but knowing young Jeff as we do he would probably make a scale wire brush in order to properly portray his endeavours in providing an authentic experience for us his followers.

[Physicsman]

Some interesting comments and suggestions....

 

Colin, good idea - providing the structure is up to standard when finished.

Rob, the last time something similar was suggested was with regard to pre-colouring the tons of plaster in the KL2_Fell. Which became all but invisible under the grass cover. Same kind of thing here as the end washes over the whole viaduct will probably taint any colour I add to the slurry.

Dragonboy/Winslow Boy (would you like to volunteer names - ok, if not) - good idea. It would be great to rough the surface up on a small scale level. The problem is that air-dryed DAS is a fussy little bu99er on the scale of the blocks. Even light running with a finger, when applying the mortar, can sometimes break the faces off the stones. So I'll keep to minimum contact, other than mortar/paint for the present.

 

Thanks very much for the interest here. It's nice to know that I've got people all over the world thinking about what I'm building!

 

And Rob, I bet you never thought it would end up being glad with individual stones? If recommend the technique if time and patience is available.

 

Jeff

Edited December 12, 2020 by Physicsman
Adding "expletive" the forum removed!

[Winslow Boy]

1 hour ago, Physicsman said:

Some interesting comments and suggestions....

 

Colin, good idea - providing the structure is up to standard when finished.

Rob, the last time something similar was suggested was with regard to pre-colouring the tons of plaster in the KL2_Fell. Which became all but invisible under the grass cover. Same kind of thing here as the end washes over the whole viaduct will probably taint any colour I add to the slurry.

Dragonboy/Winslow Boy (would you like to volunteer names - ok, if not) - good idea. It would be great to rough the surface up on a small scale level. The problem is that air-dryed DAS is a fussy little on the scale of the blocks. Even light running with a finger, when applying the mortar, can sometimes break the faces off the stones. So I'll keep to minimum contact, other than mortar/paint for the present.

 

Thanks very much for the interest here. It's nice to know that I've got people all over the world thinking about what I'm building!

 

And Rob, I bet you never thought it would end up being glad with individual stones? If recommend the technique if time and patience is available.

 

Jeff

Now young Jeff matron says I'm not allowed to give my real name out on the interwebby thingybobs as their might be young women out there wanting to trick me into spending my hard earned pennies on them instead of on small metal things that run on parallel bits of metals or puff puffs as I like to call them. But as it's you it's Ian.

[Physicsman]

Hi Ian.

 

Thanks for divulging that piece of information. I assume you live in Winslow, so I've informed lots of young women to go knocking on doors in your area until they find you. Then it's no more puff puffs! 

 

Your RMweb name always reminds me of the Rattigan play that I studied at school, back in the mists of time. Nice to hear the term "puff puffs", too. Years since I heard that term, along with "choo choos". But then, on such an august forum as this, that's not unexpected.....

 

Thanks for your continued interest. And apologies to "matron" if I've caused a problem! 

 

Jeff

 

[Winslow Boy]

30 minutes ago, Physicsman said:

Hi Ian.

 

Thanks for divulging that piece of information. I assume you live in Winslow, so I've informed lots of young women to go knocking on doors in your area until they find you. Then it's no more puff puffs! 

 

Your RMweb name always reminds me of the Rattigan play that I studied at school, back in the mists of time. Nice to hear the term "puff puffs", too. Years since I heard that term, along with "choo choos". But then, on such an august forum as this, that's not unexpected.....

 

Thanks for your continued interest. And apologies to "matron" if I've caused a problem! 

 

Jeff

 

I am in deep doodos young Geoffrey. Matron has confined me to my quarters and I've had to sneak down to her office in order to post this. She is currently lying down in a darkened room having been confronted by lots of eager young women pounding on the home door. When asked what they were doing they kept saying that Geoff had sent them.

 

On a more serious note I too remember that play/film? and as an ex Winslow inhabitant as well thought it might work. I now recide much further north (200+ miles) though in the city of my birth, Salford. Please note the word city as we are in fact older than Manchester having obtained our royal charter several years prior to our more southerly neighbour.

[Physicsman]

Ian, just caught your post before heading off to add another 100 stones to the monstrosity.

 

I've no problem with Salford as a city. I regard myself as a Lancashire lad, though Barrow was thrown into Cumbria in 1973. I spent a couple of weeks on a pre-university course in Salford in 1975, though I ended up going to Leeds, among others. And numerous visits to Salford oops Man United over the years.

 

Apologies if matron is traumatised. Surely your new fan club makes it worth the effort!? And only my late-mam used to call me Jeffrey (note it's with a J). If I got the full name, rather than Jeff, I knew I was in trouble!

 

Right, PVA calls!!!!!

 

Jeff

[Winslow Boy]

2 minutes ago, Physicsman said:

Ian, just caught your post before heading off to add another 100 stones to the monstrosity.

 

I've no problem with Salford as a city. I regard myself as a Lancashire lad, though Barrow was thrown into Cumbria in 1973. I spent a couple of weeks on a pre-university course in Salford in 1975, though I ended up going to Leeds, among others. And numerous visits to Salford oops Man United over the years.

