Modern signalling basics for 4 track operation with yard

[Dagworth]

22 hours ago, Flying Pig said:

 

 

 

 

 

That's really interesting to watch, are drivers taught now to lift the DSD as a recognition of the signals? I notice the DSD/vigilance bleep every time just before the AWS.

 

Andi

[St. Simon]

1 hour ago, Dagworth said:

That's really interesting to watch, are drivers taught now to lift the DSD as a recognition of the signals? I notice the DSD/vigilance bleep every time just before the AWS.

 

Andi

Hi,

 

No, I think it’s just coincidence that the DSD is bleeping just before an AWS Magnet.

 

Simon

[Dagworth]

1 minute ago, St. Simon said:

Hi,

 

No, I think it’s just coincidence that the DSD is bleeping just before an AWS Magnet.

 

Simon

Seems a strong coincidence that it does it for a long time, including after a station stop.

 

Andi

[St. Simon]

33 minutes ago, Dagworth said:

Seems a strong coincidence that it does it for a long time, including after a station stop.

 

Andi

You’re right, it is a strong coincidence, but certainly there’s no system set up like that. It is unnecessary as the AWS is a type of DSD, so you don’t need the DSD to check the driver is alert before going over a AWS. In fact, distractions purposely set up like that are discouraged by both unions and signalling engineers.
 

It is just pure coincidence that the signal spacing, train speed and timing of the DSD is combining so the DSD bleeps just before the AWS Magnet.

 

Simon

[Dagworth]

4 minutes ago, St. Simon said:

You’re right, it is a strong coincidence, but certainly there’s no system set up like that. It is unnecessary as the AWS is a type of DSD, so you don’t need the DSD to check the driver is alert before going over a AWS. In fact, distractions purposely set up like that are discouraged by both unions and signalling engineers.
 

It is just pure coincidence that the signal spacing, train speed and timing of the DSD is combining so the DSD bleeps just before the AWS Magnet.

 

Simon

I'm not suggesting it is a DSD function, more that it is - like I know happens in some other countries where drivers physically point at signals and state the colour shown out loud - a driver's memory aid to acknowledge to himself (and the OTMR) that he has seen and noted the aspect. 

 

I'm an ex-driver myself and we had little aids like putting your bardic on the top of the power handle if you were stopped at a platform with a red light in front of you. Helps prevent "Ding ding and away" spads

 

Andi

Edited September 17, 2020 by Dagworth

[St. Simon]

17 minutes ago, Dagworth said:

I'm not suggesting it is a DSD function, more that it is - like I know happens in some other countries where drivers physically point at signals and state the colour shown out loud - a driver's memory aid to acknowledge to himself (and the OTMR) that he has seen and noted the aspect. 

 

I'm an ex-driver myself and we had little aids like putting your bardic on the top of the power handle if you were stopped at a platform with a red light in front of you. Helps prevent "Ding ding and away" spads

 

Andi

The driver does not have any controls to make any train make that sort of sound, the sound you are hearing is the DSD system working. There’s no need for the driver to make the OTMR aware of them acknowledging the signal, as recording of the AWS Cancellation button does that.

 

The driver has to make their own sound for an aid memoir, there’s no in-built system for it.

 

Simon

Edited September 17, 2020 by St. Simon

[Dagworth]

58 minutes ago, St. Simon said:

The driver does not have any controls to make any train make that sort of sound, the sound you are hearing is the DSD system working. There’s no need for the driver to make the OTMR aware of them acknowledging the signal, as recording of the AWS Cancellation button does that.

 

The driver has to make their own sound for an aid memoir, there’s no in-built system for it.

 

Simon

I thought that lifting the foot off of the DSD on modern units caused the bleep to sound. There is no cancellation of the AWS on a green light.

 

Andi

[The Stationmaster]

14 hours ago, St. Simon said:

You’re right, it is a strong coincidence, but certainly there’s no system set up like that. It is unnecessary as the AWS is a type of DSD, so you don’t need the DSD to check the driver is alert before going over a AWS. In fact, distractions purposely set up like that are discouraged by both unions and signalling engineers.
 

It is just pure coincidence that the signal spacing, train speed and timing of the DSD is combining so the DSD bleeps just before the AWS Magnet.

 

Simon

And it doesn't happen at every AWS magnet - such as the stop at Rugby.

[Flying Pig]

I have a faint memory of seeing the subject of deliberate DSD operation discussed before, but it was probably in the comments of a cab view on Youtube so will not be easy to find.  If anyone wants to search, I would start with Don Coffey's videos as he is a driver and tends to answer questions in the comments.

[DY444]

On 17/09/2020 at 19:36, St. Simon said:

Hi,

 

No, I think it’s just coincidence that the DSD is bleeping just before an AWS Magnet.

 

Simon

 

It's not a coincidence, it's the driver resetting the DSD.  I don't know what the approved technique these days is but back before OTMR and all the rest of it, some drivers would reset the DSD at regular intervals to prevent it going off at random.  One typical technique was to do this as the train approached the AWS magnet for a signal displaying a green aspect.  The AWS magnet acting as a regularly occurring reminder.  Years ago I had some cab rides on Eurostar and some of the drivers used to reset at every Repere.