Whatley Quarry in 4mm OO Finescale 1988-92

[lyneux]

I'm long overdue a topic on my mini version of Whatley Quarry that I started nearly 10 years ago. I hope it's not too late to start something!

 

This layout started off life as a little more than a shunting plank, built in a spare bedroom of a small London flat to run some of the aggregate stock that I had been working on. Since then, it's had a mega fiddle yard added (one of Tim Horn's first commissions) and has managed a couple of friendly exhibitions in the South East.

 

Most of the stock has been either scratch-built, kit-built or modified ready to run. I'm now in a position where a lot more stock is suddenly about to hit the market (Dapol JHA, 59s, Accurascale PTAs) that will improve greatly the number of trains that I'm able to run on the layout and that has piqued my interest in getting the layout finished and hopefully getting it out on the exhibition circuit properly once this horrible covid situation is over.

 

The layout is still small enough that I can set it up at home in the living room for a running day and I have the scenic section (all 6ft of it) permanently up and available in my modelling loft room. The current plan (following feedback from friends) is to extend it with the addition of another pair of 6ft boards to include a representation of the 'snaking' quarry reception sidings all the way up to Murder Coombe Tunnel.

 

The research element has been fascinating and I've made about four or five trips to the real location and have amassed around 1000 photos of the location from the period that I am modelling it (1988-1992). I have to say a big thanks to all the people (you know who you are!) who have helped me with my research on this forum and within DEMU without whom the layout wouldn't be in the state it is in today. The ultimate plan is to only run stock on it that I have photographic evidence for that ran to Whatley during the period. However, in order to have enough trains running, I'm also (for the moment) including Foster Yeoman stock from the period as well. Although not strictly prototypical, this adds a bit of operational interest and colour.

 

The photos below were mostly taken at the layouts first show at Broadstairs, Kent back in 2018 although I have many shots of the layout over the past 10 years.

 

I'll use this thread to provide a few updates on the stock that I am doing for the layout.

 

Guy

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

[newbryford]

Almost as much yellow as mine - although yours is a dirty mustard shade.........................

[lyneux]

Here's a couple of overall shots including the fiddle yards from Lydd Rail a few years back (no comments please about the size of the fiddle yard... it's built for long aggregate trains with expansion in mind!):

 

 

 

 

 

[JDW]

Looks excellent, I've always wanted to do something similar but it'll never happen! I've all on to build the one I've got now. That said, a couple more cheap Hornby/Lima ARC "PTA"s arrived the other day to add to my rake - not the most realistic but they look the part behind a 59 with a bit of detailing and weathering at least, and secondhand ones are often to be found reasonably cheap!

 

I look forward to seeing more of the layout as it grows, and the stock.

[pitbull1845]

Looks amazing  I've seen pictures of it before on other sites, but it still looks very impressive. 

[Stan68]

Goodness me that looks amazing!

[rob D2]

Wow,that’s great !

[lyneux]

Thanks everyone for the kind comments!

 

One of the features of the prototype location is a retaining wall made from gabion baskets. These 4mm versions are made from etched stainless steel by Brian Hanson at Shawplan. They are filled with talus and tied closed with single 0.1mm strands of multicore electrical wire carefully separated and tied together with two pairs of tweezers.

 

I'm not sure I've seen these modelled before.

 

Below are a couple of shots from the layout construction.

 

Guy

 

 

 

 

Edited October 24, 2020 by lyneux

[Steadfast]

Hi Guy,

The layout looks as good as ever! There have been times the Yeoman stock has worked into Whatley, when I was working down there Merehead had some work done that reduced it's capacity, so for a couple of weeks a few trains came out of Whatley. It did look weird seeing O&K hoppers in there! 

I like the sound of extending it down to Murdercombe, it'd be cool to see the old green shunters cabin in the trees! If you do want any assistance with the positioning of the cabin, stop boards, stream or anything drop me a message. I'm not sure how you'll model the pheasants walking along the track though!

 

Jo

[Revolution Ben]

 

Hello Guy,

 

Thanks for posting this thread - for a variety of reasons I'd not actually seen the layout with the fiddle yard all together.  The gabion baskets are really lovely!

 

cheers

 

Ben A.