 

Apologies if matron is traumatised. Surely your new fan club makes it worth the effort!? And only my late-mam used to call me Jeffrey (note it's with a J). If I got the full name, rather than Jeff, I knew I was in trouble!

 

Right, PVA calls!!!!!

 

Jeff

Apologies Jeff with a J not a G for the incorrect nomeculture. My only excuse is that I was typing by torch light.

 

And on that note I bid you to go hither young man to hew several hundred more stones for the splendid edifice that we have come to know as Gill Head. Onwards came the cry.

[MarshLane]

18 hours ago, Physicsman said:

Hi Neil.

I think part of my resistance is because of the care and attention given to cutting and fitting the stones. However, the real structure has been in place for nearly 150 years and has suffered wear and tear. Besides, a bit of gunge into the stones adds a bit of surface texture that the DAS stones lack.

Jeff

 

I suppose the sharpness of the blocks could be dependent on the period being modelled - in this case I suspect it will look spot on when its finished ... you are modelling early Midland Railway in the 1870s aren't you???

 

2 hours ago, Winslow Boy said:

I am in deep doodos young Geoffrey. Matron has confined me to my quarters and I've had to sneak down to her office in order to post this. She is currently lying down in a darkened room having been confronted by lots of eager young women pounding on the home door. When asked what they were doing they kept saying that Geoff had sent them.

 

May be one be as bold to ask young Ian, when these eager women were 'pounding' on the door ... at which point did you realise it was the post man trying to wake you from the dream 

 

Rich

[Physicsman]

3 minutes ago, MarshLane said:

 

I suppose the sharpness of the blocks could be dependent on the period being modelled - in this case I suspect it will look spot on when its finished ... you are modelling early Midland Railway in the 1870s aren't you???

 

 

May be one be as bold to ask young Ian, when these eager women were 'pounding' on the door ... at which point did you realise it was the post man trying to wake you from the dream 

 

Rich

 

Rich, I'm guessing you were the one writing Jonathan Ross''s jokes, rather than material for Morecambe and Wise or The Two Ronnies?

 

And btw, Ian forwarded my address to the lovely ladies, so I'm expecting them at my door very soon. The postman has already been....

 

Good point about the time period.

 

Jeff

 

 

[Physicsman]

To add a degree of LEVITY to the proceedings, to lift matters out of the (Dandry) Mire and give us a (Dent) Head start, I've attached the expected views of the Monstrosity!

 

They say that Art(en Gill) reflects life, so here's the current state of my take on things.

 

300 more stones added today - the King pier seems to take ages to do.

 

Piers 3 and 4 have now been mortared - the slurry has done a decent job at filling gaps and has taken the edge off the bare stones without reducing the detail too much. Have a look at the western face of AG that I posted on page 1 - I'll put it on here for convenience. The stones are still clear after 150 years, but definitely not pristine.

 

Jeff

 

 

[MarshLane]

13 hours ago, Physicsman said:

Rich, I'm guessing you were the one writing Jonathan Ross''s jokes, rather than material for Morecambe and Wise or The Two Ronnies?

To coin a phrase, it was all the right info, just not necessarily in the right order and I didn’t have any fork handles! I know, I know ... this boys a fool!

 

Your work on the viaduct is looking great, Jeff. With the surroundings and backdrop it really will look amazing when completed. I always have an affinity with the S&C, aside from a great railway and stunning scenery, my great, great, great (I think it’s three) grandfather was one of the stone masons on the first viaduct north of Blea Moor Tunnel I believe. He travelled up there from Manchester and ironically after a couple of other subsequent jobs, ended up in the same area 100 years ago that the family moved to some 60 years later. Strange and stupid, but always feel like saying hello when I go over that viaduct!

 

Rich

[Rowsley17D]

Jeff, you're certainly capturing the strength, solidity and gracefulness of the original structure.

[Winslow Boy]

Jeff while in no way wishing to impugn your modelling abilities one of my fellow Gillers/headers/devoted followers?? - other descriptive terms are available did raise an interesting point, namely time setting. 

 

I appreciate that a considerable amount of discussion occurs about ensuring the features are correct for a time period but what about their appearance. I'm thinking here about what Arten Gill would have looked like. More knowledgeable contributors than I will be able to confirm  dates but I'm wondering what it would have looked like say 50 years or less after its construction. Yes there would have been some weathering but would it have been the same as what it appears today. Lets not forget that it would have appeared quite stark when it first appeared and would have stood out in such a bleak and harsh environment. 

 

As I said at the beginning this is not a criticism in any way of how you intend to 'weather' Arten Gill but just an opportunity to discuss the impact of time. The landscape into which the railway is set had evolved over thousands of years but it was only in the last two hundred that man had the resources to make significant and widespread impact.

 

Discuss.

Edited December 13, 2020 by Winslow Boy

[Physicsman]

Hi Ian.

 

To be perfectly honest, the weathering issue is not something I've really considered in the context of the viaduct build.

