First time scratch building a locomotive.

[RAY NORWOOD]

I have started on the chassis useing 00.22" nickel silver. I used a pair of dividers to measure the depth of the chassis then marked that measurement onto a sheet of nickel silver and then scribed that line then put nickel silver into a set of banding bar bend the sheet of nickel silver till it snaps then I measured the length and did the same with the bending bars till it snaps, I did the same for the other main frame. I then soldered them together.

  I cut out the bits for the coupling rods out of 00.22" nickel silver, but this time I did four of them and soldered them two together for the two coupling rods, I will mark the two crank pin on them when I do the two main frames.

 

 

I blackened them all with a black marker pen so I can see all the markings.

 

That it so far. I will post more as work progress. 

[Michael Edge]

Drill the coupling rod blanks first and use them as a jig to drill the axle holes in the frames.

[RAY NORWOOD]

Hi Michael.  Thank for your advice i started marking out the driving wheel axle and had drilled them out so have done it the other way round.

[doilum]

1 hour ago, Michael Edge said:

Drill the coupling rod blanks first and use them as a jig to drill the axle holes in the frames.

Agreed. I have probably described this elsewhere but I start a scratch build with a coupling rod template made from scrap brass. The wheel spacing is marked out and drilled 1mm. All broken drills are saved and used to peg the template to the work. I am confident enough about this method to drill each frame and rod independently . One advantage of this method is that the template can be retained for a future repeat project, just remember to mark the front end.

[RAY NORWOOD]

I have measured and marked out the chassis as to the drawing. But it do not look right to me there do not have the depth in it. But that as it as in the drawing so must be right. 

 

This the chassis I have cut out, the two side are still soldered together. 

[pete_mcfarlane]

They are right. Don't forget that some of the frames on the real thing are above the level of the footplate - the photo shows what I mean:

https://commons.wikimedia.org/wiki/File:LSWR_M7_No.30053.jpg

 

The bits of the frame above the footplate are modelled as part of the loco body. 

[RAY NORWOOD]

20 minutes ago, pete_mcfarlane said:

They are right. Don't forget that some of the frames on the real thing are above the level of the footplate - the photo shows what I mean:

https://commons.wikimedia.org/wiki/File:LSWR_M7_No.30053.jpg

 

The bits of the frame above the footplate are modelled as part of the loco body. 

Hi Pete.  I can see what you mean. I just thought it strange that they look very narrow. With the body screwed on top would give the chassis more strength.   Thank you for that.  

Edited September 23, 2020 by RAY NORWOOD

[doilum]

Just a head up. Check the crankpin throw on the wheels you have purchased. For many years I had that "extra" set of wheels that wouldn't clear the footplate on an LNER N2. This will have the same challenge.

[RAY NORWOOD]

Update on the M7 scratch-building. 

I have marked out the brake hangers and drilled the frames for the brass wire to hold the brake hangers.

I also split the two main frames and used a brouch to open out the driveing wheel axie holes and soldered the brass bearings in please.

  

Next is to make the chassis spacers out of 00.22in nickel silver. 

[5050]

On 12/09/2020 at 16:53, doilum said:

It was a long time ago, early in my loco building journey!

Must have been a VERY long time ago if you got it at Unity Hall!  Oh, the joys of humping layouts into a small lift that constantly broke down (or using the long and winding stairs), the blizzards on Sunday night while  loading vans.  Such happy memories...............

[doilum]

3 hours ago, 5050 said:

Must have been a VERY long time ago if you got it at Unity Hall!  Oh, the joys of humping layouts into a small lift that constantly broke down (or using the long and winding stairs), the blizzards on Sunday night while  loading vans.  Such happy memories...............

But we were young and daft......

[RAY NORWOOD]

On 14/09/2020 at 20:38, DGO said:

Following the advice received my copy of Simon Boltons book arrived today, now if I could just find something about scratch building electric locos .... 

Hi DGO.

It's been a few day since you got the Simon Bolton book how do you find it. 

[DGO]

1 hour ago, RAY NORWOOD said:

Hi DGO.

It's been a few day since you got the Simon Bolton book how do you find it. 

 

More than a few days, I also got Building 00 Gauge Wagons for Model Railways by David Tisdale. 