[lyneux]

Thanks for the comments both!

 

Regarding the Yeoman stock, I was aware of it working in more recent times to Whatley but during the period that the layout is set (88-92) I think it was much less likely?

 

For the extension, I'm not going to have the space to do both the top and bottom loops so I'll have to rationalise them into a single set of loops but I'll try to get in the cripple road and wagon shed road. Rest assured, a representation of your cabin will got put in too Jo! The intention was to add scenery to two of the curved boards in addition to one of the straight boards but this will require a bit of re-working of the track plan. I got as far as sketching up a tentative track plan a year or so ago that I've attached (just the 4 boards that represent the extended scenic section).

 

I'd be interested to see how you think this would work operationally Jo? I think it has most of the main elements but is just missing the crossovers outside of the cabin that split the roads into 'Top' and 'Bottom' as well as the River Road.

 

Guy

Edited October 25, 2020 by lyneux

[KeithMacdonald]

That's a lovely layout!

 

For anyone interested in the history of the quarries, and the amazing variety of minerals in the area:

https://www2.bgs.ac.uk/mendips/more_info/east_mendip_quarries_history.htm

 

 

[lyneux]

A few words about the photo back-scene which was made and fitted retrospectively after exhibiting the show at Lydd Rail where I realised that I wasn't going to be happy with just a painted blue background.

 

I visited the location a couple of times to try and get the photos I needed. Access is tricky and given the wooded nature of the deep valley, it's impossible to be far enough away to photograph the trees as a panorama using a standard lens length (circa 50mm). Thus I ended up using a composite of photographs shot from on or near the road bridge coupled with photographs of the tree-lined (and nearby) Fairy Cave quarry (where I happened to be doing some climbing one summer).

 

These shots were stitched together and test-fitted to match the various full and low-relief scenic elements on the layout until I was happy with their positioning. I then blended any 'hard' lines between photographs in photoshop making judicious use of feathered selections and the clone tool to chop bits of tree and position them accordingly to fill the spaces.

 

I printed the shots on a laser printer first (A3), test fitting them several times and then making a final template that was cut and shaped to fit. The final print was sent away and done on proper photographic paper. When this arrived, I placed the paper template over top, traced around the line and cut the lower edge to fit the scenic ups and downs.

 

The moral of this story: plan the back-scene and fit it before you start work on the scenics! I've got lots more photos of trees from the area as well as from Fairy Cave so hopefully this will be enough to continue the back-scene for the planned extension.

 

I still need to complete the vegetation on the embankment at the back of the layout but at this stage might wait for the extension before doing this so it feels 'blended together'.

 

Guy

 

Edited October 25, 2020 by lyneux

[BR Blue]

It looks really good Guy. Cannot wait to see it in a post Covid exhibition.

[Steadfast]

Morning Guy,

All in all not a bad shout, looks pretty good to me!

First thing to understand operationally is where the stop boards are, particularly those at the tunnel end. I've marked them on the track plan and included a photo. Basically the quarry engine will leave the train far enough inside these boards that a mainline loco can drop on top without going past the stop board. There may be a third stop board just out of shot to the left, in the hedge. Memory says so, but it's not in any photos of mine. 

 

The hedge road and run round roads are both used for departure, trains can only arrive on the middle road, so keep this one clear! I learned the hard way...

Green and red lines are suggested locations for trains brought out the quarry. Once at a stand, quarry loco cuts off and comes back up the middle. Shunt on signal W285 needed for this, routed towards the catch point. Sometimes empty wagons are left on middle road, quarry engine can push these into the quarry.

Make sure to leave enough room behind the red train (run round road) to allow a loco to get off shed and onto the middle road to drop down to the front of the wagons.

Assuming you're putting an engine on the hedge road, it will drop down either the middle or the run round as far as the stop board. Shunter rings signalman and gets a shunt on W285, again towards the spur. You will get 2 x 59/60/66 between the handpoint adjacent to W285 and the end of the spur.

If the run round is blocked, then your loco will have to pull down behind the wagons (remember me saying about leaving a loco length at the rear?) then reverse onto the middle road, before carrying on down the middle to the stop boards. All these move usually stop to pick the shunter up at the cabin, unless instructed otherwise. You can go middle to run round without a shunt on the signal.