 

I'm applying a mortar slurry principally to fill any disproportionate gaps between the stones. My concern is that the mortar doesn't overly reduce the sharpness of the stones, the mortar isn't being applied to PRODUCE a weathered look.

 

The real viaduct is still relatively well-defined, as illustrated in the copious images on the internet. So as long as my edifice has the feel of the place, I'm more than happy.

 

My major grump as far as the build is concerned is that I didn't have space to model all eleven arches!

 

Jeff

 

 

[Jason T]

Blimey mate, you don't hang around do you? Last time I looked, there was a garage full of crap and now the track is going down and the viaduct (which is looking fantastic) is taking shape.

Good to see you are sticking with EM and all it's challenges (interesting ones). I would never go back to OO myself now.

[Physicsman]

5 hours ago, Jason T said:

Blimey mate, you don't hang around do you? Last time I looked, there was a garage full of crap and now the track is going down and the viaduct (which is looking fantastic) is taking shape.

Good to see you are sticking with EM and all it's challenges (interesting ones). I would never go back to OO myself now.

 

Evening Jason. Good to see you on here again.

 

You're right that a lot has been achieved in a relatively short time. No compromises have been made - in fact, things have gone together better than with the previous layouts. I guess that's experience!

 

You know how much I love my viaducts, so this was THE centre point of the whole project. Part of me regrets not running an end-to-end with the full length of Arten Gill stuck in the middle. Ah, well, you can't have everything.

 

As for EM, it was a no-brainer. One of your previous posts acknowledged that it's how everything LOOKS that really matters to me, with the railway just a subset of the whole landscape. So I'd much rather have the rails look right, whether anything runs on them or not.

 

About to download and post today's pics.

 

Jeff

[Physicsman]

It's 4 days since I last posted some pics. A few more stones have been added since then, and the total now stands at around 4000.

 

The arch liners have received 3 or 4 grey washes, along with a "pointing" wash. I realise the underneath of the viaduct is covered in all sorts of "crap" and a lot of the pointing is well and truly weathered off. But a light white wash accentuates the brick detail, and I like the way it looks - rather than a gloomy mass! The liners probably need a final touch up pointing wash (very dilute white acrylic), which may get done tomorrow.

 

I am also accumulating a pyrex bowl filled with my latest mortar sludge. It looks like the porridge that my dad eats, but I wouldn't fancy swallowing this!

 

Jeff

 

 

[Physicsman]

By the way, why this grey colour?

 

Its very difficult to judge the true colour of the real viaduct as it depends very strongly on the lighting conditions. The structure can appear almost golden in direct sunlight, but given that the prevailing weather in Dentdale is generally overcast, I've gone with a lightish grey.

 

As in these 2 images, taken under overcast skies....

 

Jeff

 

PS. It''s also a similar colour to the DAS goods shed I built in 2017, so best to be consistent!

 

PS PS The arch liner colour and good shed look similar in the Bunker. The pic I've shown below, with direct exterior lighting, looks much lighter - backs up my viaduct comment!

Maybe the second goods shed pic, actually taken in the Bunker, is more relevant...

 

 

Edited December 16, 2020 by Physicsman
Add PS

[Winslow Boy]

Jeff don't forget what I said about taking into account the difference in appearance between what you see know and the period you are modelling. Any weathering that we see today is the accumulation of hundred years plus. So what it actually looked like then will be different. My guess would be somewhat lighter in colour.

 

Cheers

 

Ian

Edited December 16, 2020 by Winslow Boy

[Andrew P]

Coming on splendiferously young man, simply splendiferous.

[Physicsman]

20 minutes ago, Winslow Boy said:

Jeff don't forget what I said about taking into account the difference in appearance between what you see know and the period you are modelling. Any weathering that we see today is the accumulation of hundred years plus. So what it actually looked like then will be different. My guess would be somewhat lighter in colour.

 

Cheers

 

Ian

 

Ian, very true. My viaduct is set in the mid-late 1960s, so about 50 years ago.

I've actually decided to lighten the grey base on the liners a bit, as I've just done a direct visual comparison of liner and goods shed, rather than looking at photos. The shed is subtly lighter.

 

An easy change which I'll do tomorrow.

 

Jeff

 

[Physicsman]

23 minutes ago, Andrew P said:

Coming on splendiferously young man, simply splendiferous.

 

Thanks very much, Sir Bodgit.

 

It's slow going but however long it takes....

 

I'll be having a break from piers in a few days to sort out some of the arch liners and fit a couple of arch rings. I have a method, but cutting out 40 voussoirs (as the arch stones are called - and the real thing has 60 PER RING)  and fitting them will tax my SPLENDIFEROUS patience!

 

Jeff

 

 

 

 

[figworthy]

For the colour, not sure if these help.  They are of Dent Head viaduct, taken on a dull day.

 

 

 

And one of Arten Gill from the road up the dale

 

 

Adrian

[Andrew P]

Bit like my walling on Bench Road, part of Seven Mills Sidings.