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Great Central Railway Class 5A - LNER J63


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I have to say that so far I am very impressed. I am usually really slow at building things but around 3 hours work as us to this stage. The spacers are only tacked in one side and the other frame just clicks on and it would be hard to assemble it anything other than square.

 

Rob, your tips about the other two spacers came in very handy. They would still be on the fret now as I wouldn't have worked out what they are or where they go. There look to be two more potential frame spacers, etched in cut outs on the thick footplate layer. Any thoughts on them? They don't have part numbers. There is only one slot left, beneath the bracket for the brake cylinder, so maybe they go there.

 

Anyway, thanks for the hints and tips so far.

 

20201119_170935.jpg.9b8c1fd56d10705eae18fd7959e11eae.jpg

Edited by t-b-g
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I can honestly say that I have never got a loco to this stage so quickly.

 

The motor and gears, with a slight move of the motor mount to get the mesh right, are quiet and smooth and I see little point in replacing them with a more expensive option.

 

20201119_204051.jpg.4dcb609a7e3a1172f541e1dbb3ffb214.jpg

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40 minutes ago, Rob Pulham said:

Hi Tony,

 

I am surprised that you have a couple of spacers spare, you have put them together in pairs?

 

Hi Rob,

 

I am not even sure if the bits left on the etch are frame spacers but they are the right width and have a small tab on each end, just like the rest.

 

They are just a plain, rectangular, long and thin strip with a tab at each end and no part number. There are two, which could mean they should be laminated into one thicker bit.

 

The workshop is closed for the night but I will take a photo tomorrow and post it here to see if you can tell me if I have missed something.

 

Cheers

 

Tony

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Hi Tony,

 

My equivalents are still on the foortplate etch and having looked at the sheet that shows the layout of all the parts they are close to part 006 and I wonder if they are there to beef up 006 should it be needed. As you say no part number or mention of them in the instructions.

 

I have had a look at the chassis on my J63 and I can't see them on that either so I can only surmise that I didn't fit them on that, or not to the chassis...

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8 minutes ago, Rob Pulham said:

Hi Tony,

 

My equivalents are still on the foortplate etch and having looked at the sheet that shows the layout of all the parts they are close to part 006 and I wonder if they are there to beef up 006 should it be needed. As you say no part number or mention of them in the instructions.

 

I have had a look at the chassis on my J63 and I can't see them on that either so I can only surmise that I didn't fit them on that, or not to the chassis...

 

Thanks Rob,

 

I don't seem to have a parts list for the etches or the general layout of the parts view in the instructions. Mine just say that there is one etched sheet that has been cut up to fit in the box and leaves it at that.

 

It seems that if they don't get fitted anywhere it isn't going to be a disaster!

 

I may fit the remaining known bits to the frames and see if there are any empty slots that look as if they should have something in them.

 

There is a mention in the instructions of some parts "To support the rear end of the motor if necessary" or suchlike, so maybe that is them.

 

It is the sort of thing that used to really bother me when I was starting out. I would be concerned that I had done something wrong or had misinterpreted the instructions. Now I just think that if I find out what it is for, that is fine, if I don't that is fine too.

 

Cheers

 

Tony

 

 

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Not really relevant to the thread but while browsing for the photos I had gathered together on J63s, I found some shots of my first build, which was to 4mm scale, P4 standards.

 

35657247_07Oct2009371.jpg.68fd910e777afb2298bc5d63096e5615.jpg

 

1254231209_07Oct2009339.jpg.832dfb315d2e31005d9e5ecb430a252d.jpg

 

1552694449_07Oct2009416.jpg.4ebf27d4299ec249bbcbec115aa3c3c7.jpg

 

At the time, no kit was available, so it was being scratchbuilt.

 

Since then, I have built one more in 4mm from the Judith Edge kit for a client and have a part built one for myself.

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Very nice,

 

my very first 7mm loco build was a scratch build and I am slowly gathering the bits and pieces to scratch build myself an LNER P1

 

I will scan the etched sheet list and send you a copy.

Edited by Rob Pulham
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6 minutes ago, Rob Pulham said:

Very nice,

 

my very first 7mm loco build was a scratch build and I am slowly gathering the bits and pieces to scratch build myself an LNER P1

 

I will scan the etched sheet list and send you a copy.

 

Thanks Rob.