 

I've added in orange a potential location that i think the River Road siding could be added should you wish to use it to add interest. It's mainly used to store excess good wagons, but cripples get chucked in there too. Usually a jumbled mix of hoppers and boxes.

 

Additionally, if you have room the river is very characteristic of the location, so may be a nice addition. It runs under a culvert alongside the shed, coming out next to the tunnel end of the wagon shops. 

 

Finally, for anyone not familiar with Whatley, it really is rural, this was the view from the shunter's cabin window one afternoon, taken on my phone so he really was close! You can add deer, many many pheasants, ducks and ducklings, otters, owls, rabbits and fish to the wildlife I've seen at Whatley.

 

Hope this helps Guy

 

Jo

 

[Southwich]

Good to see a topic on here Guy - it’s an absolutely stunning layout. I’m surprised I haven’t seen it in the flesh yet! 
 

I assume it’s an extension of Whatley as opposed to a P4 test plank? 
 

Looking forward to seeing more!

 

Will

[lyneux]

Jo, that's a massive help! Thanks very much. I really like your graphical additions to the track plan too! Thanks Will and Eamon for your interest and comments too. Unfortunately, it will remain OO!

 

Clearly, I'm going to need trap points and you're right, if I have space, the river road would make sense too. The river is definitely part of the plan and it's my intention to drop the height of the baseboard by a few centimetres at the front of the layout to accommodate this. That's an easy job for the new straight board (as I can build this in), but it might require a bit of 'rebuilding' of the re-purposed curved boards to achieve this. I'll try and dig out my track plan and show what I mean.

 

You've explained well the sequence for departures. I assume that arrivals are fairly simple? Train arrives in the centre road. Loco goes off to the shed. Shunter brings out loaded train into departure roads and then propels empty train into the quarry? If the run around is free of a train, I guess the shunter could attach onto the head of the train but propelling moves seem to be more common, right?

 

Also, the two signals by the bridge: are these ever used?

 

Thanks,

 

Guy

[Steadfast]

Hi Guy,

Glad to hear the water will feature! Re looking over it, I realise I've drawn the River Road too far down, it stops a bit before W285, but you get the idea!

Here's a good video I've found on Youtube, hopefully helps explain what we're talking about to people not familiar with the place.

First up, the Switcher drops down the run round. This means they can cross onto the middle to follow the train up without phoning the signalman for a shunt. Also the hand points tunnel end of the yard are sprung to lay set for the middle by default, so the switcher can drop down and come back up without getting off the loco.

Once the train stops at the stop board, the 59 is cut off (with an ease up so the shunter can get the coupling off, not often needed to be modelled!) and sent to shed.

The switcher pushes up and the train is split on a buckeye coupling. It drops back slightly so is no longer foul of the point.

Then the 08 comes up with some good wagons to make the set longer, presumably for a different terminal. 08 out the way, the switcher propels the set up for loading.

 

Your arrival idea is pretty much there, I'll run through the whole process just so I'm less likely to miss anything.

Arrivals.

Train stops at shunters cabin stop board on middle road. Can either go top of middle or top of hedge, as required by the quarry shunters. With your compression, I'd just say stay on the middle road. The stop board is just the tunnel side of the shunters cabin if you wanted to add it.

Train carries on, shunter aboard up to second stop board (as marked on map). Shunter cuts loco off, loco pulls forward towards the bridge and then crosses over to shed.

The quarry loco can go on either end of a set - they can push or pull both empty and loaded. It tends to depend on requirements due to what roads are full. There's 5 roads in the quarry, one is intended to be kept clear but not always possible if busy, hence propelling from the exchange siding may be a necessity.

On a hauled set of empties, the quarry loco would probably be waiting near the road bridge. Once the mainline loco is cut off and out the way, he'll drop on top and take the empties in, one of the quarry staff checking doors are shut as the train rolls by.

