Hornby Stanier 4P decoder I.D.

[philsandy]

Just bought a Hornby Stanier4P 2-6-4 T DCC fitted (R2637X).  On the program track the manufacturer code is 255, so this is an ESU?  The version is 012, can anyone tell me what type of ESU decoder this is.

[Nigelcliffe]

No,  ESU will be manufacturer ID 151     

255 is probably an error, or a decoder which doesn't support reading back that CV.  

 

- Nigel

[RAF96]

255 means the decoder is not being read.

Hornby Hobbies is code 048. CV7.

CV8 value 012 indicates it is v1.2

 

If loco is old then it is possible the factory fit decoder is a very old and unreliable R8215 decoder which should be binned. Some versions can be read-back in Reg mode. Such decoders may have a red or white spot or none on the MCU.

 

Later factory fits were the NMRA complaint v1.3 R8249 8-pin or derivatives with 4, 6 or 7-pins (Edit) ... which will read back in any Service programming mode, except Operate (PoM) obviously.

Edited November 14, 2020 by RAF96
More info as indicated

[melmerby]

From new it would have been fitted with a Hornby R8215 decoder*, which does not meet NMRA specification and it won't work with many DCC systems.

You need to bin it and put another decoder in.

 

* I also bought a decoder fitted Stanier tank, it wouldn't work with my Lenz system'

I took it back and the shop tried it on their basic Bachmann EZ controller where it also didn't work.

They tried the other one they had in stock and that didn't work on their controller either.

 

Quite why Hornby produced a decoder that didn't work is anyones's guess.

Edited November 14, 2020 by melmerby

[philsandy]

5 minutes ago, melmerby said:

From new it would have been fitted with a Hornby R8215 decoder*, which does not meet NMRA specification and it won't work with many DCC systems.

You need to bin it and put another decoder in.

 

* I also bought a decoder fitted Stanier tank, it wouldn't work with my Lenz system'

I took it back and the shop tried it on their basic Bachmann EZ controller where it also didn't work.

They tried the other one they had in stock and that didn't work on their controller either.

 

Quite why Hornby produced a decoder that didn't work is anyones's guess.

 

Thanks for all your replies.

I don't know how old the model is, but I bought this still in it's unopened box. It runs very smoothly using NCE Powercab, although on one occasion it would not respond when I kept pressing the emergency stop.  

Are you suggesting these decoders are only 100% on Hornby's own DCC controller?

[Nigelcliffe]

If it works, you have the option to leave it alone.   But, if it doesn't work reliably, its the decoder that's the problem, not your control system.  

 

A coloured dot on the decoder may help identify it from a couple of candidate old Hornby decoders.  

 

- Nigel

[Pete the Elaner]

1 minute ago, philsandy said:

 

Thanks for all your replies.

I don't know how old the model is, but I bought this still in it's unopened box. It runs very smoothly using NCE Powercab, although on one occasion it would not respond when I kept pressing the emergency stop.  

Are you suggesting these decoders are only 100% on Hornby's own DCC controller?

 

If it is an R8215, then yes, it may only work with a Hornby system.

My first DCC fitted loco had one of these & only ran in 1 direction with my Powercab. I bought the loco a couple of years after the decoder had been replaced by the R8249, so I guess they were using up old stock.

Since then, I treat anything "DCC fitted" with suspicion. If I have a choice, I will always buy the DCC ready version & fit a decoder I trust.

[melmerby]

22 minutes ago, Nigelcliffe said:

If it works, you have the option to leave it alone.   But, if it doesn't work reliably, its the decoder that's the problem, not your control system.  

 

A coloured dot on the decoder may help identify it from a couple of candidate old Hornby decoders.  

 

- Nigel

I think even Hornby consider the R 8215 decoders below par.

When I contacted them about my non working loco (I kept it as it had by then been discounted by the retailer due to the duff chip) they asked the colour of the paint splash on the controller chip (blue I think).

They kindly sent me 2 x R8249 FOC as replacement.

[philsandy]

43 minutes ago, Nigelcliffe said:

If it works, you have the option to leave it alone.   But, if it doesn't work reliably, its the decoder that's the problem, not your control system.  

 

A coloured dot on the decoder may help identify it from a couple of candidate old Hornby decoders.  

 

- Nigel

 

Just had a look now, a white dot.

I wonder if it's worth contacting Hornby and asking for a replacement. I only got it yesterday, and as I said it does run well, but the fact that it would not respond on one occasion when I kept pressing the emergency stop suggests it's not reliable.

[Nigelcliffe]

You could ask, but as comments appear to suggest this model is around 10 years old, quite how far back do you think Hornby's open-ended support should extend?  

 

If you bought it "as new" then your claim for not-functioning properly is from the retailer (standard UK consumer rights stuff).   
Anything you ask from Hornby is a good-will freebie.   Personally, I think asking about free parts in a 10 year old toy train is pushing it. 

 

Searching websites and forums will reveal what "white dot" means in terms of older Hornby decoders.  

 

A quality new decoder will cost about £20.  

 

 

- Nigel

 

[melmerby]

I wouldn't bother trying to get Hornby to sent a R8249 as a replacement or bothering the retailer.

If you like the loco and didn't pay over the odds I would just buy a new new decoder, having a fitted decoder probably didn't make much differnce to the selling price*

It's a decent loco and should perform well with a new decoder.

 

This is what I have in my 2 Stanier Tanks:

https://www.dckits-devideos.co.uk/index.php?route=product/product&product_id=277&search=decoder&page=3

 

It's a similar price to the Hornby R8249 and is vastly superior.

 

* looking on ebay there isn't any significant difference in selling prices on S/H ones.

Edited November 14, 2020 by melmerby

[philsandy]

8 hours ago, Nigelcliffe said:

You could ask, but as comments appear to suggest this model is around 10 years old, quite how far back do you think Hornby's open-ended support should extend?  

 

If you bought it "as new" then your claim for not-functioning properly is from the retailer (standard UK consumer rights stuff).   
Anything you ask from Hornby is a good-will freebie.   Personally, I think asking about free parts in a 10 year old toy train is pushing it. 

 

Searching websites and forums will reveal what "white dot" means in terms of older Hornby decoders.  

 

A quality new decoder will cost about £20.  

 

 

- Nigel

 

 

I don't know how far back it goes for "toy trains", as I stated in my second post I don't know how old the model is.

[Pete the Elaner]

12 hours ago, Nigelcliffe said:

 as comments appear to suggest this model is around 10 years old.

 

I've just googled the model number & found a thread on Hornby's forum asking about the decoder. The chat was back in 2011 & a comment suggests the model was a couple of years old by then.

It therefore sounds very likely that you have their original decoder which was discontinued for a good reason. I had no hesitation in binning mine.

 

Hornby's R8249 used to be ok value when it was £8, but now it's price has risen to more than double that. There are alternatives at a similar price which give better running & more adjustability.

[melmerby]

8 hours ago, Pete the Elaner said:

 

I've just googled the model number & found a thread on Hornby's forum asking about the decoder. The chat was back in 2011 & a comment suggests the model was a couple of years old by then.

 

All the details are here:

http://www.hornbyguide.com/class_details.asp?classid=149

 

My "Dcc fitted" M7 tank was from a similar time and also had a R8215 decoder, likewise it too was replaced.

 

I will never buy a fitted loco again, you can get better elsewhere at less cost.

Edited November 15, 2020 by melmerby