 

An LNER P1 would be quite a "beast" in 7mm. The late Malcolm Crawley scratchbuilt one on 4mm but he cheated a bit and used quite a few etched kit A1/A3 bits as templates to mark out the parts, to help him get the boiler and firebox shapes just right. 

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Hi Tony,

 

I am plan to cheat even more I have a resin boiler/smokebox from the Hachette flying scotsman to use on mine and I am on the lookout for a cab that isn't going to need a second mortgage - to say that they only paid 50p for issue one some of these eBay sellers are right chancers...

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21 hours ago, Rob Pulham said:

Hi Tony,

 

I am plan to cheat even more I have a resin boiler/smokebox from the Hachette flying scotsman to use on mine and I am on the lookout for a cab that isn't going to need a second mortgage - to say that they only paid 50p for issue one some of these eBay sellers are right chancers...

 

That resin boiler unit will certainly give you a big head start on the project.

 

I haven't been in the shed much yesterday so little progress but a trial fit of the compensation beams suggests that the vertical straps on the springs may need filing back to allow some movement. I may put the pivot pin through from the inside to allow a flush finish on the outside too.

 

The instructions are not very clear in a number of aspects! If you fit the bearings into the beams first, you can't get them past the springs and into their slots. Just for once I worked that out before I soldered the bearings in, which makes a nice change.

 

I am wondering if the vertical front spacer might be better the other way up. I don't think the real locos had a cut out like the one in etch. They seem to have a solid line across the lower front edge. The cut out might be more useful at the top, when fitting a coupling hook.

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Hi Tony,

 

Have you fitted the spring layers either side of the frames? I did initially but took them off and moved them all to the outside f the frames because I couldn't get the beams in and out when fitting them.

 

If you  do that you will be able to get the bearings in okay.

 

I fitted the beam pivot from the inside too.

 

I haven't done much in the way of construction today, It been spent trying to get the chassis running after modifying the Derek Mundy crankpins. I am still tweaking it because it runs fine forwards at the minute but in reverse it unscrews one of the front crankpins so there is something not quite right.

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1 hour ago, Rob Pulham said:

Hi Tony,

 

Have you fitted the spring layers either side of the frames? I did initially but took them off and moved them all to the outside f the frames because I couldn't get the beams in and out when fitting them.

 

If you  do that you will be able to get the bearings in okay.

 

I fitted the beam pivot from the inside too.

 

I haven't done much in the way of construction today, It been spent trying to get the chassis running after modifying the Derek Mundy crankpins. I am still tweaking it because it runs fine forwards at the minute but in reverse it unscrews one of the front crankpins so there is something not quite right.

 

The spring overlays are not fitted yet but will go on the outside when they do. I found that the compensating beams wouldn't slide into the slots if the bearings were already in. I just couldn't get enough tilt or angle on them to get rather thick bearing "hat rim" past the layers of springs that are part of the main frames without forcing them.

 

It isn't a problem, just a case of getting the order of construction right. Fix the beams in, then solder in the bearings.

 

I had the motor, wheels and one layer of coupling rods all running sweetly with power to the motor today, which is odd when the frames are still not firmly soldered together. One frame is still just clicked into place and so are the compensating beams and bearings yet it all works when I didn't expect it to.

 

I have fitted the Slaters crankpins. I know some people are not keen but they are like what I am used to in 4mm, so I will try them and be willing to replace them if they give me trouble. I will make some new retainers, as the washer and nut supplied are not very elegant. Turning new ones up on the lathe and drilling and tapping the centre doesn't take long and will look more like the prototype. Hopefully, mine will be thinner than the ones provided, which may help the clearance behind the crosshead. I can't quite work out why the rods have an extra half etch thickness at the front, where clearances are tight but are thinner at the back, where there is plenty of room, so I may take the extra half etch layer off the rod at the front and be willing to recess the retainer into the rod if necessary. 

 

I have now started on the coupling rods, having split them to pivot on the correct joint, as you have shown above.

 

I have to say that so far, I am really enjoying the build. It is intricate and complex but very rewarding.

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7 hours ago, Rob Pulham said:

Hi Tony, 

 

I am sure you will be fine with the Slaters crank pins. I used them on mine without issues. 

The axles bushes on both that I have done had very thin rims

 

The crankpins seem fine. I have heard that people have had problems with them shearing off but that was with big locos on heavy trains. Not a problem for this little "baby".

