Penlan Posted October 13, 2020 Share Posted October 13, 2020 I have a L&Y CCT kit from a long time ago and I can't find the livery details. A search of the web found that most L&Y NPCS were : Light brown or tan upper panels (often described as a brownish orange) and 'carmine lake' (a dark rather brownish red) lower sides. Is this correct? and is there an illustration somewhere of a CCT? Many thanks in anticipation. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Steamport Southport Posted October 13, 2020 Share Posted October 13, 2020 (edited) This is L&YR carriage livery. https://kwvr.co.uk/locos/lancashire-yorkshire-railway-coaches/ https://lyrtrust.org.uk/ I'll have a quick check but I think the NPCS were the same. But possibly some were in the dark colour. The horsebox here looks one colour. https://lyrs.org.uk/Carriages Jason Edited October 13, 2020 by Steamport Southport Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wickham Green too Posted October 14, 2020 Share Posted October 14, 2020 Most railways with a two-colour carriage livery used just one colour on NPCS which wasn't of carriage profile ........ the dividing line could get rather messy wandering over different stanchions ........................................ an' it makes it a lot easier for us modellers not having to mask the damned things ! Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Penlan Posted October 14, 2020 Author Share Posted October 14, 2020 15 hours ago, Steamport Southport said: This is L&YR carriage livery. https://kwvr.co.uk/locos/lancashire-yorkshire-railway-coaches/ Many thanks, that gives me a good idea what the colours are. I've now tracked down a photo from* 'Noel Coates Collection', which shows a CCT in two tone Works Grey before being properly painted. The kit has a plate half way up (or down) the right hand side of the doors for which I can't find any photo's of on anything L&Y. * 'Lancashire & Yorkshire Miscellany 2', page 53, a book I didn't know I had till looking for something else 'Wickham Green too' - Yes I agree, why couldn't it just be plain sort of 'smokey brown'. I had to make some name plates for a boat in the Village Harbour a few years ago, it was from a long line of boats that had all been called 'Pandora', Pandora 1, etc., I was instructed to write/paint/carve 'Pandora Too' Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
jwealleans Posted October 14, 2020 Share Posted October 14, 2020 There's a picture of a CCT (may even be two) in the blue NPCCS drawings book by Peter Tatlow. It's quite clearly in a two-tone livery. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Penlan Posted October 14, 2020 Author Share Posted October 14, 2020 6 minutes ago, jwealleans said: There's a picture of a CCT (may even be two) in the blue NPCCS drawings book by Peter Tatlow. It's quite clearly in a two-tone livery. I definitely don't have that book, but many thanks for the info., Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Penlan Posted October 14, 2020 Author Share Posted October 14, 2020 (edited) To follow on from the above, there's a plate on the side of the CCT which I assume must have been in the instructions for the Kit - Am I now on the right topic area? What lettering went in/on here? I have instructions for just about every kit I've bought since the mid 1960's, but there seems to be at least one missing, this one. Edited October 14, 2020 by Penlan Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
jwealleans Posted October 14, 2020 Share Posted October 14, 2020 Was this a Micro Models kit? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Penlan Posted October 14, 2020 Author Share Posted October 14, 2020 No, it's a 4mm D&S Models, their ref: DS 559. 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Penlan Posted October 14, 2020 Author Share Posted October 14, 2020 I'm going over to another Forum 'Kitbuilding & Scratchbuilding', As I think I've now moved down to Kit level. 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Premium Andy Hayter Posted October 14, 2020 RMweb Premium Share Posted October 14, 2020 Just to throw a spanner into the works: Jason's link looks pretty conclusive that the livery was one colour. However if you look at some of the other images, it is difficult to see a clear distinction on passenger carrying stock between the lake lower area and the tan upper and in one case, on my screen at least, impossible. This suggests that some films in some lighting conditions had difficulty in distinguishing between the two colours. By chance this morning I was reading through the LYR Society Magazine 224 for summer 2005 (I recently bought a job lot) and there on page 11 is a picture of the Lanky Kits Dia. 118 CCT in two tone livery. Now of course we all know, model the prototype not a model, but this had been built by Barry Lane - the man who signed off the LYR HMRS transfers for the LYR. He could of course have been wrong but I think it unlikely. The article references back to the LYR Platform No 30 - which I do not have, but there may be more information there. One further possibility is that many companies simplified their liveries between 1914 and 1918 and maybe the LYR did the same with its NPCS. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Penlan Posted October 15, 2020 Author Share Posted October 15, 2020 11 hours ago, Andy Hayter said: Just to throw a spanner into the works: Jason's link looks pretty conclusive that the livery was one colour. However if you look at some of the other images, it is difficult to see a clear distinction on passenger carrying stock between the lake lower area and the tan upper and in one case, on my screen at least, impossible. This suggests that some films in some lighting conditions had difficulty in distinguishing between the two colours. By chance this morning I was reading through the LYR Society Magazine 224 for summer 2005 (I recently bought a job lot) and there on page 11 is a picture of the Lanky Kits Dia. 118 CCT in two tone livery. Now of course we all know, model the prototype not a model, but this had been built by Barry Lane - the man who signed off the LYR HMRS transfers for the LYR. He could of course have been wrong but I think it unlikely. The article references back to the LYR Platform No 30 - which I do not have, but there may be more information there. One further possibility is that many companies simplified their liveries between 1914 and 1918 and maybe the LYR did the same with its NPCS. Many thanks, I don't have any of the L&Y Magazines, but with the cross reference to the 'Kitbuilding &......' replies too, I believe I have enough info to complete the CCT - It will be in two tone livery, as the layout is circa 1910. Again thankyou for your time and information. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Penlan Posted October 15, 2020 Author Share Posted October 15, 2020 Just to round out this query, I have posted this reply on Social media web site, where I had also raised this query 'Multi-Asking With help from a couple of replies on RMWeb, we've found a photo of a very similar thing on a Horse Box via the L&Y Soc, web page for Coaches - The L&Y Soc's web pages are not working at this very minute, so I can't do a link. What can be seen in this cruel enlargement is there appears to be either a label pocket at the top, or a large clip, if a Label Pocket, then I assume (always dangerous) that the area underneath would be for chalked instructions etc., Thank you 'One and All' for looking at this posting. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold adb968008 Posted October 16, 2020 RMweb Gold Share Posted October 16, 2020 https://www.lyrs.org.uk/Wagons it seems to be pretty consistent that the wagon label, or vehicle “return to” instruction is on the body, not the chassis, and is on the right hand side. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Penlan Posted October 20, 2020 Author Share Posted October 20, 2020 Many thanks to those who've given guidance both here and on another thread. We are almost done now, couplings a bit of trimming and another joins the (extensive) fleet. And just for the record..... 6 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
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