 

Simon Boltons book might better be titled Building a 00 Gauge J15 Loco and tender from scratch as much of the book is dedicated to that, don't get me wrong theres plenty of good advice in there but of the 192 pages including index 132 are about building that one loco, a further 6pages on building it as an EM gauge 6 on building a diesel in no detail at all and the last 4 pages with a few words on S scale 2mm scale and a conclusion.

 

I would say that if you are planning to build a small to medium sized 00 gauge Steam loco that Boltons book would be an excellent purchase, for other larger steam locos I'd still say it has plenty of good advice, for anything else I'd say it has a lot of useful information on tool use etc but I'd only go that far, I've yet to find a good book covering scratch building diesel/electric locos, perhaps there's not a market for it, or maybe no one really wants to scratch build them I don't know.

 

David Tisdale on the other hand has a different approach, he starts off with kit building, then moves to detailing kits, them modifying kits and finally scratch building, I would say his book is probably a must buy for anyone planning to build their own stock in any way for any 4mm/3.5mm scale layout. He does not go into quite as much detail as Simon BUT the book is very well written and full of good advice.

 

Still looking for a good book on building small Diesel/Electric locos though at 00/H0 scale, maybe I shall have to write one myself LOL

[RAY NORWOOD]

Update on the M7.

I have cut out the main frame spacers from 00.22In nickel silver drilled holes in the centre for attaching the body and the is one for the trailing Bogie.

 

I have soldered the spacers on one main frame.

 

I then fitted the main frames into my chassis alignment jig with the rods at the end s of alignment rods. then solder the other frame to the spacers. 

 

Here is the frames assembled.

 

Next is the trailing Bogie. I made out of 00.22in nickel silver, I cut two pieces to the size of the side frames. Soldered the to together and then covered one side with a marker pen, then marked out the axle holes then drilled them out with a small drill and gradually increased the sizes to a 2mm hole. I then measured and marked out the shape, then cut out with a peaseing saw, then tied up with a file. The spacer is from 00.22 N. S, I made it 20mm x 11mm and drilled a hole in the centre to take a 8ba bolt, I then used a peaseing saw to make that into a slot so the Bogie would slide side by side.   

    

Here is the  Bogie asembled.

 

I am very pleased how this is turning out so far.

 

[Nig H]

If you need more information for your model you could try the South Western Circle,  https://www.lswr.org/. They have a number of drawings for bits of M7s. You may have to join to get them, but I'm sure they would be happy to provide information free if asked.

 

I found a series of articles that appeared in Model Railways in the 1970s invaluable for learning scratchbuilding techniques. They were by B Fesank and I think entitled, 'For locomotive building start here'. Much of the narrative was based on the construction of a Midland Railway 1F half cab. I've not seen the Simon Bolton book so I don't know how much of the material is duplicated in the two sources of information.

Nigel Hunt

[RAY NORWOOD]

Thank you for that Nigel. I am a member of the South Western circle not given it a thought of getting drawings from them.

Thank you.

[Darwinian]

I am impressed that you have got that chassis so square using simple flat spacers.

Using L shaped spacers can help to keep the frames parallel longitudinally and vertically while soldering them up.

But then maybe that wasn’t possible in this case.

 

Splendid progress so far.

[RAY NORWOOD]

Scratch Build M7. I have just finished the coupling rods. Earlier I had all the preparation. I marked out the rods and cut out the shape with a piercing saw then I used a file to finish of. I then used my soldering iron split the two rods. The bigger one was for the main frames, the small ones is for the rods.

 I did two lots as a precaution for going wrong.

 

The finished rods.

 

 

Edited October 22, 2020 by RAY NORWOOD

[georgeT]

Cracking job so far Ray, she will be up and running before you know it, keep the progress pictures coming...

[RAY NORWOOD]

It's been along time for an update on this build. I have made the compensation bar from brass and soldered on with 145 solder and added some other smal details.

The compensation bars I made out of 00.15 brass, I cut two pieces a little bigger than I need, soldered the two together I then used a black felt on one side then I marked out the shape then I rough cut the shape with a piercing saw AND finished of with a file to the final shape, I split them apart and soldered the in place      

 

I then blacken the bogie and chassis then painted them in mat black.