 

I have been playing with the lathe today and have made pivot pins for the articulated rods and retainers for the crankpins, which I copied from the 4mm Alan Gibson version, which looks about right for a J63. The rods have been laminated, cleaned up and had some "corks" added from 0.5mm wire. I also thinned down the back of the Slaters brass coupling rod bearings. All in all, I think I have "bought" enough clearance but we will find out in the next few days when the cylinders etc. go on.

 

DSCN3090.JPG.c2f57fcde156f0898450825b25128be3.JPG

 

DSCN3089.JPG.f1f807626e8e230c9b11a95e5ab9cd67.JPG 

 

I am really enjoying this one! 

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That looks good to me Tony, 

 

I have managed to get my chassis running smoothly to today, a couple of tweaks to the front on one side and the middle crank pin on the other just taking a small amount off each until I had the tiniest bit of sideplay in the joints of the coupling rods. 

 

Once I had that I connected the power via the motor leads and it runs like a good one. 

 

I now have it running in and have made a small start on the footplate but nothing worth taking photos of.

Edited by Rob Pulham
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1 hour ago, Rob Pulham said:

This hadn't finished uploading when I replied earlier

 

https://youtu.be/QDBUtobGelE

 

 

Looking good Rob. I like the rolling road set up. I don't have anything like that in 7mm, just a yard of track to run up and down but I have a set of rolling roads for 4mm and they are very useful for running things in.

 

I may need to make/purchase a 7mm set.

 

 

 

 

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Hi Tony,

 

Mine came as part of the Hobby Holidays Chassis Jig, which is the bit in the background that it's sat on.

 

If I have any sort of criticism it's that the rollers are a fraction too far apart making some locos wobble around a bit on them. One of these days I will get around to moving them inwards. 

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11 hours ago, Rob Pulham said:

Hi Tony,

 

Mine came as part of the Hobby Holidays Chassis Jig, which is the bit in the background that it's sat on.

 

If I have any sort of criticism it's that the rollers are a fraction too far apart making some locos wobble around a bit on them. One of these days I will get around to moving them inwards. 

 

I have been looking at my 4mm ones and they will open up wide enough for 7mm, so I was pleasantly surprised.

 

The rod, the other retainers and pin for the other side were made today and we have a runner!

 

I did try adding a video but the technology is beyond me. My tablet saves videos as MP4 files and they are not allowed.20201123_213125.jpg.6a77ecfc1250673e7efa6b3ded21cf07.jpg

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Hi Tony,

 

You would need to upload your MP4 file to YouTube or Vimeo etc. and link to it from there. Mine is hosted on YouTube.

 

Aside from the sparse instructions the kit is very well designed. In fairness, it should be because Garth was taught to draw in CAD by Dave Sharp of MOK. If you ever build an MOK kit, you will note many similarities to this one with the crisp tab and slots that allow you to do much of the construction dry fitted before committing to solder.

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3 hours ago, Rob Pulham said:

Hi Tony,

 

You would need to upload your MP4 file to YouTube or Vimeo etc. and link to it from there. Mine is hosted on YouTube.

 

Aside from the sparse instructions the kit is very well designed. In fairness, it should be because Garth was taught to draw in CAD by Dave Sharp of MOK. If you ever build an MOK kit, you will note many similarities to this one with the crisp tab and slots that allow you to do much of the construction dry fitted before committing to solder.

 

The design is right up there with the best I have seen. You are right, some more helpful instructions and I would be saying that it is probably the best kit I have built in terms of everything fitting well.

 

I only remembered after running it that the spacers are still only soldered to the frames on one side. The other was just clicked into place.

 

I will have a little pause now as I tend to work on a few things at the same time and another task is due some attention.

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1 hour ago, t-b-g said:

 

 

 

I will have a little pause now as I tend to work on a few things at the same time and another task is due some attention.

Mine too as I am only working on it at weekends,  the J6 is taking my attention during the week.

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A little progress to report over the weekend. The connecting rods, crossheads, slidebars and the front and back plates for the cylinders are all done.

 

With no work at all, she runs quite smoothly but the clearances and play on crankpin and in the pistons are virtually non existent. That is something I quite like as I would rather have a kit that doesn't need lots of making holes bigger to make it go but I will just ease some of the slightly. I like to be able to just wiggle things slightly with tweezers, rather than them be a working but tight fit.

 

20201130_120303.jpg.99f6f5423a07198b68c25d45ba9a35d7.jpg

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