Hauling up, taken at the lower stop board by the shunter's cabin

Pushing up, just past the same cabin

 

The switcher (presumably the same pre switcher too) tends to sit around here, it's close to the quarry staff's cabin (adjacent to the wagon shops) and is far enough in to release the loco off the middle road on arrival without the switcher being in the way. Usually about a loco and a half clear of the point, so if a train came in double headed I'd have to get them to move the switcher towards the quarry slightly. Often drops onto the wagons as soon as the main line loco is out the way an onto shed.

 

Further wildlife! They're bathing in the track outside the wagon shops. The 59 is sat on shed.

I've never seen the signals by the road bridge in use, but the earliest I visited in a work capacity was 2015. If I remember, I'll ask some of the older hand drivers if they know when I'm next in work.

 

@lyneux Guy, post updated 17.45 with pics and vid!

 

Jo

Edited October 26, 2020 by Steadfast

[lyneux]

Makes perfect sense Jo and good to watch the video to see it in action. I never saw wagons being added into a rake (during the times that I visited) so that was good to see.

 

I think I can probably model most of those moves with the layout as it is at the moment (although some if it is 'off-scene'). That's also starting to give me a feel for where I might need uncoupling magnets as well.

 

It makes me want to add my own video of those moves being conducted on the layout!

 

I definitely need to add puddles. I've got a few breeding pairs of mallards painted and ready to add once the puddles are in. Ducklings might be a bit too small though!

 

Guy

[barrowroad]

Hi Guy,

 

What a superb piece of modelling!  It sent me searching for photos I took around the same period of your model.

I have a number taken from that bridge and also during several visits to Murder Combe of the tunnel and track layout  including the ARC sentinel and Class 56s.  When I can get access to the scanner [ my wife is using it rather a lot] I will post some on here.

 

Robin

[D6775]

This looks fantastic. I had a good look round both quarries in 1994 on a RTCS trip with my Dad. Was very interesting at the time as my Dad worked for ECC and you could tell the guy showing us round could tell he knew too much about the quarry industry from the questions he was asking! These may not be any use (and they're pretty crap).

 

 

 

 

[lyneux]

Hi Al,

 

They’re great photos, thanks for posting. I’m always on the look out for new material from the period so it’s really refreshing to see some new views that I haven’t seen before. There are always small details that you notice in the shots such as the way the shunter is riding on the steps of the Thomas Hill or the collection of plastic barrels on the running plate.

 

If they are from 1994 then I guess it must have been early on in the Mendip Rail joint venture. Nice to see 59005 on shed (no pun intended!).

 

Robin, thanks for posting too. I’d be very excited to see what you managed to photograph when you were there. Shots of mainline BR locos operating in the sidings and shed are fairly rare from the period so keen to see what your photos turn up!

 

Thanks again,

 

Guy

[Rivercider]

That already looks an impressive layout even at current size.

 

During 1991 - 1992 I was working as the Operations Clerk for West of England Freight at Westbury,

dealing with paperwork including incidents and accidents. Mixed trains of bogie hoppers/tipplers with a tail portion of PGAs ran quite frequently. On two or three occasions during my spell there a train became parted due to broken coupling in the PGA portion at Spring Gardens where the line runs through a dip.

 

cheers

 

[D6775]

12 minutes ago, lyneux said:

Hi Al,

 

They’re great photos, thanks for posting. I’m always on the look out for new material from the period so it’s really refreshing to see some new views that I haven’t seen before. There are always small details that you notice in the shots such as the way the shunter is riding on the steps of the Thomas Hill or the collection of plastic barrels on the running plate.

 

If they are from 1994 then I guess it must have been early on in the Mendip Rail joint venture. Nice to see 59005 on shed (no pun intended!).

 

Robin, thanks for posting too. I’d be very excited to see what you managed to photograph when you were there. Shots of mainline BR locos operating in the sidings and shed are fairly rare from the period so keen to see what your photos turn up!

 

Thanks again,

 

Guy

 

No probs, have found my Dad's pictures too and they're dated, it was 29/06/94 & there were ARC liveried loco's on Merehead too. As you say, pretty sure it was the first year of common pools at least for the loco's.

 

Last of my shots then three of Dad's from slightly different angles. 

 

 

 

[njee20]

That's stunning, Guy, wonderful! I've said before that your pictures (of the model and the real thing!) really helped with my N gauge JHAs, great to see them 'in situ'!