 For attaching the bogie to the chassis I used a 8ba bolt soldered to the chassis with a brass tube sleeve over the bolt then a spring and a large washer on top of the spring, the bogie goes on top of the spring it slides up and down on the brass tube the a small washer and a nut        The washer in the picture is the one that goes on top of the spring

 

Here is the chassis an the bogie.

 

The next two photos near completetion. I put the wheel on and the rods. Had to do a bit fetling on the rods to make it all run smoothly.  

 

 

I have ordered a High Levels motor and gearbox, waiting for them to come. That will be the next job then the bar to connect the bottom of the brake hangers, then the pick ups.

Edited November 13, 2020 by RAY NORWOOD

[RAY NORWOOD]

I have been working on the running plate. Made out of 00.22in nickel silver, I the cut the shape out from a sheet of N/S then used my maker pen to blacken one side to mark out the the cut out and drilled a hole on the inside he ilne of part to be cut out and I past the piersing saw blade through the hole, and cut that out. I then marked out the holes for attaching the body to the chassis and soldered a 8ba nuts over the holes.

The buffer beam is also out of 00.22in N/S, drilled the holes for the buffers and the hole for the screw couplings. Then soldered then in place.

Next is the valance. I cut two lengths x 5mm of 00.15in N/S and soldered then together then the black marking pen over the top and marked out the shape, then cut out with the pairsing saw then finish of with files. Then soldered then in place. 

The next job will be the cab ends.       

Edited November 21, 2020 by RAY NORWOOD

[DGO]

56 minutes ago, RAY NORWOOD said:

I have been working on the running plate. Made out of 00.22in nickel silver, I the cut the shape out from a sheet of N/S then used my maker pen to blacken one side to mark out the the cut out and drilled a hole on the inside he ilne of part to be cut out and I past the piersing saw blade through the hole, and cut that out. I then marked out the holes for attaching the body to the chassis and soldered a 8ba nuts over the holes.

 

Hi Ray I keep reading the sizes above and saying to myself, that doesn't look right, do you actually mean 0.022 inch or about 0.6mm or as you have typed 0.22 inch or about 6mm, because looking at your pics unless I'm going mad I think that Nickle Silver you are using is under 1mm unless Swan Morton scalpel blades have suddenly got a lot thicker ?

[RAY NORWOOD]

10 hours ago, DGO said:

 

Hi Ray I keep reading the sizes above and saying to myself, that doesn't look right, do you actually mean 0.022 inch or about 0.6mm or as you have typed 0.22 inch or about 6mm, because looking at your pics unless I'm going mad I think that Nickle Silver you are using is under 1mm unless Swan Morton scalpel blades have suddenly got a lot thicker ?

Yes it's 0.022in and the valance 0.015in  I have put the decimal point in the wrong place, sorry about that.

[DGO]

7 hours ago, RAY NORWOOD said:

Yes it's 0.022in and the valance 0.015in  I have put the decimal point in the wrong place, sorry about that.

 

No problem, it was just for a second that I thought I was going mad LOL

[97xx]

Not that I think you need any encouragement Ray, but this was an effort I made in my Dad's garage when I was 14 (in the 1970s), using hacksaws, files, hand-drills and I even recall soldering using a Tilley with a soldering iron bit!

 

Cheated with rolled plasticard boiler and firebox made from sheets (you can see it delaminating now). Smokebox door fashioned from car filler, and pin used as door hinge. Whistle and filler caps and vents fashioned from brass rod in electric drill.

 

Two photos:

• one as originally made with coupling rods cut from tin can and terribly basic pony trucks (sheet with U of plastic channel stuck on to hold axles)
• second with Lockdown Mods of new wheels, rods and milled brass pony trucks. Chassis was paint-stripped and all blackened chemically.

Aside lockdown prompting me to get it out and look at it again, major reason was that it ran horribly - a long 2-4-2T with short wheelbase was a TERRIBLE choice to scratch build - it yawed and nodded badly as it ran along, so new pony trucks have piano wire centring springs added, plus all the (completely unnecessary) sideplay in wheelsets has been removed.

 

Embarrassingly crude to look at but a great runner now and not too many about in 00...

Edited November 22, 2020 by 97xx